View Full Version : Who is the best Keeper in the PL? Where does Howard rank? [R]
Juan Luis Guerra
11 Nov 2006, 09:34 AM
I've seeing him playing lately and he just looks better than ever. Excellent range and control. I think he should be among the top 3 at the very least. If he continues playing like this, dont expect him returning to MLS within the next 10 years.
DurlP
11 Nov 2006, 09:41 AM
Thread closed.
evanpemsocr
11 Nov 2006, 09:53 AM
Top five no doubt. I think Lehman is the best though. But, I may be a little biased.;)
DaPrince84
11 Nov 2006, 10:15 AM
Top five no doubt. I think Lehman is the best though. But, I may be a little biased. ;)
c/s ;)
Keepers better than Howard in the premiership:
1. Lehman (Gunners)
2. Healthy Cech (Chelsea)
3. Van De Sar (Manure)
3. Shay Given (Geordies)
4. Friedel (Blackburn)
5. Reina (Liverpool)
then Howard
former baller
11 Nov 2006, 11:59 AM
No, he is not.
...oh lord, always the same we are the best...any fringe american player is not always the best when they crack the starting line up. 1-3 years in any league does not put you at the top of the food chain above proven, established, accomplished veterans of major championships. Lets hope he has a good career then make these evaluations. Clearly he is good enough to be the starting keeper for Everton. Clearly he is not good enough to be the starting keeper for Manure.
dustcowpoke
11 Nov 2006, 12:19 PM
5. Reina (Liverpool)
This must be a joke. Reina's mistakes are the reason why Liverpool aren't even close to title position. He'll be gone in January, Carson or Green to Liverpool.
dark knight
11 Nov 2006, 12:22 PM
Thread closed.
Read my mind. But I renamed it instead.
Juan Luis Guerra
11 Nov 2006, 12:57 PM
c/s ;)
Keepers better than Howard in the premiership:
1. Lehman (Gunners)
2. Healthy Cech (Chelsea)
3. Van De Sar (Manure)
3. Shay Given (Geordies)
4. Friedel (Blackburn)
5. Reina (Liverpool)
then Howard
Friedel and Lehman better than Howard, I dont think so. Maybe in the next life.
dustcowpoke
11 Nov 2006, 01:17 PM
Friedel and Lehman better than Howard, I dont think so. Maybe in the next life.
The guy obviously hasn't watched one Liverpool game this season, Reina is horrible.
I'll bet he's one of those guys that rates players on how their ratings are on FIFA 06. :D
Hed7181
11 Nov 2006, 01:19 PM
Friedel and Lehman better than Howard, I dont think so. Maybe in the next life.
I don't like Lehman, but he is good. If you think Howard is better than Friedel, I'm not really sure there's anything we can say to you. You clearly have a personal bias (just as I do the other way most likely).
El Steve
11 Nov 2006, 01:42 PM
No, he is not.
...oh lord, always the same we are the best...any fringe american player is not always the best when they crack the starting line up. 1-3 years in any league does not put you at the top of the food chain above proven, established, accomplished veterans of major championships. Lets hope he has a good career then make these evaluations. Clearly he is good enough to be the starting keeper for Everton. Clearly he is not good enough to be the starting keeper for Manure.
Yeah but being American doesn't make a player marginal at best, as you seem to argue in every post.
Edwin Van Der Sar is a tremendous goaltender... I don't think anyone will argue that.
But really, aside from the regulars... Van Der Sar, Friedel, Given, Cech, Robinson, Lehman... who are you going to say stands heads and shoulders above Howard?
People only seem to remember the inconsistant Howard of the past two years, as him winning EPL Goaltender of the Year his first year, 'obviously', must have been a fluke.
We all know he's incredbily athletic and can make many saves that some of the older, more consistant goalies can't make... everyone's been worrying about his consistancy and ability to handle the ball at times.
So far this year, I really haven't heard (though, to be honest, I haven't seen too much of him) any major complaints about him stinking up the joints... generally it's to the contrary.
It'd be really hard for me to rank him below the GKs I mentioned... he's probably a notch below the top echelon of GKs in the EPL, but is still very strong, IMHO.
lotharis1
11 Nov 2006, 01:52 PM
Anyone who saw NE Revs vs. Chicago Fire would understand why I am adding Matt Reis to the best keepers in the world list.
Anyone who saw NE Revs vs. DC United might also understand.
The fact of the matter is, what truly makes great keepers stand out, is games where the D blows, and the keepr bails a team out time and time again. Then what makes the best stand out ahead of the greats, is when they show their worth during a penalty shootout. As great as everyone claims Buffon is, he was shown to be worthless at the spot in 2006. That is why Lehman got the acclaim he did. That is why in times past Olie Kahn was given the credit he got.
Matt Reis has regularly bailed the Revs out. With a 3 man defense in front of him, over 32 games in a high scoring league, Matt Reis has a 1.09 GAA. On top of that he has been counted on to stop pk's, and take them. To me that puts him right up there with keepers like Kahn, Lehmann, Ricardo, etc., and certainly above Howard.
If I am going into a must win game, I want Matt Reis in the net.
Granted, you will all knock him because its MLS... but MLS or not, when he saves 2 out of 4 penalties faced, in a playoff match, thats great keeping. When he saves 2/3 pks faced in the regular season of that same year (getting his hand on the 3rd, and knocking it to the post before it went in)... that's great keeping. So he has faced 7 penalties this year and stopped 4 of them. Go on... knock him for that...
lotharis1
11 Nov 2006, 02:08 PM
For those of you wondering how that last post relates to the EPL...
If you can't even qualify as one of the top 3 American keepers, how can you qualify for a discussion of best in the EPL?
Clearly Keller, Freidel, Hahnemann, and I would also put Reis up there, are all better than Howard.
Not to mention you all passed over such keepers as Neimi, Sorenson, Schwarzer, and Ian Walker (who I think is the most udnerated keeper in england).
How can you tell me Howard, who regularly rid the pine is in the top 5 of the EPL? That's ludicrous.
What does he have, 1 game verse Arsenal and everyone goes on about how great he is? Or are you going to tell me he's good because he has a low goals allowed average in a very low scoring defensive league...
If he were not American you would not be thinking about the guy right now.
superdave
11 Nov 2006, 02:17 PM
He's not even the best American keeper in the Prem.
I have to say the people listing Lehman at #1 make me laugh. He's having a good run of form, but he's definitely NOT the best. I'm not even sure I'd put him in the top 5 based on proven ability (as opposed to current form.)
superdave
11 Nov 2006, 02:19 PM
But really, aside from the regulars... Van Der Sar, Friedel, Given, Cech, Robinson, Lehman... who are you going to say stands heads and shoulders above Howard?
Allow me to translate.
"Outside of 30% of Prem keepers, how many of the other 13 are alot better than Howard?"
bigjoe
11 Nov 2006, 03:00 PM
Given we've already had one season of Howard being named the 'top keeper'....only for him to lose form materially with lots of games left- wouldn't it make sense to freeze this discussion until next March?
After all, we can hardly even count Howard's 2 1/2 last years in the discussion. And 12 games does not a season make.
Howard's big test- and one that can raise the issue- is putting an entire season of this form in the window (similar to Friedel in 2001-2002)
lotharis1
11 Nov 2006, 03:13 PM
Allow me to translate.
"Outside of 30% of Prem keepers, how many of the other 13 are alot better than Howard?"Yeah... you saw that too...
Other than that... he might be mid-pack EPL... which ranks him where in the world? Which warrants our discussing this based off of?
DaPrince84
11 Nov 2006, 04:47 PM
Friedel and Lehman better than Howard, I dont think so. Maybe in the next life.
im gonna laugh at you and not even give you an answer...
The guy obviously hasn't watched one Liverpool game this season, Reina is horrible.
I'll bet he's one of those guys that rates players on how their ratings are on FIFA 06.
please... if u judge players off ten games played in a season instead of their body of work then Thierry Henry and Andriy Schevchenko would be garbage... Reina is in the top tier of keepers in the premiership
not only that, but Liverpool's defense is garbage...
Hammerette
11 Nov 2006, 05:49 PM
This must be a joke. Reina's mistakes are the reason why Liverpool aren't even close to title position. He'll be gone in January, Carson or Green to Liverpool.
If you mean Robert Green of West Ham, no team will sell their starting keeper half way through a season, especially one who was only signed in August and therefore on a long contract.
DurlP
11 Nov 2006, 06:17 PM
Read my mind. But I renamed it instead.was a friendly jab/joke at you and Wahoo anyway...:D ;)