Report on US/Mexico (Sam's Army)

[AndyMead]

As far as self important - at least they're trying. At least they are getting it done. There was a very noticeable block of US fans together at the game. No other group of US fans stood out. I'll take what's working. I'm the biggest contrarian "don't tell me what to do" kind of guy.

But in this area, it's all about the collective. Coming together and doing the exact same thing as everyone else. Dae Han Min-guk!
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As far as complaining about not hearing them... If you're basing that on watching the game on TV, then you really have no understanding of how microphone placement affects the sound you hear versus what goes on in the stadium. And even different places in the stadium get completely different audio experiences. Plus they were a couple hundred against 69,000. I was astonished how clearly they came across from time to time.

The best part - non-Sam's Army - was that the majority of the crowd was cheering both teams during the last 30 minutes of the game.

[AFCA]

Originally posted by maxim-1
that's great that you're there and pretty organized, vocal with all your shirts or whatever, but the focus is on the game and the players not what the supporters are doing imo.

That's the difference between the average fan you'll find anywhere and the fanatics you'll find behind many goals around the world.

What happens on the stands might not be as important as the match, but it's very close at it's least.

So there you have it. You don't have that attitude. Solution? Don't join 'em and watch the game. But don't criticise something you don't understand.

BTW. I believe the US is the only country in the world that has 'organized' supporters behind the NT.

My worst nightmare would be a bunch of those orange idiots doing that. but that's another story :D

[AFCA]

Originally posted by AndyMead
The best part - non-Sam's Army - was that the majority of the crowd was cheering both teams during the last 30 minutes of the game.

Yuck.

[tame1999]

Originally posted by AFCA
That's the difference between the average fan you'll find anywhere and the fanatics you'll find behind many goals around the world.

What happens on the stands might not be as important as the match, but it's very close at it's least.

So there you have it. You don't have that attitude. Solution? Don't join 'em and watch the game. But don't criticise something you don't understand.

BTW. I believe the US is the only country in the world that has 'organized' supporters behind the NT.

I've said before and I'll say it again. I really do appreciate what Sam's Army has done when looking at the broad picture. They've gotten a consistent thing going that, despite its flaws, is still the only thing up and running. I still think that you need to inject some more passion in one form or another, I know when I go to a game I very rarely actually watch the game. I'm more concerned with contributing to the chants and other things, but that's just me. I'm sure people can chant and watch a game at the same time. I think once the qualifiers role around you'll see the most vocal group of supporters we've seen.

[AndyMead]

Originally posted by AFCA
Yuck.

No, not yuck. I see you're an Ajax supporter from Amsterdam. I assume you're not familiar with soccer in the US, then.

The vast majority of the crowd were American citizens and American residents. A majority also have ancestral ties to Mexico.

Due mainly to the suck that has been the US national team over the preceding decades, most hispanic immigrants, and their children who still follow soccer (as opposed to switching to only "American" sports) identify with their club and and national teams of their "homeland".

It is a given that most games in the US against Mexico or latin American countries will be "away" games. Even though the vast majority of the crowd are actually tax paying Americans.

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The fact that most of the crowd was cheering for "both" teams at the end is awesome. It represents that segments of the hispanic population are beginning to accept the US National Team as their team. Perhaps if the game is a WCQ, we would not have had that response, but perhaps if the US were playing someone else - say Costa Rica - a lot of those Mexican-Americans might just show up and cheer for the US of A.

It's all about progress and acceptance. Ten years of results on the field appear to be slowly turning the tide of acceptance in the latin American communities.

You may say "yuck", but it's a much needed milestone for fans of American soccer. If you haven't lived here, and haven't been going to US games for the last ten years, then you likely wouldn't understand, and your reaction would make sense.

[AFCA]

Ahh yes.

I was aware of some of the things you mentioned. But I didn't make the connection.

[nicodemus]

Originally posted by AndyMead
No, not yuck. I see you're an Ajax supporter from Amsterdam. I assume you're not familiar with soccer in the US, then.

The vast majority of the crowd were American citizens and American residents. A majority also have ancestral ties to Mexico.

Due mainly to the suck that has been the US national team over the preceding decades, most hispanic immigrants, and their children who still follow soccer (as opposed to switching to only "American" sports) identify with their club and and national teams of their "homeland".

It is a given that most games in the US against Mexico or latin American countries will be "away" games. Even though the vast majority of the crowd are actually tax paying Americans.

-----
The fact that most of the crowd was cheering for "both" teams at the end is awesome. It represents that segments of the hispanic population are beginning to accept the US National Team as their team. Perhaps if the game is a WCQ, we would not have had that response, but perhaps if the US were playing someone else - say Costa Rica - a lot of those Mexican-Americans might just show up and cheer for the US of A.

It's all about progress and acceptance. Ten years of results on the field appear to be slowly turning the tide of acceptance in the latin American communities.

You may say "yuck", but it's a much needed milestone for fans of American soccer. If you haven't lived here, and haven't been going to US games for the last ten years, then you likely wouldn't understand, and your reaction would make sense. This is one of the best posts I've read in a long time and I agree. About 4 years ago, there was a U-17 tournament here in Birmingham that actually drew around 10,000 for the USA-Mexico game and a lot of Mexicans were applauding the play of the US players. It was a several day tournament and every day was a double header. When the US played Jamaica or Morocco, the Mexican fans either showed up early or stayed late to support the US.

[AndyMead]

And the Houston crowd was predominantly middle class families. In LA you typically get a bunch of young single guys. Houston was a very suburban crowd. Part of that was caused by the cost of the tickets. On the plane flight there, I talked with a Mexican-American couple. He was going to root for Mexico, and she was going to root for the USA.

I remember the September 1, 2001 Honduras WCQ at RFK where I watched a 40 year old man, head to toe in the blue of Honduras walking with his red US national team jersey clad 8(ish) year old son walking to the stadium.

At last year's Gold Cup in LA, I saw an adult man with two boys at a souvenier stand. One had a Guatemalan jersey, the other had a Mexico jersey. The man was buying each of them a "USA" headband....

[nyrmetros]

Originally posted by AndyMead
And the Houston crowd was predominantly middle class families. In LA you typically get a bunch of young single guys. Houston was a very suburban crowd. Part of that was caused by the cost of the tickets. On the plane flight there, I talked with a Mexican-American couple. He was going to root for Mexico, and she was going to root for the USA.

I remember the September 1, 2001 Honduras WCQ at RFK where I watched a 40 year old man, head to toe in the blue of Honduras walking with his red US national team jersey clad 8(ish) year old son walking to the stadium.

At last year's Gold Cup in LA, I saw an adult man with two boys at a souvenier stand. One had a Guatemalan jersey, the other had a Mexico jersey. The man was buying each of them a "USA" headband....

glad to see those examples are in fact reality :)

[nicodemus]

Originally posted by AndyMead
And the Houston crowd was predominantly middle class families. In LA you typically get a bunch of young single guys. Houston was a very suburban crowd. Part of that was caused by the cost of the tickets. On the plane flight there, I talked with a Mexican-American couple. He was going to root for Mexico, and she was going to root for the USA.
I saw many adults pulling for Mexico and their kids decked out in USA gear. I know if I moved to Spain or something, I would pull for both until they played each other and then I'd pull for the USA still. If I had kids in the above scenario though and they were Spanish citizens, I'd want them to pull for Spain.

[mpruitt]

Originally posted by AFCA

What happens on the stands might not be as important as the match, but it's very close at it's least.

So there you have it. You don't have that attitude. Solution? Don't join 'em and watch the game. But don't criticise something you don't understand.


I think I understand it perfectly. Do i appreciate what they do? sure. great for them. love the passion. do i think they're self important? a little, but whatever. But I disagree that they are "as important or very close." If that was the case then should we have supporters groups for supporters groups? heh. just ridiculous. i'm not trying to engage in some flame war. during the gold cup i might sit with Sams army just to be part of that vocal and visual expierence but i just have a good idea of exactly where any supporter fanatics stand.

[gofire2001]

Just a suggestion: Why doesn't Sam's Army have one person that get's where everyone can see him to lead the chants? We use that in Chicago with great results.

[Sweeper]

Originally posted by gofire2001
Just a suggestion: Why doesn't Sam's Army have one person that get's where everyone can see him to lead the chants? We use that in Chicago with great results.

Son of a Beetch, great idea, someone hand this man an award........

[The Magpie]

Because what's allowed, encouraged, and successful in Chicago may not be allowed, encouraged, or successful in other cities and stadia... for any number of reasons

I think it's a great idea, don'[t get me wrong... but the fact of the matter is this: Fire supporters are lucky to have a G.M. in Peter Wilt who's open to such ideas, working with the fans to make the effort work. There's a consistency in the fans relationship with him and vice versa, and there's a consistency in the fan base there where they're accustomed to such action...

Elsewhere you're dealing with different people, different philosophies, different stadium regulations... and different fans.

The Magpie

[AFCA]

Originally posted by maxim-1
but i just have a good idea of exactly where any supporter fanatics stand.

I think you don't. Of course it's also a cultural thing.

Over here (and probably SA too), for many of the fanatic supporters groups, the group is just as important as the team. While the team battles for first place in the league with the best football the groups battle for first place in supportersland with best singing, best atmosphere and (in many cases) best fighting.

For many of the people in these groups all this + what happens on the pitch is football.

So if the people at Sam's Army seem a little self-important you might be right. But you won't find a self-respecting supporters group anywhere that isn't.

[metroflip73]

I'm not a registered member of SA, although I've stood in the section.

I'm just gonna get this off my chest.

It's telling though that when the USA's winning (USA v Mex at the WC), the SA section is crazy, singing, energetic and that jazz. When the USA's losing (USA v Poland) not a peep. Kinda depressing. I'm sure this happens for other US games that I haven't been too, and I'm almost certain it occurs at the MLS supporter level.

Just one of my complaints RE: the "sing when you're winning" mentality. Sure it feels good to do that. But that's kinda half-ass. I'm guilty of it as well (USA v Hon in DC). Just a bit disappointing that it still afflicts SA.

When WCQing come around, there will be mos def vocal support, there's no doubt about that.

13

Loud n' commin' 'atcha ALWAYS

[supersport]

I am not a member and have no plans to become one, but you have to respect them for what they are trying to do. As a member of the new SJ supporters group Ultras SJ, I can tell you its no easy task and the biggest roadblocks come from, stadium officials, the front office and other fans. They may not be the best supporters club out there, but at least they are there.