Speaking To Players In A Language That You Don't Speak Well

[bluedevils]

Looking for feedback, thoughts, philosophies, personal experiences on this topic.

Assume the referee speaks only one language fluently. He knows a few key words - for things such as, stop, quiet, move back, hello, goodbye, etc - in a different language that is the native tongue of one of the teams.

Let's say, for example, ref speaks English, but one or both teams speak Spanish (and little or no English). Do the Spanish-speaking players appreciate the English-speaking referee using a few Spanish keywords to communicate? Or do they consider this insulting or silly or negative in some other way? I'm sure it varies by culture, language, team, and even the individual player; but I was hoping to hear some discussion anyway, whether specific personal experiences or general thoughts.

[GKbenji]

Let's say, for example, ref speaks English, but one or both teams speak Spanish (and little or no English). Do the Spanish-speaking players appreciate the English-speaking referee using a few Spanish keywords to communicate? Or do they consider this insulting or silly or negative in some other way? I'm sure it varies by culture, language, team, and even the individual player; but I was hoping to hear some discussion anyway, whether specific personal experiences or general thoughts.

I've had it work both ways. I speak un poquito espanol (how do I get at tilde on here?) and at times it has worked in my favor, and at times I know the players/fans have been, if not insulted, a bit derisive. One caveat, though... I speak a bit more than "a few Spanish keywords", but am far from fluent.

* At one match, I was an AR in a rec adult game, and the players and fans kept crowding the line. I asked them to step back, in English, several times, but with limited affect. Finally, I asked in Spanish. Everyone stepped back, then did a double take. I had no problems with them crowding the line the rest of the match.

* In other games, I have said something in Spanish and heard either spectators or players grumble (in Spanish, of course) something like, "Why doesn't he just speak English?"

* In one game, in an attempt to clarify a call, I said it was a "saque de manos" (throw in). One player, who spoke English just fine, snorted, "What the h3ll is a saque de manos?!" as if he felt I was trying to show them up by speaking Spanish. Didn't gain me any brownie points that time. Note that some terms like "balon for ball and perhaps saque de manos might be used in some parts of Central/South America but not all, so even using Spanish there can be some confusion occasionally.

* In another match, I sent a player off for cussing me out in Spanish. I think he was a bit surprised when I turned around and said, "Yo lo entiendo" and showed him the red. It definitely helped my management of that game.

* Finally, in a game I was able to understand and answer a goalkeeper's question about the six-second rule in Spanish when he asked me at halftime. Definite brownie points there.

Some of the problems it presents are: you're not fluent enough to really converse, can miss things being said or asked, and to some extent it undermines your credibility (kinda like being able to call a foul throw but missing important fouls); I think many players speak or at least understand more English than they like to let on and are marginally insulted that you think they can't.

On the plus side, players can't use the excuse that they don't understand you if you repeat things in Spanish, and at times they do appreciate the effort to make sure we all understand each other.

For my part, I will continue to use Spanish--sparingly, just as needed, but as a whole I think it is neutral or helps more than it hurts.

[falcon.7]

Or a tournament I worked where a coach was yelling a nearby crew the entire game in English, but as soon as the "head referee" came over, he didn't know a single word of English...

I think it's good to be able to know certain key words/phrases in multiple languages. There are a high number of Spanish-speaking adult clubs in my area, and I find that it helps sometimes. It's important not to try to impress them with overuse, as this can generate resentment. I've also picked up a few key phrases in other languages such as Polish, German, and Portuguese. You can gain a certain measure of game control from being able to joke with a group of Polish guys twice your size.

[mw26]

(how do I get at tilde on here?)

On a mac, it's option+n, then n=ñ i think you have to do some crazy stuff on a pc, but its doable. google it

* At one match, I was an AR in a rec adult game, and the players and fans kept crowding the line. I asked them to step back, in English, several times, but with limited affect. Finally, I asked in Spanish. Everyone stepped back, then did a double take. I had no problems with them crowding the line the rest of the match.

I had the same problem...only with Russian players. that was a rough game :rolleyes:

* In one game, in an attempt to clarify a call, I said it was a "saque de manos" (throw in). One player, who spoke English just fine, snorted, "What the h3ll is a saque de manos?!" as if he felt I was trying to show them up by speaking Spanish. Didn't gain me any brownie points that time. Note that some terms like "balon for ball and perhaps saque de manos might be used in some parts of Central/South America but not all, so even using Spanish there can be some confusion occasionally.

Yeah, thats a pain. I just go by the mexican dialect that the galavision announcers use. Most people understand it.

Some of the problems it presents are: you're not fluent enough to really converse, can miss things being said or asked, and to some extent it undermines your credibility (kinda like being able to call a foul throw but missing important fouls); I think many players speak or at least understand more English than they like to let on and are marginally insulted that you think they can't.

Agreed on all counts.

I've reffed in FL for a few years, but never actually reffed a predominantly spanish club. I've done a few where the parents cheer in spanish (i hate it when people argue my offsides calls in spanish), but all the players spoke english (to the refs, at least).

I did a tournament in Vegas, though, where we had i believe 11 teams come up from mexico. My second game was a U16 with Real Madrid Mexico City. I really messed it up, b/c it took me ages to explain in spanish that you could only sub on your own team's throw. Argh. I think their english was slightly better than my spanish, anyway.

I also did a game with a ref who spoke only spanish (except the words, 'no english, only spanish'). That one worked out much better. :)

[mw26]

almost forgot....

http://www.thecasbah.org/spanish-english.html

[IASocFan]

A story from my Hungarian friend. He was refereeing a college game and the coach was yelling at his players, the ref, anyone in general in Hungarian - particularly the coach's son. My friend went over to the coach and told him in Hungarian what he thought of the coaches language and behavior. He quieted down immediately. The son came over and thanked him after the game. It was the first time someone had quieted his father.

[bluedevils]

Everybody, thanks for the replies and to mw26 for the link. Good food for thought.

Learning some Spanish has been a long-term goal of mine and I just haven't gotten it off the ground. That casbah link is a good starting point -- should be able to memorize some of this in the car instead of listening to the radio!

[NHRef]

I speak just enough German to understand what's going on around me (married into a family who are all fluent in German -- Air Force Brat :rolleyes: )

there is one team I occassionally run into indoors that communicate amongst themselves in German but all speak English. I red carded one kid for cussing directly at me, in German. When the card came out, everyone went nuts asking what it was for until, in German I said, "I speak German, red card".

Game got alot quieter after that :)

Seems they liked saying things to/about the ref right infront of him assuming nobody understood, got to be a running joke.

[macheath]

I have a reasonable command of Spanish, understand more than I can speak. But I usually stick with English for starters, as sometimes people of Hispanic background, who are bilingual, may feel patronized if you speak in Spanish, especially if you really don't know it well. And there's lots of slang and dialect that varies from country to country, which can be confusing to players on calls, and sometimes can get you into unintended obscenities or insults. I agree that the Univision terminology works pretty well for game situations.

On the other hand, with teams who clearly are largely Spanish speakers, I can switch. I've found this to be effective game management more than once. (This is like NHRef's german story.) As the match wears on, the Spanish-speaking team may sometimes complain to each other about the game (and, heaven forbid, the referee!), and even use some pretty fierce curse words. At one of those points, I'll usually say something like "Usted cree que no entiendo lo que dice, pero entiendo." (You think I don't understand what you're saying, but I do.) That causes a ripple through the team--only downside is that I sometimes then get very complex, dialect-based Spanish discussions later in the match, that I sometimes/often don't fully understand. But then I just look stern, like a good referee should...:)

[bluedevils]

To me, one of the challenges is how to determine a player/team doesn't speak enough English for you to communicate with them, and, therefore, when to 'bust out' the other language. It seems that many players DO understand enough English to communicate with the ref, but sometimes I believe players don't speak much/any English at all.

Of course, much of the communication between players and referee can and should be non-verbal; I am mindful of that.

[refmike]

In most games where there are people who don't speak Englilsh, there are some who do and when I need to talk to a player, they always come running over to help translate.

I am reminded of an experience many years ago when I bought a computer from an asian company. The salesman told me all about the features of the computer but when I came back with a support question, he spoke no English.

[njref]

What about the case where one team speaks mostly/only Spanish and one team speaks English (or some other language for that matter)?

Are you going to generate hard feelings with the "English/other" team by speaking Spanish with their opponents when they cannot understand? I am not talking about 1-2 times, but on a running basis. I would think in those cases, the non-Spanish team may feel excluded, and may even feel the ref is biased. Actually, the same principle would apply if you talk to one team and not the other, no matter what the language.

[bluedevils]

Actually, the same principle would apply if you talk to one team and not the other, no matter what the language.

This is precisely what I'm worried about -- one team that speaks English as a native language and one team that doesn't speak much/any English at all. Easy for ref to conduct verbal communication with 1 team, and much more difficult to do the same with the other team. Do you 'zip it' and not talk much with the English-speaking team to make things seem more even-handed? Or do you use whatever tools you've got to communicate in whatever ways you can, not worrying about any real or perceived bias due to the amount of 'talking' being done with one team vs. the other?

I don't have answers to those questions.

[macheath]

This is precisely what I'm worried about -- one team that speaks English as a native language and one team that doesn't speak much/any English at all. Easy for ref to conduct verbal communication with 1 team, and much more difficult to do the same with the other team. Do you 'zip it' and not talk much with the English-speaking team to make things seem more even-handed? Or do you use whatever tools you've got to communicate in whatever ways you can, not worrying about any real or perceived bias due to the amount of 'talking' being done with one team vs. the other?

I don't have answers to those questions.

Well, as in many reffing situations, "it depends." Why do we talk to teams and players in the first place? We communicate in games to keep it flowing, get fair play, and general game management. So, if you need to speak Spanish to one team to get those results, then you should do so. With opponents who speak English, then make a more conscious effort than you might otherwise to talk with them, so it feels balanced. But you shouldn't cut back your otherwise-normal or necessary level of communication because of the language issue--you're then giving up a primary tool of game management for a secondary worry, that some players will feel left out. If you don't speak Spanish, make an effort through gestures, eye contact, etc. to compensate for not being able to explain verbally.

On fouls or difficult calls, your body language and affect will communicate some of what's happening, so you may not have to translate all the time. But with contested or disputed plays or fouls (one team wants a card, you don't give it, or you give one for reasons that might be less than clear, goals disallowed, etc.), then you should explain to both captains/teams, so they know what you are calling and why. We do this when both teams speak the same language ("Hey ref, he deserves a card." R: "The handling wasn't intentional", etc. etc.) so a little more talking isn't bad for bilingual games, especially if there's tension or it's a rough match.

[mw26]

i don't worry about it at all. if you need to say something, say it. if not, don't.

of course, i've not done any matches where i only speak the language of one team...

[ManiacalClown]

On the PC:

Make sure Num Lock is active.

Hold ALT + 0241 (on the numpad)


ALT is held the entire time, the 0241 is push and release like normal typing.

[AlsoRan]

If you know the unicode value of the character you need (241 for lowercase n with tilde), ManiacalClown's method is the fastest way to go.

Another way to enter special characters in Windows is to use the Character Map utility. To see all the characters you can use for a particular font, click Start, point to Programs, point to Accessories, point to System Tools, and then click Character Map. You can copy and paste the characters you need from Character Map.

Currency symbols (£¥€¢) Legal Marks (™©®) superscripts (2¹, 2²), non-English characters and lots of other fun stuff can be found without having to know the underlying unicode character value.

My apologies for straying off topic.

[dadman]

Ah, a Windows shortcut that mirrors the "KeyCaps" applet from 1988's System 6 for the Mac. Good to know. ;)

Thanks for the discussion on game- and man-management through a language barrier. It's been very interesting reading.

[nsa]

I tend to use humour to keep players in check, but this fails quickly when there is a language barrier. Given the dearth of German-speaking teams in the area, I am reduced to simply using the standard hand signals (and prayer).


I speak just enough German ...Speak to the Hispanic players in German to really mess with their heads. :)


Carded a guy for dissent in an adult match one time just based on his tone of voice. He starts yelling at his teammates to be careful 'cause "the ref speaks Italian". :rolleyes:

auf weiderschreiben.