Sven: Poor Champions League form due to too many fixtures

[cachundo]

Eriksson criticises fixture list (http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/football/3016507.stm) England coach Sven-Goran Eriksson has blamed Premiership clubs' failure to reach the latter stages of the Champions League on the demands placed on players in England. [snip]

[snip] The problem, says Eriksson, is that English teams play more games than their European counterparts, who also have the benefit of a mid-season break. Eriksson believes the packed Premiership fixture schedule also hampers the national team's attempts to qualify for major tournaments. Sven makes a good point. Personally, I'd like just 16 teams in the Prem, & for a club to play 30 league games. Clubs get a winter break, and the fewer fixtures will leave them fresher & better focused for European competition. But how will clubs make up the revenue shortfall?

[Prenn]

************ off with your 16 team Premiership.

There are 92+ professional clubs in this country and we have four leagues. This would lead to the lower leagues having 25 teams each. Not a chance.

I say get rid of the League Cup.

[comme]

Personally I would agree with the 16 teams idea in principle, but it is a bit harsh on the smaller clubs. I definitely think the league cup should be scrapped, and possibly look into making the league into only 84 teams. No ther country in the owrld suports our number of professional teams, and while I know we have a longstanding history of 92 teams, perhaps it should be looked at.

[michaec]

I don't usually go for the "It's not like the old days" stuff, but a point I would like to make. When Liverpool, Forest and Villa were monpolising the European Cup in the late 70's/early 80's they played in a league of 22 teams instead of 20, had unlimited replays in the FA Cup and two legs in every round of the league cup except the final in which they didn't get byes into later rounds just because they were playing Europe.

Maybe players are tired because they're more busy with advertising shampoo, clothes, va-va-voom or whatever else rather than concentrating on playing football.

[wodwo]

The difference between now and the 70's/80's is that players are true athletes competing at the peak of fitness for long periods of time. This puts more strain on the body and, like track and field athletes, means that players are continually running a fine line between their bodies being finely tuned and highly strung or breaking down and getting inujred - Michael Owen's hamstring problem is one such example. Why else would teams need such large squads compared to 20 years ago when clubs fielded the same team for every match?

Moreover, the EPL puts more emphasis on 110% physical commitment at an incredible pace. Blood tests on the England team during the preparation for the World Cup showed that the only player who wasn't physically exhausted was Owen Hargreaves who plays in Germany. With the humidity and type of pitch in Japan, England were always going to struggle in the heat against Brazil whose style of play conserves energy - maybe they just weren't good enough, but either way it was clear that many players just hadn't much left in the tank in the second half of nearly all their world cup matches - thank God we played the Argies at night.

I think there really has to be a winter break, and the League Cup should be revised as a competition for only Nationwide League teams. No more pointless FIFA competitions would help - especially for the likes of Viera et al.

[lanman]

Spain also has a 20 team top league - the only differences being that they have a winter break and no league cup (although how often did the top teams field their first choice teams in it?).
Man Utd certainly do not look tired at this stage - they were simply beaten by a better team in Europe.

An ever present in England for a team reaching the quarter finals of both the FA Cup and the Champions League would play around 60 games over 9 months, which works out at around 6.5 games a month. For teams challenging for the Champions League they should have a strong enough squad to reduce that to around 50-55 games at the most. An average of 6 games a month should not prove too much for a professional athlete.

[billyireland]

Get rid of the League (Worthless) Cup and introduce a small winter break. Ideally for players would be the German scheduele, which is absolutely perfect, but that would mean making the Premiership a smaller league, which just wouldn't be the premiership (which is THE most entertaining league in the world).

Also, the main reason Man U went out was Fabien "La Choke" Barthez, who is too short and always off his line) which was severly punished. A Better keeper (Friedel, Cudicini, Given, Keller are just Premiership examples). Apart from that woeful first half in the Bernabeau, Man U and Real played about as well as each other (honestly) and at least we can say we beat them 4-3 at The Theatre of Dreams

[RichardL]

You could have a three week break quite easily - just start a week earlier and end a week later, which would give two free Saturdays. Ending the season a bit later would help internationally as I can't see that having over a month off before the start of the world cup/euro championships can help too much.

[DennisM]

Good grief. I know Sven is supposed to worry just about the English National team. However, I wish that people like him, Wenger and others realize just how lucky and privileged they are and quit complaining. 50 other leagues in Europe do not have the option of four teams in the UCL.

[DennisM]

The Champions league itself is too large. Just have 2 teams from each country.(Qualifying rounds, sure). A third for the team that won it the previous year. If they want teams to play better in the Champions League then they should make it the Champions League.

[cachundo]

Originally posted by wodwo
The difference between now and the 70's/80's is that players are true athletes competing at the peak of fitness for long periods of time. This puts more strain on the body and, like track and field athletes, means that players are continually running a fine line between their bodies being finely tuned and highly strung or breaking down and getting inujred - Michael Owen's hamstring problem is one such example. Why else would teams need such large squads compared to 20 years ago when clubs fielded the same team for every match?

Moreover, the EPL puts more emphasis on 110% physical commitment at an incredible pace. Blood tests on the England team during the preparation for the World Cup showed that the only player who wasn't physically exhausted was Owen Hargreaves who plays in Germany. With the humidity and type of pitch in Japan, England were always going to struggle in the heat against Brazil whose style of play conserves energy - maybe they just weren't good enough, but either way it was clear that many players just hadn't much left in the tank in the second half of nearly all their world cup matches - thank God we played the Argies at night.

I think there really has to be a winter break, and the League Cup should be revised as a competition for only Nationwide League teams. No more pointless FIFA competitions would help - especially for the likes of Viera et al. Excellent post, specifically regarding the need for players to perform at a high level for a long[er] period of time.

I agree with most about the worthiness of the Worthless Cup

[Mobile]

People who are glibly suggesting that the number of teams in England should be reduced should pause and consider for a moment that each of the 92 clubs has fans who would not be particularly thrilled at the idea of their team being disbanded so that the country's elite can make more money out of the Champions League.

Personally I couldn't give a toss if an English team wins it or not.

P.S. If we have to mess about with the system then make the League Cup an Under-21 event.

[superdave]

OK, I know CM is just a computer game, but still...my style is to build a squad of 20-25 players of quality players and rotate like mad. I'll have my 5th striker start a half dozen games and be a sub in a bunch more. My 3rd choice at defensive midfield will start 10 games. My teams would always go on these tremendous hot streaks as the January-February fixture crunch receded. And we did very well in Europe, too.

I feel like one key reason that ManU went on such a tear was that they have more squad depth than Arsenal. I guess what I'm saying is, I wonder if managers have a realistic idea of how tired players get in modern football. There's a phenomenon called "overtraining" with a set of specific symptoms. Do these teams test for it?

Anyway, yeah, maybe they could reduce games. Or maybe that could institute policies that strikers should play more than, say, 400 minutes in a month, defenders 500 minutes, etc.

[RichardL]

Originally posted by Mobile
People who are glibly suggesting that the number of teams in England should be reduced should pause and consider for a moment that each of the 92 clubs has fans who would not be particularly thrilled at the idea of their team being disbanded so that the country's elite can make more money out of the Champions League.

It also fails to take into account the rather glaringly obvious flaw that even if every single club outside the premier league was disbanded, it wouldn't make the slightest bit of difference to the number of premier league or champions league fixtures.

It was announced last week that football league crowds are at their highest level for 40 years (compared to old divs 2-4). Whatever problems football in this country faces, lack of support isn't currently one of them. Few European countries have more than two pro divisions (if that). England has four and can sustain four because the crowds in our fourth level are about the same as crowds in the second level of places like Italy, Spain and Germany. English Div 1 is (I think) the 6th best supported division in Europe.

[DennisM]

"English Div 1 is (I think) the 6th best supported division in Europe".

This may be true and its about time that the Premiership should shut and rejoin the league. Such cry babies. 7 teams in European competition next year and not one of them a winner this year. It's all so ridiculous. Go Royals, join the Premiership and remain humble!

[655321]

This is just another example of a European coach not able to understand that English teams' bread and butter should be the league. I know they don't say it, but Wenger, Houllier, and Erikson act like league placement and league participation is soley a way to get into Europe. Once you're there, the league matches just get in the way. F that. I say the travelling and concentration required for Europe get in the way of the domestic game.

Don't get me wrong, I want Liverpool to win European games, and they have produced some very exciting times that I wouldn't trade in for anything, but the league is what matters.

Foreign coaches really have little respect for the league. It's only European glory that they are after.

[DennisM]

"Foreign coaches really have little respect for the league. It's only European glory that they are after"

Yes. But this may be the opposite in Italy where the top coaches, Italian ones certainly, seem to think that Europe doesn't matter and that Serie A is everything.

[655321]

Originally posted by DennisM
"Foreign coaches really have little respect for the league. It's only European glory that they are after"

Yes. But this may be the opposite in Italy where the top coaches, Italian ones certainly, seem to think that Europe doesn't matter and that Serie A is everything.

Lucky them.

[DennisM]

I would prefer that the league be placed first in all cases with Europe being seen as a privilege. However, it's becoming less of a privilege if more and more clubs are being allowed in.

[worldsoccer-Jeff]

Why not just have the teams in division one to three compeat in the league cup? The EPL teams are not really members of the Football League, right?

If you still need EPL team in the League Cp to make it work then let team that are not in Europe, or already out or Europe play in the event.

The problem here is, of couse, money. Football League make to much cash in game with EPL teams to let them leave. And the Football League itself make some nice cash on the event, so why would they want to stop it? What kind of tv money would their be without EPL teams?

I wouldnt get upset with an 18 team EPL with two teams relegated each year.

In the FA Cup, why not get rid of replays and just go to extra time and pk's after the first (and only) game?

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