Why Young Yanks shouldn't go to the premiership part 2

[The Wanderer]

Gareth Southgate from 4-4-2:

"We've got talented people, but I don't think the style of the Premiership serves us well on the international stage. Whilst our league is exciting to watch, you have to adjust your style when you play international football and that handicaps us. Other nations are more comfortable on the ball whereas over the years English fans have come to expect our game to be played at a very high pace, where concentration on passing and keeping the ball is secondary."


Okay, now an actual Englishmen chimes in with his $.02 cents. This after I posted a link to Ronaldo quotes before the crash where he said that 'going to the Premiership doesn't make you a better player'.

But I don't know anything about football now do I Superdave since I never played at the highest level?

sig---
'The Wanderer: Vindicated again'.

Kudos to dark knight for finding the article

[Prenn]

You're going to lose again, this isn't good enough.

Was Southgate interviewed just after the world cup by any chance?

Just what league would you want to send your young players to?

Holland?
Italy?
Spain?
Portugal?

None of these leagues had national teams finishing ahead of England, only 1 got as far.

Tell ya what... send them all to Germany.

Nice try but not good enough.

[mik_smith]

A) National Team is not the same as the Domestic League. Spain and Italy, in particular, are worried that their leagues do TOO GOOD a job training players -- players who happen to be South American, Eastern European, African, or French.

B) The British leagues do not place the same premium on close ball control as other top countries/leagues. No doubt about this. The players who can dribble are by and large imports -- Joe Cole being one exception who proves the rule.

C) Lots of players from countries where they play slow, non-physical football can benefit from playing in England. The young French players who've come to England (Pires, Henry, Anelka, Petit) have adjusted very well and it's helped their games. But they already had bags of skill when they got to England.

D) Given that Americans tend to be more "Northern" than "Southern" in their approach (ie, the emphasis is on running, team play, and not dribbling too much), I would say that the average "Young American" player would improve more in the long run if he could find a league that placed emphasis on developing ball control and creativity -- but where they won't be so outclassed that they will never get a game.

E) Having said that, I'd say France is a place where more Americans should be looking to go. The league feature high technical skill (e.g., Senegal), is fairly well-supported, and high-profile enough that you can get paid and get noticed by bigger clubs after a few years. The Dutch league is fairly similar, and obviously a place where Americans have gone, but I'm surprised more players haven't tried France.

[sinner78]

You're singing the same tune again??
LOL
You never answered any of my points in the last thread.

How many of the yank team from the world cup team have moved to Europe since the end of the world cup??
answer== none


team's aren't exactly lining up to buy your players.
I dont see anyone from spain or italy fighting over any yank players .I dont see any top euro scouts fighting for your signatures...
You're telling them not to go to the premiership even though we haven't even made an offers for your players .
No one else is making offers by the looks of it.
You make it sound as if you can pick and choose the best teams in europe.LOL
Get real and face reality.
Your players aren't as much in demand as you like to think.
Good luck in finding non-existant offers from other nations .

[Excape Goat]

http://sports.yahoo.com/m/world/news/reuters/20020801/reu-juninho.html


That's the reason why no one should play in EPL.

[sinner78]

Originally posted by Excape Goat
http://sports.yahoo.com/m/world/news/reuters/20020801/reu-juninho.html


That's the reason why no one should play in EPL.

i know that hold some kind of personal grudge england but I dont see your point ,weirdo.

The work permit system only applies to non_EC players .that stops us getting swamped with a tidal-wave of cheap imports .Only the best (like veron ,etc..) wll get work permits .Juninho wont have any problems getting a permit.

[Prenn]

As SRM said Juninho will get a work permit.

[kpaulson]

Originally posted by Prenn
As SRM said Juninho will get a work permit. though you've got to admit that the song and dance is a little silly... deny him first, hold a hearing, then reconsider....

As for young yanks going to england, we've been over this before. england might not be the best place for them to develop-- despite how cosmopolitan some teams are, english football still looks different from much of international football.

but as sinner said, we yanks don't exactly have lots of choices. If you can play first team only in MLS or the premiership, the gap in talent between the two leagues would probably more than compensate any perceived developmental shortcomings and I'd send any of our players to West Ham... The only time it gets harder is when you go down divisions: Huddersfield Town plays some awfully ugly football sometimes...

[nobody]

Beggars can't be choosers...

Besides, wouldn't you rather be paid in pounds than francs or guilders?

[Martin Fischer]

Originally posted by nobody
Beggars can't be choosers...

Besides, wouldn't you rather be paid in pounds than francs or guilders?

Why? Isn't there this new thing called euros?

[benine]

well.
for career ($$$$)=EPL GOOD
for development=EPL BAD

Also, guys, check out the England roster; the players that play the best, esp at the WC, are those that see extensive Europe action and that's why all but a handfull of the players on the WC roster were those from euro-competing clubs. Vassell sucked because crash-and-shoot striking doesnt cut it at the international level but gets you buy in the EPL. #1 reason why Phillips SHOULDNT make the squad. Really, I see the point of this quote perfectly; I mean, is Hargraves really just that much more gifted or is it that he's had a better developmental situation than if he were in England? I thought for a large part that Reyna kind of, er, stunk in spots and played a very sloppy physical game at times and thats in large part to not playing Europe this last year having left Rangers. The EPL is great for our keepers, since there is such a premium on high-shot volume, but developing a really good midfielder (Donovan, DMB) or a non-endall striker (McBride, Wolff) on a non-europe EPL team is suicide (and, er, none of those players could make a euro-bound EPL sqaud, sorry, its true).

but that said, the lights dont get much brighter than the EPL, esp. to what the US players are exposed to.
And Armass could sproute into Rio-jr in the priemership.

[dcc134]

Originally posted by Martin Fischer


Why? Isn't there this new thing called euros?

I'd still prefer pounds.

I have no problem with young yanks going to the EPL.

Players develop by being exposed to different styles and systems. That is why England has struggled over the years, none of their players get play outside of the EPL.

[kpaulson]

Originally posted by benine
well.
for career ($$$$)=EPL GOOD
for development=EPL BAD

Also, guys, check out the England roster; the players that play the best, esp at the WC, are those that see extensive Europe action and that's why all but a handfull of the players on the WC roster were those from euro-competing clubs. Don't you think that's a chicken or the egg sort of argument? All the good players go to the best clubs (ie the ones likely to play in Europe...)... And all the good players are most likely to be called up for the national team...

[The Wanderer]

If the money's good, sure they should go. But as someone else said, look at Hargraves. Not developed in the EPL. I'm curious to see what McManaman would have to say about all this too since he's been on the continent for awhile now.

I never said EPL clubs were lining up to buy our players. Nor did I say we had a whole bunch of players capable of playing at that level. I'm saying that if young yanks really want to get better, they should find another league to play in if they have the option.

The premise is that if you're taught kick and chase high energy style as a youth, you should look for a league where the style is the opposite in order to become a more rounded player.

Sure Germany won't cut it, they did after all make the finals of the World Cup. They also had a team in the Champion's League final. How many World Cups have they won compared to England again? Please. All you prove is that penis envy exists as much in Europe as it does in the rest of the world.

The players have chimed in, coaches around the world have given their thoughts. I know you all and the American Anglophiles will still disagree. It's okay---keep living in denial. At least WC '06 will take place in Germany where you have a better chance at playing your up tempo direct 'Premiership' football.

Bruce Arena-"Going to England didn't suddenly make Joe-Max a better player." This was after he scored 5 goals in his first 7 games with Everton.

[The Wanderer]

Originally posted by benine
well.
for career ($$$$)=EPL GOOD
for development=EPL BAD


Well said.

[benine]

Originally posted by kpaulson
Don't you think that's a chicken or the egg sort of argument? All the good players go to the best clubs (ie the ones likely to play in Europe...)... And all the good players are most likely to be called up for the national team...


Not really. When I think of more proof to back this up, look at the sea-saw performances of people like Dyer or Sinclair in connection with the everyotheryear nature of Europe that they've played. When the injury bug hit, why did young players like Dunn, Christie or Garreth Barry get overlooked but lesser players from Europe bound clubs got the selection (i'm looking at you, Ash Cole, Wes Brown).

[dcc134]

There isn't a better manager in the world for developing young talent than Houllier, who manages in the EPL. Wenger isn't far behind, who also manages in the EPL.

You simply can't paint the entire EPL with a single brush. Some clubs are good for your development, some most likely wouldn't be.

Either a player has it or they don't. It is about getting an opportunity to play consistently which controls their development.

Arguing continuely Americans shouldn't go the EPL is simply an ego building exercise, IMHO.

[sinner78]

Originally posted by benine
well.
for career ($$$$)=EPL GOOD
for development=EPL BAD

Also, guys, check out the England roster; the players that play the best, esp at the WC, are those that see extensive Europe action and that's why all but a handfull of the players on the WC roster were those from euro-competing clubs.

ooh what an expert.
Most national teams base their squads around players from the best teams .we get a bulk of our team from man utd ,arsenal ,liverpool ,etc...
Practically the entire squad was from top sides.


Vassell sucked because crash-and-shoot striking doesnt cut it at the international level but gets you buy in the EPL. #1 reason why Phillips SHOULDNT make the squad.

vassell was actually one of the better players agianst sweden .but after that game we altered our system and he didn't get much playing time.
Any suggestion that he "sucked" is laughable and ill-informed.playing for Villa does him no harm.


tfor a large part that Reyna kind of, er, stunk in spots and played a very sloppy physical game at times and thats in large part to not playing Europe this last year having left Rangers.[/b]

Really??
reyna actually played in europe this season.
His final game for rangers was against paris SG in the uefa cup .That just about sums up your level of knowledge.Any poor play can hardly be blamed on playing for sunderland for acouple of months.He only played about 7 games for them .LOL


The EPL is great for our keepers, since there is such a premium on high-shot volume, but developing a really good midfielder (Donovan, DMB) or a non-endall striker (McBride, Wolff) on a non-europe EPL team is suicide (and, er, none of those players could make a euro-bound EPL sqaud, sorry, its true).

You've got no need to worry because no teams have made any bids for your players .You can stay at home in the "mighty" MLS.
The claim that it would be suicide to send players here is comical .
Nobody has made any bids for your players so it aint even worth debating where to send them.

[Boro_lad]

1) Juninho has signed and his work permit appeal has been accepted. As expected. The only reason he didnt get 1 first time isthe principals of the DOE to ensure teams dont just bring in non EU players to just sit on the bench or just linger in the reserves.

2)The prem is a good league to develop in..Just look at people like Micheal owen, Beckham etc.

3) U can have the chance to play at the home of football down by the riverside.
(and get a chicken parmo after the game)

[eric515]

Originally posted by sinner_ronald_monk
team's aren't exactly lining up to buy your players.
I dont see anyone from spain or italy fighting over any yank players .I dont see any top euro scouts fighting for your signatures...
You're telling them not to go to the premiership even though we haven't even made an offers for your players .
No one else is making offers by the looks of it.
You make it sound as if you can pick and choose the best teams in europe.LOL
Get real and face reality.
Your players aren't as much in demand as you like to think.
Good luck in finding non-existant offers from other nations .


From all reports I have seen, our players are in very high demand, the clubs just don't have the money to back up there desire for that player. These European clubs have been offering unacceptable monetary amounts for the players we have.

Add to that the fact that our league is still in season, I don't think you will see any Yanks go to Europe until after the playoffs (or their team's season) end.