MLS/USL thread [R]

[ToonUSA]

Landon Donovan does not have the drive to be a player in the best leagues in the world and thus he won't get much better than he already is. He'd much rather be a big fish in a small pond, and be content with his actress wife and living on the beach. He could do it, he just doesn't want to. Anyone who wants to argue that point is a moron. :)

What shows you he doesn't have the drive? Leaving Leverkusen for LA? Is that it?

[tigerdave]

What shows you he doesn't have the drive? Leaving Leverkusen for LA? Is that it?

That and the fact that he's continually stated that he's happy in MLS and doesn't think he needs to go abroad to improve, for starters.

[ToonUSA]

That and the fact that he's continually stated that he's happy in MLS and doesn't think he needs to go abroad to improve, for starters.

So you think being unhappy will make him a better player?

[tigerdave]

So you think being unhappy will make him a better player?

I think if he were more driven to be a better player than to just be content and be happy wherever, he'd be a better player.

And now that I've said the same damn thing about 15 different ways, time for others to have their say. </last word>

[penubly]

Leverkusen has never won the Bundesliga, and their greatest ever feat was a 2-1 CL Final loss to Real Madrid.
That's more than any MLS side will ever achieve.

He could play for the Galaxy until he's 35 years old and then retire and he'd still be the best American soccer player we've ever had.

It's all subjective, and everyone is entitled to their opinion. My money is on Tim Howard. Landon may have a ton of caps, and be the leading scorer, but that doesn't automatically make him the best American player .

I still feel that the true measure is success in a major European league. It's the place everyone wants to play. If Pele were active today, it would be considered an oddity that he had never played, or achieved success, in Europe.

[BayernWake]

O yes, because Leverkusen is the side every little boy dreams of playing for. :rolleyes:

Better than any MLS team.

Leverkusen has never won the Bundesliga, and their greatest ever feat was a 2-1 CL Final loss to Real Madrid. While a CL final appearance is nothing to sneeze at, their history doesn't exactly leave one excited about them.

Who cares? Still more respectable than playing for an MLS team. Plus you're surrounded by better players.

Landon is committed to his family, national team, and furthering the game in his home country. It's tough to do that from Europe.

Family, ok. "Furthering the game" in your home country, ok (although his presence in the US hasn't made anyone give a f*ck one way or another about soccer...Beckham has done a better job and has been in America a fraction of the time). Commitment to the national team? Bullsh!t. Don't tell me you can't be committed to your national team when playing in a foreign country.

Hate the guy all you want, that's your right, but in the end he made the decision that he felt was best for him. Why does everyone feel Landon owes them something and that he won't be considered the greatest American to ever play the game if he doesn't go play and have success in Europe? He could play for the Galaxy until he's 35 years old and then retire and he'd still be the best American soccer player we've ever had.

It doesn't seem the LEAST bit f*cked up to you that DOZENS of American players with equal or less talent than Donovan are playing at a SIGNIFICANTLY higher level? Donovan may well go down in history as the greatest American player (scratch that, others will pass him), but'll he'll never be seen as the most respected.

[City Dave]

That's more than any MLS side will ever achieve..

Not necessarily, we could eventually win the Club World Cup. And we'd have to beat the reigning Champions League champ or another team that beat them to do it. Granted, the tournament isn't that big of a deal right now, but it's growing. By the time an MLS team wins it, it will most likely be well respected.

[ToonUSA]

That's more than any MLS side will ever achieve.


Clearly as an MLS side can't compete in the Bundesliga or the CL. :rolleyes:

[ToonUSA]

Better than any MLS team.

Who cares? Still more respectable than playing for an MLS team. Plus you're surrounded by better players.
My point was that you were making it appear as if Donovan had turned down Barcelona, which we all know Leverkusen is not.

Family, ok. "Furthering the game" in your home country, ok (although his presence in the US hasn't made anyone give a f*ck one way or another about soccer...Beckham has done a better job and has been in America a fraction of the time). Commitment to the national team? Bullsh!t. Don't tell me you can't be committed to your national team when playing in a foreign country.
Do you have proof that he hasn't furthered the game here? I certainly think he has. You certainly can be committed to your national team when you play in a foreign country. This holds true for most European players, however having to journey back to the US for games and maybe not being able to make all of the camps he'd like weighed into his decision. He cares about the national team way more than he does about playing in Europe. That gets a lot of respect from me.

It doesn't seem the LEAST bit f*cked up to you that DOZENS of American players with equal or less talent than Donovan are playing at a SIGNIFICANTLY higher level? Donovan may well go down in history as the greatest American player (scratch that, others will pass him), but'll he'll never be seen as the most respected.
He can if he wants to. I'm confident he probably will, but right now he's content and I don't see anything wrong with that, nor do I believe it condemns him as a player. He's already respected amongst every country in the CONCACAF region as well as countless fans in Europe and other places. Just because some American fans want to eat their own for not fulfilling the expectations they have set for him doesn't mean others don't appreciate him.

[Dirt McGirt]

I can't believe I agree with ToonUSA.:confused: :D

[BayernWake]

My point was that you were making it appear as if Donovan had turned down Barcelona, which we all know Leverkusen is not.

Umm, no, that's not what I meant, that's just how you interpreted it. He turned down hard work and a chance to use Leverkusen as a launchpad to greener pastures, both career-wise and skill-wise.

Do you have proof that he hasn't furthered the game here? I certainly think he has.

The burden of proof isn't on me, it's on you! Negatives cannot be proven!

You certainly can be committed to your national team when you play in a foreign country. This holds true for most European players, however having to journey back to the US for games and maybe not being able to make all of the camps he'd like weighed into his decision. He cares about the national team way more than he does about playing in Europe. That gets a lot of respect from me.

So, does every Yank abroad care more about playing in Europe than they do about playing for the US national team? Is that honestly what you're saying??


He's already respected amongst every country in the CONCACAF region

Most likely.

as well as countless fans in Europe and other places.

Doubt it highly.

Just because some American fans want to eat their own for not fulfilling the expectations they have set for him doesn't mean others don't appreciate him.

Not that I can prove this, but I'm pretty sure most soccer fans around the world don't know who the hell Landon Donovan is. At this point most Bayer 04 fans have even forgotten about him.

[BayernWake]

I can't believe I agree with ToonUSA.:confused: :D

Neither can I.

[Russell1892]

Thought I'd weigh in with what thoughts are on Donovan over here. I remember he went to Leverkusen when he was pretty young and there was talk of him then, and he was pretty good in the 2002 World Cup (Didn't he win best young player or something?)

Seems like a decent player. Thats about all I know. I've seen him play in some LAG games and its not like he lights up the MLS. I'll have a better look at him if he plays in the friendly against England at the end of May.

If he's happy in America thats fine enough, does kind of remind me of Matt Le Tissier spending their whole career playing for Southampton though.

How's he the All-Time US top scorer? Isn't he only about 25?

[City Dave]

How's he the All-Time US top scorer? Isn't he only about 25?

He turned 26 last month. And he is the top scorer. And that should tell you how much he means to US soccer at the moment.

[BayernWake]

For the record I don't "hate" Landon as much as my posts make it seem. It's not like I actively root against the guy.

I just happen to think he's spinning his wheels playing in MLS.

[ToonUSA]

The burden of proof isn't on me, it's on you! Negatives cannot be proven!
What do you want attendance statistics? Being on the cover of SI was a good start. He also appears as the face of US Soccer in countless commercials and at many events. I also believe he helps out at some sort of a youth camp, but the name of it escapes me. This all the while every goal he scores certainly helps us as a nation gain more interest in the game, and more respect throughout the globe.


So, does every Yank abroad care more about playing in Europe than they do about playing for the US national team? Is that honestly what you're saying??
Never said that. Although not every Yank abroad is as high profile or important to the NT as LD is. Maybe you should write him a letter and ask him if you don't like what I'm saying.

Most likely.
Fact.

Doubt it highly.
Well all of the Romanian FA and fans I've been around salivate over him and a lot of the fans in Holland mentioned him as well. Also, don't think the Portuguese or Germans have forgotten about him already. Never said liked. Said respected.

Not that I can prove this, but I'm pretty sure most soccer fans around the world don't know who the hell Landon Donovan is. At this point most Bayer 04 fans have even forgotten about him.
I bet more countries than not have heard of him. He did have an exceptional WC 2002.

[ToonUSA]

Also, nice impartial moderating on the thread title Dave. :rolleyes: Way to abuse those powers.

[City Dave]

Also, nice impartial moderating on the thread title Dave. :rolleyes: Way to abuse those powers.

Oh come on, it's funny. Now, I'll roll my eyes. :rolleyes:

[tigerdave]

Also, nice impartial moderating on the thread title Dave. :rolleyes: Way to abuse those powers.

It's not disparaging anyone so it's perfectly fine. Stop acting like a hypersensitive liberal and learn to take a joke. :D

[BayernWake]

What do you want attendance statistics? Being on the cover of SI was a good start. He also appears as the face of US Soccer in countless commercials and at many events. I also believe he helps out at some sort of a youth camp, but the name of it escapes me.

Helping out in youth camps...respectable. But ask John Q. Nonsoccerfan on the street to name one American soccer player, they'll probably say Freddy Adu.

Never said that. Although not every Yank abroad is as high profile or important to the NT as LD is. Maybe you should write him a letter and ask him if you don't like what I'm saying.

Yes, because if it comes from Donovan's mouth it must be true.

Well all of the Romanian FA and fans I've been around salivate over him and a lot of the fans in Holland mentioned him as well. Also, don't think the Portuguese or Germans have forgotten about him already. Never said liked. Said respected.

Well, among the Germans and Austrians I've been around, only a few even know who he is, let alone respect him.

I bet more countries than not have heard of him. He did have an exceptional WC 2002.

So did Jon Dahl Tomasson.

Who?

Exactly.