two touch restart versues a second handling

[Janice]

I picked this up off a uk website so forgive me if you seen it all or did this before but I was intriqued by the distinction being made of

(a)A two touch restart violation where the kicker uses his hands outside the Penalty Area as the second contact?
no advantage no dosgo dfk restart or pk restart possible caution :rolleyes:

(b) A second touch by a keeper after his 6 seconds of possession where the keeper uses his hands outside the Penalty Area for the second touch
could apply advantage could consider send off for DOGSO and or caution for USB with a DFK restart or PK restart :cool:

Now if a keeper has the ball possession for 6 seconds then tries to kick or throw the ball to a team-mate but it is poorly done across the face of goal 19 yards out just outside the boundrylines. Alert attacker is running in, sure to get there for an easy shot on the goal. An obvious scoring opportunity

(1)The keeper does the oh my gawd what I have I done and dives outside the penalty area and deliberately handles the ball, deflecting the ball into the oncoming attacker or towards the goal we apply advantage goal results!

-Good goal caution the keeper show yellow card for the USB, restart kick off

(2)The keeper does the oh my gawd what I have I done and dives outside
and deliberately handles the ball knocking the ball beyond the attacker to
a defending teammate or clear.

-Whistle play play dead, if the DOGSO criteria were met in your opinion send off the keeper for denying the scoring opportunity show a red card restart DFK? If no dogso then only caution for usb breaking up attacking play

[Wreave]

(a)A two touch restart violation where the kicker uses his hands outside the Penalty Area as the second contact?
no advantage no dosgo dfk restart or pk restart possible caution :rolleyes:

(b) A second touch by a keeper after his 6 seconds of possession where the keeper uses his hands outside the Penalty Area for the second touch
could apply advantage could consider send off for DOGSO and or caution for USB with a DFK restart or PK restart :cool:



The difference here is that in example (a), the restart was not correctly performed under law 13 or 14, and therefore must be retaken. The Advantage clause may only be applied to Law 12 offenses, not to restarts.

In example (b), the six second violation is under Law 12, and therefore Advantage can (and should) be applied.

Your confusion is understandable, but if you look at the situations as where the laws come from, it's easier.

[refmike]

Situations a & b both offer a PK restart. This would not be possible since the infraction occured outside the PA.

Wreave's answer that in situation a the restart was not properly performed and must be retaken is incorrect. The restart was correctly taken when the ball was kicked and moved (if outside the PA, or kicked and moved beyond the PA if the kick was from within the PA). The second touch is a violation AFTER the ball is in play, not an incorrect restart.

The heart of this matter is whether we should call the second touch or allow advantage and see if the ball goes into the net for a goal. DOGSO is another consideration. Part of that discussion includes what law was violated, since USSF has consistantly said that advantage appllies ONLY to Law 12 violations, although FIFA may not agree with that statement.

I won't comment on the final answer but just to keep it on track, we can't give a PK for things that occur outside of the PA and the restart, as defined was completed so the ball was in play.

[BobG]

(a)A two touch restart violation where the kicker uses his hands outside the Penalty Area as the second contact?
no advantage no dosgo dfk restart or pk restart possible caution :rolleyes:

(b) A second touch by a keeper after his 6 seconds of possession where the keeper uses his hands outside the Penalty Area for the second touch
could apply advantage could consider send off for DOGSO and or caution for USB with a DFK restart or PK restart :cool:



Isn't a) right out of the Q&A from years back? The restart is a direct free kick. You punish the more severe offense (as opposed for IFK for second touch). I think the pk restart might have been tossed in there to account for the keeper's body still being in the penalty area, but the ball being outside the PA. The location of the ball is what matters for handling.

b) could be any of the choices depending on the situation (except if it occured outside the PA, a PK wouldn't be applicable). A send off for DOGSO would be a pretty tough call. If at all possible, I'd treat it similarly to the keeper inadvertantly running out of the penalty area before releasing the ball.

There's a difference between deliberately handling a ball played by an opponent and deliberately handling a ball played by yourself or a team mate. Otherwise, what happens if a team mate passes the ball hard back to the keeper and the keeper has to dive to keep the pass from going in the goal? I guarantee you I'm not red carding and restarting with a PK.

[Wreave]

Wreave's answer that in situation a the restart was not properly performed and must be retaken is incorrect. The restart was correctly taken when the ball was kicked and moved (if outside the PA, or kicked and moved beyond the PA if the kick was from within the PA). The second touch is a violation AFTER the ball is in play, not an incorrect restart.

You are correct. My point was that the second touch is that (a) is a violation of Law 13, not a violation of Law 12, and Advantage can't be applied.

It's kind of a funny situation, because the Handling would be penalized as the more severe infraction, and Handling certainly qualifies for Advantage. However, the second touch on the kick cannot have Advantage applied, so there is no choice but to stop play.

You could, if appropriate, caution the keeper for UB.

The violations in (b) are Law 12 violations, both Advantage and DOGSO could be considered and applied.

[macheath]

You are correct. My point was that the second touch is that (a) is a violation of Law 13, not a violation of Law 12, and Advantage can't be applied.

It's kind of a funny situation, because the Handling would be penalized as the more severe infraction, and Handling certainly qualifies for Advantage. However, the second touch on the kick cannot have Advantage applied, so there is no choice but to stop play.

You could, if appropriate, caution the keeper for UB.

The violations in (b) are Law 12 violations, both Advantage and DOGSO could be considered and applied.

Right. DOGSO can come in because the keeper has put the ball into play outside the area. Then, if other DOGSO criteria are met, the keeper's handling is just that--deliberate handling to prevent a goal scoring opportunity. Second touch wouldn't come into it, for consideration of DOGSO. Same as if any other defender handled in a DOGSO situation.