Football in America - bring your checkbook!

[alexspepa]

Curious to get the UK slant on this, and I'm talking about the youth game here, not ticket prices.

Talking to my neigbor the other day, and he has a daughter in Challenge(?) soccer, and he pays from 5-10K a year for travel, coaches, etc.

How are we going to get the best players to play if we are eliminating kids who cannot afford that kind of money? Seems to me that the reason soccer is so popular all over the world is because all you need is a ball and you can play, but not in the US.

OK...late night rambling, and if it does not belong here, I'm sure you will let me know.

COYS!

[Danners9]

The popularity of the game is through it's simplicity. Kids in africa with barely enough food to eat have something resembling a ball to play with.

Sport should be about inclusion, making people pay to play automatically limits who is able to take part - or will take part, some won't even if they can afford it. The higher the cost, the fewer people will take it up. It becomes more about who can afford it rather than who enjoys it. Which is a great shame.

[KHowe]

That's ridiculous. I can see paying alot for hockey, just my equipment was ridiculously expensive nevermind the ice time, but soccer shouldn't be anywhere near that much.

[the_killer]

shutup you amerikakai!!!

[Danners9]

One of my friends had his hockey gear stolen a few months back, $2000 worth of stuff.

Top class equipment is expensive here too. Boots for £120, shin pads for £30, replica shirts for £40-55 and more if you want names and numbers on the back. Those are adult prices of course, kids ones are probably about half-price. But I was wearing adult sized equipment from the age of 13, and I bet the majority of boys were the same.

But you don't NEED the best equipment. The boots don't make you a better player, not really. It's an image and status thing. But you do need the transport, and enrollment fees and they are $10,000 ish already then that's a huge fee to lay out just to get to games!

[peridigm]

Curious to get the UK slant on this, and I'm talking about the youth game here, not ticket prices.

Talking to my neighbor the other day, and he has a daughter in Challenge(?) soccer, and he pays from 5-10K a year for travel, coaches, etc.

How are we going to get the best players to play if we are eliminating kids who cannot afford that kind of money? Seems to me that the reason soccer is so popular all over the world is because all you need is a ball and you can play, but not in the US.

OK...late night rambling, and if it does not belong here, I'm sure you will let me know.

COYS!

What age is this? At first I thought this is way too high, but after you factor in travel expenses and hotels for away tourney's it is very possible. My son also plays travel soccer. You don't have to pay a ton of money to get great coaching. Some clubs partner with a local college who provides trainers to youth teams for one night a week. This trainer works with the kids but also works with the coaches if they need it.

[alexspepa]

She is around 13-14 years old now, but they have been involved for several years. The problem is that in order to develop skills at an early age, you have to play on one of these challenge teams, and the costs are very high. Most other sports, other than hockey, have much lower cost leagues where skills can be developed at an early age.

[KHowe]

She is around 13-14 years old now, but they have been involved for several years. The problem is that in order to develop skills at an early age, you have to play on one of these challenge teams, and the costs are very high. Most other sports, other than hockey, have much lower cost leagues where skills can be developed at an early age.

That's robbery! I hate it when coaches act like the only way that these kids have a shot at making it in a sport (whether to gain a scholarship or professional), is by joining their program for the low cost of x-thousand dollars. I'm sure they know their shit, but c'mon are they really teaching you something worth that amount of money? I don't blame you if you put your kid through it, when children want something they'll usually find a way to get it out of you (from my perspective when I was a child :) ), but I feel your pain (though I'm a few years away from having any children myself, I can only imagine costs when that day comes). If it were me, I'd order a bunch of those instructional DVD's...

[Danners9]

When I was 6yrs old I wanted to play, more than anything in the world. We found out when the local side was practising and went along to speak to the coach. They were all 2yrs older than me but let me play anyway. Something like £3 per training session.

One team I joined wanted a payment of about £200 upfront for all the match fees, that didn't go down well at home.

Top coaches can make a difference but I found the main influence on my game was playing every school lunchtime, after school and pretty much whenever I could.

I did a training camp when I was 15 with the Toronto Lynx :D, the coaches were players with the side and they were good but I was better - but smaller, and they admitted as much. Not surprising considering my background really, 9yrs already by that age.

My advice to the girl in the Challenge program would be to play whenever and wherever you can, even if it means playing against boys or people older and not to worry if they are better at the moment. In England the teams are grouped by age, but in Holland they are grouped by ability - this breeds young people able to mix it with bigger and stronger people as well as a superior technique from being around similarly able people.

Those fees sound like a scam though, to be honest. Is the service provided really worth $10,000??

[alexspepa]

When I say $5000-10000, I'm including coaches fees, league fees, travel expenses and tournament entry fees.

If it is a scam, it is a nation-wide one. USSoccer endorses these leagues, and I believe much of their revenue may in fact come from them (but I could be wrong on that).

My point was that in other countries, football is the "everyman sport", but here in America it is an elitest sport similar to golf, and only open to the upper middle class if you want your child to excel in the sport. We have thousands of entry level leagues, and the sport is very popular at ages 5-8, but then the fees start to rise drastically if your child has any talent.

I don't have kids playing, my concern is that as a country our soccer players are going to all look like our golfers.

[mattie g]

I don't have kids playing, my concern is that as a country our soccer players are going to all look like our golfers.

I respect where you were going with this thread, but what does this mean?

[Danners9]

I took that to mean that the footballers will all be white, polo shirt wearing, richboys instead of a mix of all different types of social class.

The stereotype of golf and people who can afford to play golf.

[mattie g]

I took that to mean that the footballers will all be white, polo shirt wearing, richboys instead of a mix of all different types of social class.

The stereotype of golf and people who can afford to play golf.

I realize that. I just disagree with the way it was said. And, in a way, I took offense to what he was saying.

[Danners9]

Perhaps golf wasn't the best sport to use, I would have said Polo on horses :) All the la-de-da socialites and royals.

Certainly not the all inclusive sport football is meant to be. I've seen charity programmes here where they send some people over to africa to do community work - digging wells and building houses - the kids look sad until a ball is produced and suddenly they all want to join in.

[alexspepa]

I realize that. I just disagree with the way it was said. And, in a way, I took offense to what he was saying.

All right, then let me clarify my statement - if we only pull talent from one segment of the population, then we are not recruiting the best talent possible. When we put a National team on the field, it should be a compilation of the best players from a nation of 300 million people, not a nation of 300 million less those that cannot afford to develop their kids talent. And yes, I am inferring that right now soccer in the US is basically a game for white, upper middle class kids. I did not mean to offend anyone, what I am trying to say is that America has turned a game that everyone plays world-wide into an elitest sport.

If you don't mind, exactly what in my posts offended you? I respect everyone's opinion on this board, and I try to reflect that in my posts.

Thanks.

[mattie g]

alexspepa,

I understand what you were saying, but I'd have to disagree with you in some part. The game isn't strictly a white, upper class game. You can certainly make the argument that programs such as ODP and the elite youth teams are dominated by the more "well-to-do". I won't disagree at all with that argument, and it's one that is often discussed among American soccer fans; however, there are plenty of other "classes" of players out there and now getting noticed than ever before. With the creation of MLS reserve programs, I wouldn't be surprised if there's a lot more scouting going on at the "street level" than prior.

Beyond that, my major problem is with your comment about soccer players looking too much like golfers. Firstly, as noted above, I have some disagreement with who does or doesn't get seen by scouts. Additionally, I'm not overly PC, but imagine if someone were to say: "I'm concerned that the players in this country will all look like my landscapers/construction workers/etc." I don't think it would go over so well.

Again, I agree with your general premise, but it was that statement that I had a problem with.

[thejuggernaut]

All right, then let me clarify my statement - if we only pull talent from one segment of the population, then we are not recruiting the best talent possible. When we put a National team on the field, it should be a compilation of the best players from a nation of 300 million people, not a nation of 300 million less those that cannot afford to develop their kids talent. And yes, I am inferring that right now soccer in the US is basically a game for white, upper middle class kids. I did not mean to offend anyone, what I am trying to say is that America has turned a game that everyone plays world-wide into an elitest sport.

If you don't mind, exactly what in my posts offended you? I respect everyone's opinion on this board, and I try to reflect that in my posts.

Thanks.

I agree that the upper white middle class "soccer mom having" population does dominate the sport, but to say that it's due solely because of the expense of travel teams and shinguards or whatever is a bit incorrect. I feel if just popularity in the inner cities of the sport were to increase, you could see a major revolution begin. In most US cities, you have football, and basketball, and to lesser extent baseball and thats what you play. These sports have so many potentially talented soccer players going to waste because they are more commited to a sport that's chances of becoming a professional are the same as winning the lottery. Now gaining popularity in these areas may be a bit trickier but as the latin culture and population increases in each urban area perhaps an new appreciation for the beautiful game will foster.

[alexspepa]

alexspepa,

I understand what you were saying, but I'd have to disagree with you in some part. The game isn't strictly a white, upper class game. You can certainly make the argument that programs such as ODP and the elite youth teams are dominated by the more "well-to-do". I won't disagree at all with that argument, and it's one that is often discussed among American soccer fans; however, there are plenty of other "classes" of players out there and now getting noticed than ever before. With the creation of MLS reserve programs, I wouldn't be surprised if there's a lot more scouting going on at the "street level" than prior.

Beyond that, my major problem is with your comment about soccer players looking too much like golfers. Firstly, as noted above, I have some disagreement with who does or doesn't get seen by scouts. Additionally, I'm not overly PC, but imagine if someone were to say: "I'm concerned that the players in this country will all look like my landscapers/construction workers/etc." I don't think it would go over so well.

Again, I agree with your general premise, but it was that statement that I had a problem with.


Fair enough...thanks for responding.

[alexspepa]

I agree that the upper white middle class "soccer mom having" population does dominate the sport, but to say that it's due solely because of the expense of travel teams and shinguards or whatever is a bit incorrect. I feel if just popularity in the inner cities of the sport were to increase, you could see a major revolution begin. In most US cities, you have football, and basketball, and to lesser extent baseball and thats what you play. These sports have so many potentially talented soccer players going to waste because they are more commited to a sport that's chances of becoming a professional are the same as winning the lottery. Now gaining popularity in these areas may be a bit trickier but as the latin culture and population increases in each urban area perhaps an new appreciation for the beautiful game will foster.

Good points from both you and MattieG...hopefully the exposure football is now getting on TV will help create a demand for more avenues into the sport...ESPN is actually doing a fair job with the CL coverage this year, and we have more football broadcasts available than ever.

[mattie g]

Fair enough...thanks for responding.

Same here. It's nice to have a good-natured discussion about something that can be potentially divisive.

And I probably should have come out and originally stated my point without being passive-aggressive about it ;)