Today’s Crerand and Bowyer.

[Dark Savante]

Very interesting show. Some key points:

-Fergie is furious that Rossi is sitting on the bench at Newcastle. Rossi was sent there on the understanding he would start games. If he would have known Rossi wouldn’t be starting he’d never have sent him there….. this is no surprise to me at all. As I stated in the Rossi thread, Newcastle’s set of strikers are shite, and Rossi> * except maybe Martins.

-Jonny Evans’ loan to Antwerp ends in January.

-Darron Gibson played his first game for Antwerp this weekend. He came on as a sub for Campbell on 63mins.

-Danny Simpson is not happy with how he is being used at Antwerp. He says he cannot play to his full potential with so much to do. He is effectively there only man on the right side of the pitch playing both winger and FB? I think this means he is motoring up and down with no protection.

[Teso Dos Bichos]

Thanks for the update. Good news all round.

Ferguson must obviously rate Rossi or is just grumpy in his old age.
Evans can be moved to a decent league.
Gibson is back from injury.
Simpson is gone but not forgotten. Hopefully he can get the situation fixed or move on elsewhere.

[johno]

Fantastic news - even for Simpson.

Fergie needs to lay down the law for Roeder. Lose Rossi if he doesn't start 2 out of the next 3 matches he's available for.

Who's taking wagers that Evans will return to fight for a place in the squad?

Gibson will take Belgium by storm. Hopefully he can earn himself a loan to NEC next season.

On the Simpson front. I think its obviously hard for him and a bit unfair, but at the same time it will really improve his stamina and probably hone his concentration and decision making.

Playing in Roberto Carlos mode isn't easy, it often isn't smart - but if he can use the time to hone his offensive game and his recovery speed he will benefit greatly.

[biro]

No mention of the Torres scoop? It was also mentioned on the show that Torres had been interviewed over the weekend and he stated how 3 clubs had met the valuation of 35m euros (one of them was Spurs!) but after 2 meetings with Utd he only wanted to join us. However, we never made a bid, which he believes was down to us not having the money! He signed his 12 month extension in the belief united will move for him next season and he'll get his dream move.

[Dark Savante]

Fantastic news - even for Simpson.

Fergie needs to lay down the law for Roeder. Lose Rossi if he doesn't start 2 out of the next 3 matches he's available for.
I bet all talk of extending that loan has been put on hold, for sure. What a joke. He could have done the same thing here. :mad:


On the Simpson front. I think its obviously hard for him and a bit unfair, but at the same time it will really improve his stamina and probably hone his concentration and decision making.

Playing in Roberto Carlos mode isn't easy, it often isn't smart - but if he can use the time to hone his offensive game and his recovery speed he will benefit greatly.
I was surprised in the loans thread at the comments that Simpson isn't doing well, at least it's more understandable now. He must have his work cut out, no doubt it'll make him even better, in fact, such conditions are brilliant for us because when he goes back to one job he'll feel like superman. It must be exhuasting and frustrating for him though!

[Dark Savante]

No mention of the Torres scoop? It was also mentioned on the show that Torres had been interviewed over the weekend and he stated how 3 clubs had met the valuation of 35m euros (one of them was Spurs!) but after 2 meetings with Utd he only wanted to join us. However, we never made a bid, which he believes was down to us not having the money! He signed his 12 month extension in the belief united will move for him next season and he'll get his dream move.
The guys here will tell you I had some info about Torres over the Summer...it's all well dodgy as it seems something went on....but the club seems to be in a mess and I'm staying well clear of commenting on Torres from now on. It really does seem like we can't afford him..

[MtP07]

The guys here will tell you I had some info about Torres over the Summer...

DS = WUM ;) :p

[biro]

£14m for Carrick, another £14-18m pencilled in for Hargreaves. The Hargreaves money is still there so another £23m for Torres next summer wouldn't be unreasonable, particularly if say, O'Shea and Silvestre were sold on for £5m a piece.

[Dark Savante]

DS = WUM ;)
:o :(

[Charleysurf]

The guys here will tell you I had some info about Torres over the Summer...it's all well dodgy as it seems something went on....but the club seems to be in a mess and I'm staying well clear of commenting on Torres from now on. It really does seem like we can't afford him..
After Torres' great WC performances I reckon Atletico would have wanted more than 35m euro (24mGBP)for him. Even if it was 24mGBP that they were quoted then that was still a lot of money when United knew they still had to buy a DM.

Obviously the days of United paying more than 40mGBP out in net tranfers in one offseason are long gone. We'll be lucky to afford half that in one year. As the Hargreaves thing did not happen maybe we'll have more to play with next year. Then again, maybe not.

[Teso Dos Bichos]

They wanted an auction that they did not get. Torres signing an extension was only done with the knowledge that he release fee would be lowed to that figure, eliminating the problem.

[jayro75]

£14m for Carrick, another £14-18m pencilled in for Hargreaves. The Hargreaves money is still there so another £23m for Torres next summer wouldn't be unreasonable, particularly if say, O'Shea and Silvestre were sold on for £5m a piece.


Who do I have to blow...;)

[rossgreen]

Is Fergie putting off buying a DM because he is waiting on Gibson?

[MtP07]

Who do I have to blow...;)

Talk about taking one for the team... :eek: :p

[littleman]

Talk about taking one for the team... :eek: :p

You only say that when the person has to do something he DOESN'T want to.

[billyireland]

The Rossi situation has been a joke. Unfortunately, he does again seem to be in a bit of a quandry. The Newcastle fans & Roeder seem to have taken quite a shine to Shola, the latter probably due to the fact that he has for years been thought of as a potential 'man to fill Shearer's boots' inside the club, and the former due to the fact that he is/was having a decent run of form over the last few months.

Martins is ahead of Rossi because of his name, for my money. Yes, he is arguably the fastest player in the league. Yes, he has garnered a lot of media attention over the years (and at such a young age! ;)). Yes, he is an established international with a good deal of experience at the higher level. But for me, that is pretty much all he offers: experience, name-value (£/$/€) and a whole lot of pace. However, his touch can let him down, his finishing has always been pretty suspect, he is not very creative nor appears a particularly intelligent player and he offers little in the air. Barring aerial ability (which is a big reason Ameobi starts, imo), these are things that Rossi is sensational at, plus he is far from slow.

It's a shame in some ways that Newcastle signed Duff also, as they could have used Rossi in a 4-3-3

-------Ameobi--------
Rossi---------Martins
----Emre--Parker----
---------Butt (or a decent DM, since Butt is of course a shadow of his former self :().

---

I hope Jonny gets a loan spell again in January, rather than trying to fight for a spot straight away (as he would be in serious danger of getting Jones'd). Ideally, the Championship-to-NEC road would have been the one Evans took this season but it is somewhat understandable that it ultimately was not, due to the possibilities that a) Fergie would be worried about throwing him straight to the lions too soon, and b) that clubs of this calibre would need more convincing before taking him on loan (due to his ultra-brief reserves stint here). I would love to see Evans go to NEC (and his international performances will have absolutely bloated that previously-scant CV of his, thus making it more realistic than before). In the Eriedivise (bastard of a word to spell), Evans would gain a lot of experience aganst some pretty useful strikers and the odd class one. He would also become more aware of how to deal with more far sophisticated attacking midfields than he has played against so far. If he were to be loaned to a Championship side I would not be elated, although it would still be better than nothing or Antwerp and would also toughen him up and get him ready for the Harewoods and Marlon Kings of the league. Who knows, if Northern Ireland can get some decent results together before January and Evans plays well in those games, there might even be a relegation-battling side that might take him on loan.

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Good to see Gibbo back from injury. Hopefully he can impress and get a loan to a bigger club in the future (does his loan in January or May?).

---

I think Simpson's current predicament is far from bad for him. This will teach him discipline, as well as how to truley impose himself on a game and how to draw attention from BOTH of the opposing wide players (and, more importantly, use it to your teams advantage as well as your own). These are things that are almost unteachable, as they tend to require a good deal of experience and versatility down the flank. Even Ashley Cole - the most *naturally talented fullback I have seen in many, many years - took several seasons as a 50+ game starter for Arsenal and England international to begin getting a proper grasp of this (and will take another 2ish years until he has an entire grasp... at which point if Chelsea don't 'suck the fun' out of his game, he could well go down as an all-time great fullback).

In my opinion, the fact that Simpson is being asked to do so much at Antwerp is not such a disaster. He might not impress as much as was hoped during his loan spell because of it, but I doubt it will be anything near confidence-shattering due to the poor level of opposition (and I am sure that at that level, Simpson will indeed dominate his side of the field singlehandedly for the odd game).

He might also get a little bit of a mean streak in him because of this situation. It is always good to see a cynical, mean side to a defender (and a trait of our defenders that we seemed to be slipping away from for a while there). When it's 2v1, and you're the 1, you figure out ways to even the odds. ;)

If everything turns out well for Simpson during this time and he successfully overcomes this challenge, he should well and truley come out a far better player for it. Imagine if in a years time, Simpson had all the abilities that he already does, as well as the defensive discipline and presence (both mentally and physically - playing 2v1 will ineviably toughen him up) of a 24/25 year old, as well as the ability to manipulate the opposing widemen to create space for others and/or himself (something a lot of fullbacks never seem to grasp fully during their careers), and maybe even a cynical edge, too.

BTW, that cynical edge might prove useful if he has a shaky start in the first team for us, as a) he would be less liekly to suffer a Rio-esque slump, but more importantly b) it would remind fans of Gary somewhat. Gary Neville, disliked by many in the mid-90s due to the fact that he was prone to the odd silly mistake or bad pass on occassion, but over time has really ironed that so far out of his game that it hasn't been an issue for many, many years. Gary Neville (to me at least) out of every player we have had in the great era is 'Mr. United'. He is not my favourite player of the lot, and definitely not the best, but he is red through-and-through, the local lad that grew up supporting the club and made it into the starting XI of one of the best teams in the world and held his spot there for his whole career. He is not the bigger nor toughest guy in the world, but he will still get stuck in to defend one of the lads (even if nowhere near Keane proportions). He has never so much as batted an eyelid at offers from other clubs, he has never (to my recollection) made any issue about contracts, he has never/barely ever done anything to embarrass the club off the pitch or in interviews (while on the phone, on the other hand... D). Just as Best (and later Giggs) defined how our wingers should play, Edwards, Robbo and Keane our CMs, Tommy Taylor our goalscoring forwards (with a little touch of 'spice' added by Sparky down the line), etc, etc, Gary Neville built on the image of the FB position within this club, following in the footsteps of Irwin, Carey and of course, Byrne. If Simpson's play in some ways reminds the fans of Neville, they will warm to him quicker, give him more leighway in those difficult first few matches/weeks/months of his career, which naturally will help his confidence and help him overcome those rookie nerves asap. Went on a bit of a rant there!

*I still consider Zambrotta the best fullback in the world and best of his generation, but he is just such a complete player... Ashley Cole is the most naturally-talented top-level fullback in the world at the moment, imo)

[mhtwins113]

Now that Billy has assured us that he is still alive and kicking with that post, anyone else wanna bet he crawls back into the cave that he's been hiding in? ;)

[Achtung]

The loaning of Rossi to Newcastle was and remains a befuddling decision. Even if we were assuming that Saha and Solskjaer would play as well as they have (seriously, how many of you thought they would combine for nine goals through October 1st?), that still only left Rooney as the other striker. We all pretty much knew that Smith wouldn't be truly ready to return until October at the earliest, and he's just now gotten to the point where he can play something close to 90 minutes at a top level (he recently did it in a reserve match, which isn't the same). I hate to sound like I'm jinxing it but the injury histories of Saha and Solskjaer combined with the fragile temperament of Rooney makes it a rather unstable striker corps indeed. Rossi would certainly have gotten his chances here. It's tough to justify a loan when said player never even starts matches at his temporary club, let alone a loan where he could be an asset to the club which owns him.

[biro]

I can only assume Roeder 'promised' SAF that Rossi would be getting a lot of starts. The fact he isn't is presumably why he's said to be livid about the situation.

[The Guv'nor]

e must have his work cut out, no doubt it'll make him even better, in fact, such conditions are brilliant for us because when he goes back to one job he'll feel like superman.

Thats what I thought.