Best League in 06/07 part II [R]

[lost]

ok, here are the last 3 european weeks:

week one:

EPL

celtic 1 mu 0

liverpool 2 psv 0

werder bremen 1 chelsea 0

arsenal 3 hamburg 1

leverkusson 0 tottenham 1

feyenord 0 blackburn 0

head to head

newcastle 2 celta 1

LL

real 2 lyon 2

levski 0 barca 2

valencia 2 olympiacos 0

espanyol 6 zulte 2

sevilla 2 braga 0

SA

aek 1 milan 0

sporting 0 inter 1

shaktar 1 roma 0

fenerbahce 3 palermo 0

parma 2 herenveen 1



week 2:

EPL

eintracht frankfurt 0 newcastle 0

LL

grasshoppers 0 sevile 4

osasuna 3 odense 1

celta 1 fenerbache 0

ajax 0 espanyol 2

SA

lens 1 parma 2

livorno 1 maccabi 1



Week 3:


EPL

mu 3 benfica 1

porto 0 arse 0

gala 3 liverpool 2

chelsea 2 levski 0


LL

kiev 2 rm 2

barca 2 wb 0

head to head

roma 1 val 0

SA

ac 0 lille 2

bm 1 inter 1

-----

Points over the past few weeks:

EPL

total

Wins: 6 Draws: 3 Losses: 3

For: 15 Against: 8

cl


Wins: 4 Draws: 1 Losses: 3

For: 12 Against: 7


uefa

Wins: 2 Draws: 2 Losses: 0

For: 3 Against: 1

---------------------------

LL

total


Wins: 9 Draws: 2 Losses: 2

For: 29 Against: 10

cl

Wins: 3 Draws: 2 Losses: 1

For: 10 Against: 5

uefa


Wins: 6 Draws: 0 Losses: 1

For: 19 Against: 5

--------------------------------

SA

total


Wins: 4 Draws: 2 Losses: 4

For: 8 Against: 11


cl

Wins: 2 Draws: 1 Losses: 3

For: 3 Against: 5

uefa


Wins: 2 Draws: 1 Losses: 1

For: 5 Against: 6

-----------------------------------------

Overall for 2006/2007:

EPL:

Overall:

Wins: 33 Losses: 7 Drawn: 10

For: 75 Against: 31

Sides Ko'ed from CL: 0 Sides remaining: 4

Sides Ko'ed from UEFA: 1 Sides remaining: 3


(cl stats:

Wins: 15 Losses: 5 Drawn: 6

For: 38 Against: 17 )



(cl (including qualifiers) stats:

Wins: 18 Losses: 5 Drawn: 5

For: 46 Against: 20)



(Uefa and intertoto stats:

Wins: 15 Losses: 2 Drawn: 5

For: 29 Against: 11)


-----------------------------------------


LL:

Overall:

Wins: 23 Losses: 7 Drawn: 14

For: 84 Against: 36

Sides Ko'ed from CL: 1 Sides remaining: 3

Sides Ko'ed from UEFA: 1 Sides remaining: 4


(cl stats:

Wins: 10 Losses: 3 Drawn: 5

For: 38 Against: 18)



(cl (including qualifiers) stats:

Wins: 11 Losses: 4 Drawn: 7

For: 42 Against: 20)



(Uefa and intertoto stats:

Wins: 12 Losses: 3 Drawn: 7

For: 42 Against: 16)

-------------------------------------------


SA:

Overall:

Wins: 22 Losses: 11 Drawn: 6

For: 49 Against: 34

Sides Ko'ed from CL: 1 Sides remaining: 3

Sides Ko'ed from UEFA: 1 Sides remaining: 3


(cl stats:

Wins: 9 Losses: 6 Drawn: 3

For: 21 Against: 13)


(cl (including qualifiers) stats:

Wins: 11 Losses: 7 Drawn: 4

For: 26 Against: 18)


(Uefa and intertoto stats:

Wins: 11 Losses: 4 Drawn: 2

For: 23 Against: 16)

-----


In the head to heads, Celta lost to Newcastle, Valencia lost to Roma

So. all 4 EPL sides go through top of their groups, and it looks very much like all three uefa cup sides will also go through top. WOW, this is incredible, it really does show you how much class there is in the EPL, all our teams have been dominant, we now get all the advantages of having the second legs of the round of 16 matches played at home, which is of course a huge advantage in continental football. Even without luck, we will more than likely have half of the 8 places up for grabs in the quarter finals, should be fun.

That is, as i have been saying for a while now, 7 EPL sides into the knockout rounds of europe this season. It looks like there will be also 7 La Liga sides through as well, along with 5 to 7 Serie A sides, with Livorno and Palermo perhaps struggling a little to get through to the round of 32. However, as the EPL has the most CL sides, plus being group champions in so many different groups, it is obvious that the EPL is clearly the dominant league at the moment.

Also, with regards to the K/O rounds, La Liga has not been doing very well this year in the head to head match ups with Serie A and the EPL, and as this year more than anyother year before is going to have mostly EPL v Seria A v La Liga match ups in the K/O rounds to determine who advances into the later stages of each competition, I feel that this is a very bad thing for La Liga.

(also, as i have asked before, could someone else please double check my numbers, i will have made mistakes, it is unavoidable, and it would be nice if this thread was absolutely flawless in terms of the factual content.)

[BED-STYPUNDIT]

ok, here are the last 3 european weeks:

week one:

EPL

celtic 1 mu 0

liverpool 2 psv 0

werder bremen 1 chelsea 0

arsenal 3 hamburg 1

leverkusson 0 tottenham 1

feyenord 0 blackburn 0

head to head

newcastle 2 celta 1

LL

real 2 lyon 2

levski 0 barca 2

valencia 2 olympiacos 0

espanyol 6 zulte 2

sevilla 2 braga 0

SA

aek 1 milan 0

sporting 0 inter 1

shaktar 1 roma 0

fenerbahce 3 palermo 0

parma 2 herenveen 1



week 2:

EPL

eintracht frankfurt 0 newcastle 0

LL

grasshoppers 0 sevile 4

osasuna 3 odense 1

celta 1 fenerbache 0

ajax 0 espanyol 2

SA

lens 1 parma 2

livorno 1 maccabi 1



Week 3:


EPL

mu 3 benfica 1

porto 0 arse 0

gala 3 liverpool 2

chelsea 2 levski 0


LL

kiev 2 rm 2

barca 2 wb 0

head to head

roma 1 val 0

SA

ac 0 lille 2

bm 1 inter 1

-----

Points over the past few weeks:

EPL

total

Wins: 6 Draws: 3 Losses: 3

For: 15 Against: 8

cl


Wins: 4 Draws: 1 Losses: 3

For: 12 Against: 7


uefa

Wins: 2 Draws: 2 Losses: 0

For: 3 Against: 1

---------------------------

LL

total


Wins: 9 Draws: 2 Losses: 2

For: 29 Against: 10

cl

Wins: 3 Draws: 2 Losses: 1

For: 10 Against: 5

uefa


Wins: 6 Draws: 0 Losses: 1

For: 19 Against: 5

--------------------------------

SA

total


Wins: 4 Draws: 2 Losses: 4

For: 8 Against: 11


cl

Wins: 2 Draws: 1 Losses: 3

For: 3 Against: 5

uefa


Wins: 2 Draws: 1 Losses: 1

For: 5 Against: 6

-----------------------------------------

Overall for 2006/2007:

EPL:

Overall:

Wins: 33 Losses: 7 Drawn: 10

For: 75 Against: 31

Sides Ko'ed from CL: 0 Sides remaining: 4

Sides Ko'ed from UEFA: 1 Sides remaining: 3


(cl stats:

Wins: 15 Losses: 5 Drawn: 6

For: 38 Against: 17 )



(cl (including qualifiers) stats:

Wins: 18 Losses: 5 Drawn: 5

For: 46 Against: 20)



(Uefa and intertoto stats:

Wins: 15 Losses: 2 Drawn: 5

For: 29 Against: 11)


-----------------------------------------


LL:

Overall:

Wins: 23 Losses: 7 Drawn: 14

For: 84 Against: 36

Sides Ko'ed from CL: 1 Sides remaining: 3

Sides Ko'ed from UEFA: 1 Sides remaining: 4


(cl stats:

Wins: 10 Losses: 3 Drawn: 5

For: 38 Against: 18)



(cl (including qualifiers) stats:

Wins: 11 Losses: 4 Drawn: 7

For: 42 Against: 20)



(Uefa and intertoto stats:

Wins: 12 Losses: 3 Drawn: 7

For: 42 Against: 16)

-------------------------------------------


SA:

Overall:

Wins: 22 Losses: 11 Drawn: 6

For: 49 Against: 34

Sides Ko'ed from CL: 1 Sides remaining: 3

Sides Ko'ed from UEFA: 1 Sides remaining: 3


(cl stats:

Wins: 9 Losses: 6 Drawn: 3

For: 21 Against: 13)


(cl (including qualifiers) stats:

Wins: 11 Losses: 7 Drawn: 4

For: 26 Against: 18)


(Uefa and intertoto stats:

Wins: 11 Losses: 4 Drawn: 2

For: 23 Against: 16)

-----


In the head to heads, Celta lost to Newcastle, Valencia lost to Roma

So. all 4 EPL sides go through top of their groups, and it looks very much like all three uefa cup sides will also go through top. WOW, this is incredible, it really does show you how much class there is in the EPL, all our teams have been dominant, we now get all the advantages of having the second legs of the round of 16 matches played at home, which is of course a huge advantage in continental football. Even without luck, we will more than likely have half of the 8 places up for grabs in the quarter finals, should be fun.

That is, as i have been saying for a while now, 7 EPL sides into the knockout rounds of europe this season. It looks like there will be also 7 La Liga sides through as well, along with 5 to 7 Serie A sides, with Livorno and Palermo perhaps struggling a little to get through to the round of 32. However, as the EPL has the most CL sides, plus being group champions in so many different groups, it is obvious that the EPL is clearly the dominant league at the moment.

Also, with regards to the K/O rounds, La Liga has not been doing very well this year in the head to head match ups with Serie A and the EPL, and as this year more than anyother year before is going to have mostly EPL v Seria A v La Liga match ups in the K/O rounds to determine who advances into the later stages of each competition, I feel that this is a very bad thing for La Liga.

(also, as i have asked before, could someone else please double check my numbers, i will have made mistakes, it is unavoidable, and it would be nice if this thread was absolutely flawless in terms of the factual content.)


Yup, but that doesn't mean that the four EPL sides are all better than Lyon and Barcelona on their best day.

Chelsea have sort of proven that, but Boca was without Wto'o and messi for the second game, and Eto'o for the first I think. And Lyon has been quality, but we will see if they can handle the pressure of now being amongst the favorites to win.

EPL, the most entertaining and enthralling league, where the bottom teams can upset the top teams on any given day. That's the case in all leagues, but i think its more prevalent in the EPL.

[lost]

Boca?

Plus was it really necesary to quote the entire peice? I can't see what this has added to your points, and just serves to clutter up the thread and make it less accessible.

[BocaFan]

I can't see what this has added to your points, and just serves to clutter up the thread and make it less accessible.

So does creating a sock and having him agree with every piece of nonsense you write. But that never stopped you before.

Also, with regards to the K/O rounds, La Liga has not been doing very well this year in the head to head match ups with Serie A and the EPL, and as this year more than anyother year before is going to have mostly EPL v Seria A v La Liga match ups in the K/O rounds to determine who advances into the later stages of each competition, I feel that this is a very bad thing for La Liga.


:confused: Barca drew and lost to Chelsea. Valencia beat Roma. That's 1 win, 1 loss, 1 draw for La Liga against Serie "A" and EPL sides in meaningful CL games this season**. Not great, but certainly not bad either.

** Didn't count this week's loss by the Valencia "C" team to Roma since its not meaningful or indicative of anything.

[Clan]

Lets have a nice tidy discussion this time eh?

Personal insults, trolling and flaming will be removed, as will the poster if I'm in a pissy mood.

Now then, good point about being champion of one group meaning little overall, given that not all groups are of equal strength.

But, that being said, our English teams did top all groups, where some where quite hard.To dismiss this is clearly showing a certain bias.

What does it all mean going into the knock out stage?
Absolutely nothing really, other than to set the foundation that this year the PL can claim to be the best in Europe.

Time will tell.

[lost]

Didn't count this week's loss by the Valencia

Yes, i have noticed that you often ignore details which don't corroborate with your opinions. Also the Uefa cup will have many head to head encounters and in this Spain has not looked very convincing either. But if you had read my post you would see that this point was already clear.

[benito camelpene]

Counting the Valencia v Roma game is ridiculous considering Valencia easily won their group so that last game was meaningless to them but to each their own. Kudos to the 4 PL teams for topping their groups. I have to say that I don't see Manchester United and Liverpool going very far in this tourny. Even though they are second in the PL I believe Chelsea have the squad and tactics to go far and Arsenal are a solid team that I believe will do well this season.

A healthy Barcelona is my clear cut favorite with Chelsea, Lyon, and Inter Milan just behind them.

A healthy Valencia can reach the QF's if they draw the weak teams in the last 16(Celtic, PSV, Lille). I also fancy their chances against any Premiership team not named Chelsea. I believe Real Madrid will make the QF's but after that who knows. This team is capable of winning the Champions League but also capable of some ordinary performances. Which Real Madrid will show up? Who knows? Hopefully Capello brings out their best.

Lyon is a great team who now possess the experience in the CL so a Semifinal place is not out of the question for this team. I'd like to see them do well. Inter Milan...Same story as Real Madrid. A team of underachievers capable of great things. I'd like to think that they've gotten their s--t together but I doubt it. I haven't seen Roma play too much but Totti is on fire and I can see him taking his team to the QF's.

I don't think Celtic, PSV or Lille will provide any surprises.

Barcelona to repeat. <--A little premature I know but that's who I have my money on.

[blanc]

Barcelona, Real Madrid, Chelsea and Lyon to make the semi finals.

Lyon and Valencia definitely in the QF along with ManU. That last 'spot' is up for grabs imo, between Inter and AC Milan.

[Naughty by Nature]

What a worthless read.

[Karloski]

Now that the group stages are over. We can look at the mini table, comparing the head to head matches between the top 5 leagues during the 2006/2007 champions league campaign.

Premiership: W: 6 D: 1 L: 1
Primera Liga: W: 2 D: 3 L: 3
Bunesliga: W: 2 D: 2 L: 4
Ligue 1: W: 2 D: 2 L: 2
Seria A: W: 1 D: 2 L: 3

Wow. So far not even a contest. The Premiership is way out in front, with the other leagues pretty even.

[Visca...]

What a worthless read.
The fact that games like Roma vs. Valencia where nothing was at stake are accounted is a joke enough.

[lost]

Karlo, can you do 2 more of those mini league tables, one for both uefa and cl, and one for just uefa? obviously, this season more than any other before we have an absolute centralisation of teams taken from the top couple of leagues, head to head will determine virtually everything from this point onwards.

lets hope uefa dont try and screw the british in next fridays draw, but we all know they will. celtic will be playing an english side, then expect more epl matchups for the quarter finals.

[Visca...]

Karlo, can you do 2 more of those mini league tables, one for both uefa and cl, and one for just uefa?
lol, talking to your sock. Priceless
obviously, this season more than any other before we have an absolute centralisation of teams taken from the top couple of leagues, head to head will determine virtually everything from this point onwards.
Yeah, parity within a league won't determine it at all :rolleyes:

While Man Utd. has a 16 point lead to 3rd place Arsenal, Barca has only a 3 point lead to 3rd place Sevilla. :p
lets hope uefa dont try and screw the british in next fridays draw, but we all know they will. celtic will be playing an english side, then expect more epl matchups for the quarter finals.
Disclaimer already?

--------------------

Thread title needs to be renamed "Successfulness of European countries in UEFA Competitions" or "Head-to-Head European countries in UEFA Competitions" because "Best League in 06/07" is totally wrong. Completely misleading.

[Joe_Sanchez]

Arsenal are a solid team that I believe will do well this season.

Arsenal are certainly not solid this year. I can't see Arsenal or Liverpool winning the CL this year, but anything is possible.

My top 4 would be:

Barcelona
Chelsea
Man Utd
Inter Milan

They could of course play each other in the last 16.

[BocaFan]

Karlo, can you do 2 more of those mini league tables, one for both uefa and cl, and one for just uefa? obviously, this season more than any other before we have an absolute centralisation of teams taken from the top couple of leagues, head to head will determine virtually everything from this point onwards.
I don't think its much different than last season. How many EPL, Serie "a" and La liga sides made the last 16 last season? About the same #, iirc.


lets hope uefa dont try and screw the british in next fridays draw, but we all know they will. celtic will be playing an english side, then expect more epl matchups for the quarter finals.

Celtic is one of the easiest draws a first-place team can get. And there's at least a 50% chance that Celtic will draw an EPL club. So don't come on here a week from now saying "I told you so". You are not exactly going out on the limb with that prediction.

[BED-STYPUNDIT]

The fact that games like Roma vs. Valencia where nothing was at stake are accounted is a joke enough.

If that's the case, then we shouldn't count the Chelsea vs Sofi match as well?

And by the way, the thread title isn't misleading.

This thing will still continue , and LA liga and Seria A fans will flock to the thread and say, "see, we're the best team" if the EPL crashes out completely if it happens.

People are getting mad, but the results don' lie. The EPL (and Britiain if you count Celtic) clearly was the winner in the group stages. That doesn't mean anything in the knockout, but the results don't lie.

[Visca...]

If that's the case, then we shouldn't count the Chelsea vs Sofi match as well?
Wrong. 1st and 2nd place was still up for grabs, kind of. If Chelsea lost to Sofia and Barca beat Bremen, or Bremen beat Barca, Barca/Bremen would've finished first and Chelsea second. Of course the chances that Chelsea woud've lost to Sofia are slim, but the game had some meaning nonetheless.

Roma vs. Valencia had absolutely nothing to play for. Valencia was already gonna go as 1st and Roma as 2nd whether Roma beat them or not. Roma won 1-0 and Valencia still went as 1st. Roma beating Valencia 15-0 still wouldn't have mattered. So as you can see determining the best league like this has its major discrepancies.
And by the way, the thread title isn't misleading.
It is very misleading. This thread is not determining the best league in 2006/2007, this thread is looking at head-to head records between European countries in UEFA competitions. The fact that each leagues aren't even being looked at individually shows this thread is a flaw in itself.
This thing will still continue , and LA liga and Seria A fans will flock to the thread and say, "see, we're the best team" if the EPL crashes out completely if it happens.

People are getting mad, but the results don' lie. The EPL (and Britiain if you count Celtic) clearly was the winner in the group stages. That doesn't mean anything in the knockout, but the results don't lie.
No doubt that the english teams "won" the group stage, whatever that means anyway.

Still doesn't say that the EPL is the best league in 2006/2007, it's saying that the english clubs are playing good in Europe right now.

[Clan]

What a worthless read.


Yes, indeed your 'contribution' was.

Feel free to pass this thread by.

[BED-STYPUNDIT]

Wrong. 1st and 2nd place was still up for grabs, kind of. If Chelsea lost to Sofia and Barca beat Bremen, or Bremen beat Barca, Barca/Bremen would've finished first and Chelsea second. Of course the chances that Chelsea woud've lost to Sofia are slim, but the game had some meaning nonetheless.

Roma vs. Valencia had absolutely nothing to play for. Valencia was already gonna go as 1st and Roma as 2nd whether Roma beat them or not. Roma won 1-0 and Valencia still went as 1st. Roma beating Valencia 15-0 still wouldn't have mattered. So as you can see determining the best league like this has its major discrepancies.

It is very misleading. This thread is not determining the best league in 2006/2007, this thread is looking at head-to head records between European countries in UEFA competitions. The fact that each leagues aren't even being looked at individually shows this thread is a flaw in itself.

No doubt that the english teams "won" the group stage, whatever that means anyway.

Still doesn't say that the EPL is the best league in 2006/2007, it's saying that the english clubs are playing good in Europe right now.

I didn't say that, and we aren't in 2007 yet. This is a season lolng thing. Something tells me that if it were La Liga have the numbers that the EPL had in the CL, you would be all over La Liga right now.

I know people don't like England, but don't let bias fool you please. The EPL i winning, that doesn't mean La Liga or Seria A not going to win, but the EPL as a whole is winning so far as the best league for this year.

[Visca...]

I didn't say that, and we aren't in 2007 yet. This is a season lolng thing.
Agree. That's why I wouldn't jump into conclusions like Lost/Karloski, the thread starter, is doing only to most likely get bit in the ass later on. If you don't know, he has already declared the EPL is and will be the best league in 2006/2007 by personal choice/convenience of course.
Something tells me that if it were La Liga have the numbers that the EPL had in the CL, you would be all over La Liga right now.
Not really since I wouldn't base the best league on Champions League results without even looking at the league itself.
I know people don't like England, but don't let bias fool you please. The EPL i winning, that doesn't mean La Liga or Seria A not going to win, but the EPL as a whole is winning so far as the best league for this year.
EPL TEAMS in the Champions League are "better" right now, the EPL LEAGUE is not. Look at parity/point difference and you'll see.

Since you've just come into this thread, I suggest you read the 1st part where Lost got explained and explained all over again by pretty much everyone why his formula is weak, yet he's still trying to convince...himself really. He had to create a sock (Karloski) to agree with him :(

1st PART -> http://www.bigsoccer.com/forum/showthread.php?t=407473