Who will stop Liverpool in the EPL 2002-03?

[Ruud van Nistelrooy]

Originally posted by Bauser
People shouldn't mix money with success on the field all the time. Look at Barcelona over the years. A 115,000 capacity stadium with big name stars unmatched anywhere in the world and they still can't boast more titles in the European Cup than Red Star Belgrade or Steaua Bucharest.

Who says Man Utd will continue to win when Sir Alex one day steps down and retires? How will they cope with a new man in charge after almost 20 years with the same manager? How many promosing youngsters have they produced there since the Beckham generation? Did last season's performances indicate more success this year?

Football is an unpredictable game. Just ask AC Milan what happened in the mid-90s when success suddenly dried up after dominating for a long time. In 1994 when they outplayed Barcelona in the European Cup final people talked about total domination. They had 7-8 successful seasons behind them and looked destined to conquer everything and be unbeatable for many years more. A couple of years later, there was nothing left.

You can't plan to far ahead in this game and predictions that say United will overtake Liverpool's all-time hegemony within a given number of years are worth squat.


But then saying Liverpool will be the most successful club in football for the next 20 years because they bought Diouf is a bit risky as well isn't it

[Matt Clark]

Originally posted by Ruud van Nistelrroy

Please, look at man utd's squad - how many of our best players haven't been bought for 20 odd million, Gary Neville, Paul Scholes, Giggs, Beckham, keane, butt, solskjaer, irwin.... I mean, of course we have Veron and Nistelrooy now but shedloads of our players we've had for ages and didn't cost millions. Our best players are probably the ones who have been in the squad for years and years, our world class midfield is not Veron, its Keane, Giggs, Scholes and Beckham - they've been with us for years, and with the exception of Keane maybe, we've trained them to be the best

I think a club that counts coming third in the premiership as a major, major, major loss and disgrace can't be said to be a naff, unsuccessful club.

and if indeed money does not mean success, then why do you believe man utd are better than Liverpool because of nothing more than money?

Erm … you need to read my post again.

[Ruud van Nistelrooy]

Originally posted by Matt Clark


Erm … you need to read my post again.

Can't be arsed arguing anymore since you don't seem to have much of a response to my statement

[Matt Clark]

Sigh ...

OK then - you misunderstood my point. A quick re-read would have made that obvious.

My assertion was that Manchester United have not enjoyed success because of their money, but rather because they have enjoyed the fruits of an outstanding generation of players, all developed by their youth set-up. The wider point being that money alone does not guarantee success - you need good players, good coaches, a good manager and the luck to see all those things combine to maximum effect.

[Motterman]

As a Manchester United supporter, I would like to state:

A few years ago we could only dream of ever matching the success that Liverpool has enjoyed over the years. They are a strong club today and will prove a major obstacle to our effort to match their League Championships record. However; I think that we are getting closer to this goal every day, and I would like to think that maybe we could even get 1 or 2 more European Cups out of our current squad, and maybe in another 5-8 years we could rebuild for another run at overtaking Liverpool in that too. I don't discount Liverpool as a force in any game or competition simply because of their defense and St. Michael. Whereas, I 'm sure that even the most ardent "Manyoo haters" out there aren't thrilled with having to contend with us either. Even last season when our defense, at times, resembled a sieve, we still managed a favorable goal difference. As I stated in a previous message, I think if we get Ferdinand and another Quality Defender, I see us winning the League, making a better run at the FA Cup, and maybe a Champions League Finals appearance. I see Arsenal and Liverpool close on our heels in second and third, with Newcastle and Chelsea (and maybe Leeds) fighting for the last Champs League spot.

[Cokane]

Sorry to interupt this discussion but what impact do you think Damian Duff would have were he to sign for Liverpool??

[Motterman]

Originally posted by Cokane
Sorry to interupt this discussion but what impact do you think Damian Duff would have were he to sign for Liverpool??

They'd be closer to equaling Arsenal's talent rather than Manchester United's. There used to be a "gap" between Manchester United and Arsenal, but it's so small now, you can't really call it that anymore.

[soccerfan220]

I think it won't be Liverpool's year. THey aren't good enough. It would be arsenal's, but their french players will probably be out of form. Manchester United, i think, unfortunately will take it, if they stay free of injuries. I think Liverpool wll get second and Leeds won't do anything again and Rio will move at the end of the season.

[Cokane]

I honestly believe that if Liverpool sign Bowyer and Duff they will be difficult to stop this season. These two players, along with Diouf and Diao, will add an attacking dimension that has been lacking before...

[YanksFC]

Originally posted by Matt Clark
Liverpool can do it. We have the defence, we have the firepower. What we have so far lacked is a consistently excellent midfield unit. Individually there is much to commend in there, but collectively they have not all fired at the same time for a sufficiently lengthy period. Last season Gerrard struggled to recapture his form of the previous campaign, Spud was Spud and Smicer was, well ... crap.

The addition of Cheyrou excites me - he is the real deal and could well do the business. Distaste for the man aside, Bowyer will also be a massive shot in the arm for the midfield unit.

So, if the midfield fires throughout, then I can see us doing it. If not, it's United all the way.

Precisely, Matt. Anyone who follows Liverpool closely knows that the midfield is the key. Even after watching a fair amount of Le Championnat on FSW last season, I never got to see Cheyrou play. If, however, he is as good as everyone says he is, that could provide a nice boost. Gerrard needs to be more consistent. When he is at his best, there is a creativity present in midfield that is difficult to stop. And Bowyer would provide some strength if his transfer comes through.

All that being said, Man U will still be tough to beat, especially if Rio comes into the side. Perhaps Barthez will commit more clown-like gaffes and make things difficult for the Red Devils.

[kerpow]

Liverpool have a reasonable team now, the strongest for many years but I can't help feeling that if Hypia or Henchoz were to break a leg they'd be fighting Leeds and Chelsea for a place in the UEFA cup. I also agree with many that their new signings will struggle to make an impact in the first half of the season.

[wjschaefer]

I think Liverpool will stop Liverpool...

It will be between Arsenal and Man U and the winner will be the healthier team throughout the season.

[markdickson]

Latest odds from Ladbrokes on the Premiership:

Manchester United 5/4 Fav.
Arsenal 7/4
Liverpool 3/1
Leeds United 14/1
Chelsea 18/1
Newcastle United 28/1
Manchester City 100/1
West Bromwich Albion 1000/1 :)

For the drop:

West Bromwich Albion 1/2 Fav.
Birmingham City 4/5
Bolton Wanderers 5/4
Charlton Athletic 3/1
Southampton 2/1
Sunderland 2/1
Everton 11/4
Manchester City 5/1

[Motterman]

Originally posted by markdickson
Latest odds from Ladbrokes on the Premiership:

Manchester City 5/1

Easy Money.

[kopiteinkc]

Originally posted by wjschaefer
I think Liverpool will stop Liverpool...


Care to explain what you mean here?

[Motterman]

Originally posted by kopiteinkc


Care to explain what you mean here?

I think he means that Liverpool will screw it up again this year, and they will end up winning **********-all.

[Bauser]

Originally posted by Motterman
I think if we get Ferdinand and another Quality Defender, I see us winning the League, making a better run at the FA Cup, and maybe a Champions League Finals appearance.
I'm not joining the Rio hype. It has gone too far. The fee paid for him is ridiculous even in today's mad footballing world. (£35 mill if my source is correct). We are talking about a central defender for God's sake! It's not like he is gonna win matches for you alone like an attacking player can.

Rio goes with the money obviously. Leeds has almost an equally good team, although younger and more promosing, and he leaves them for Man U "Because I wanna play in the CL". Golddigger!

United will concede their usual +45 goals in the league regardless of who is signed. Their attacking style hurts their defensive game. Rio won't change that. He will only be one of four back there. Not a miracle man.

[wjschaefer]

Originally posted by Motterman


I think he means that Liverpool will screw it up again this year, and they will end up winning **********-all.

exactly

[Syncope]

Duff and Bowyer would be meaningful additions to any team, anywhere. Add to that Diouf, if he keeps form, and Houllier will have a lot of options. I wouldn't say they're the team to beat, but it'll make Liverpool, Arsenal, and ManU even (each with their varying strengths and weaknesses). I'm the opinion that it's injury that decides a season, if a team remains in all competitions for a long time.

[Doctor Stamen]

Originally posted by markdickson
Latest odds from Ladbrokes on the Premiership:

Manchester United 5/4 Fav.
Arsenal 7/4
Liverpool 3/1
Leeds United 14/1
Chelsea 18/1
Newcastle United 28/1
Manchester City 100/1
West Bromwich Albion 1000/1 :)

For the drop:

West Bromwich Albion 1/2 Fav.
Birmingham City 4/5
Bolton Wanderers 5/4
Charlton Athletic 3/1
Southampton 2/1
Sunderland 2/1
Everton 11/4
Manchester City 5/1

What are Blackburn's odds for championship and relegation. Not that neither will happen. Top 8 would be good.