UEFA Seeding

[Inara]

I apologize in advance if there is already a thread for this, but I was wondering, how in the world is Romania threatening to overtake Portugal and Germany in the UEFA seedings?

There was only one Romanian team in the Champions League this year, and they got pushed into UEFA cup. But Bayern and Werder had good showings. Same thing with Portuguese teams. They at least are in the competition every year. So how did Romania become a threat?

I was looking at this website (http://www.xs4all.nl/~kassiesa/bert/uefa/data/method3/crank2010.html), and I saw that their prediction for 2010 would place Romania at the top of country seeding! I'm not sure about the validity of the site, but it seems valid.

[Forza AZ]

I apologize in advance if there is already a thread for this, but I was wondering, how in the world is Romania threatening to overtake Portugal and Germany in the UEFA seedings?

There was only one Romanian team in the Champions League this year, and they got pushed into UEFA cup. But Bayern and Werder had good showings. Same thing with Portuguese teams. They at least are in the competition every year. So how did Romania become a threat?

I was looking at this website (http://www.xs4all.nl/~kassiesa/bert/uefa/data/method3/crank2010.html), and I saw that their prediction for 2010 would place Romania at the top of country seeding! I'm not sure about the validity of the site, but it seems valid.
The site is very valid. You forgot that the ranking is not only from CL, but also from UEFA-cup. Last season 2 Romanian teams reached the quarterfinals of the UEFA-cup. And the ranking is also calculated by taking a average, and since Romania had only 3 clubs in the European Cups last season of which 2 got very far, they had a very high coefficient for last year (best of all countries). It is very unlikely however they stay at first place in the 2010 ranking, as they will have more clubs in the European Cups from next season because of their good performances last year. Next season they have 4 teams in, and the season(s) after that most likely 6. So then also the somewhat weaker teams from Romania are included and their average will be much lower (most likely).

[Inara]

Thanks for the explanation. I forgot about UEFA cup. Steaua reached the semifinals last year, didn't they?

Does UEFA Cup weigh as much as the Champions League in seeding matters?

[Sagy]

Does UEFA Cup weigh as much as the Champions League in seeding matters?
Almost.

Wins in both competitions are worth 2 points and ties 1 point (in qualifier rounds it is 1 & 0.5). The score at the end of each match counts (if the match goes to ET, the score AET counts).

However, in the CL you get 3 bonus points for making it to the group stage and an extra point for each level the team advances post the group stage. In the UC a team get an extra point for reaching the 1/4 finals, 1/2 final and final.

But the UC has two more games (make up for the 4 extra CL points?) for teams that reach the same level:

CL UC
1st - 2
Group 6 4
R32 - 2
R16 2 2
1/4 2 2
1/2 2 2
Final 1 1
Total 13 15

Last year (2006) the top three teams (point wise) were:
Cup W D L Bonus Points
FC Barcelona CL 9 4 0 7 29.0
Arsenal CL 8 4 1 7 27.0
Sevilla UC 9 4 2 3 25.0

[leg_breaker]

So Seville got more points that Villareal or AC Milan, for progressing in a weaker tournament? That's ridiculous.

[guignol]

perhaps not ridiculous if you want to judge an entire league and not only the best team or two. but it is a paradox that you can get more points being knocked out of the CL in the first KO round than the 2nd... or even farther!

[benficafan3]

What is ridiculous is Romania about to pass Portugal in the ranking. In the past years we've won the UEFA Cup, gone to the final, won the CL, had a team in the quarterfinal, had 3 teams simultaneously in the CL groupstage, and Romania has two teams have a decent run in the UEFA Cup....and they pass us...

[vilafria]

I agree, the CL being on parity to the UC as far as points go, borders on fantasy .

[Sagy]

What is ridiculous is Romania about to pass Portugal in the ranking. In the past years we've won the UEFA Cup, gone to the final, won the CL, had a team in the quarterfinal, had 3 teams simultaneously in the CL groupstage, and Romania has two teams have a decent run in the UEFA Cup....and they pass us...

Romania is not likely to pass Portugal this year. Portugal is ahead by 1.084 points (this means that Romnaia needs at least 4 game points to pass them), Steaua lost leg one at home and Dinamo lost at Benfica. If Benfica eliminates Dinamo, Romania is done for the year and will stay behind Portugal. Portugal also has Porto & Braga that might bring points home even if Dinamo advances.

Next year the story is different, Romania will start the year around 5th place (a poor 2002/3 - 2.333 is eliminated) while Portugal will be in the 6-9 range mainly because they lose 10.750 points from the same year (they did better than Russia, Netherlands and even Germany that year). However unless Romanian teams generate more than 4-5 points next year (16-20 game points) they will not be able to keep 5th place, since they will have a 5-6 points lead on the teams in 6-9 and if any one of them ends up with 10+ points they will pass Romania.