"Official" Ballack-watch thread [R]

[eissman]

Mods... do with this what you will... I understand it is not Bayern related. Sorry for the potential inconvenience.


Michael Ballack's first official debut for Chelsea:
- booked in the 6th minute
- pulled up injured in the 24th minute
- substituted in the following minutes
- http://home.skysports.com/list.aspx?hlid=409589&CPID=38&clid=14&lid=2&title=Reds+lift+Community+Shield
Result = 0


Not the debut I am sure he was hoping for.

[DemmahoM]

Two words: He sucked

[Bayerntone]

Anyone saw him play in the friendly against Celtic?

He played the second half of the match, but within the 45 mins, his play was very good and his passing nothing but sublimed.

[ForeverRed]

I saw the MLS all star gameand the Liverpool games:

1. All Star Game: That was a mess from the beginnng...if anyone knows Chelsea's coagulated midfield, it should be a given that no player can adapt right away, especially when being played out of his natural position. That was the case in this game, not only that, but none of the other players gave each other room. It was a giant mess essentially...players running into each other, giving the ball away etc. Not only Ballack but pretty much all Chelsea players.

2. Liverpool Game: He unfortunately got injured early on and it being a pre season game in a sense, Mourinho didn't want to risk him. And again, he was played out of position. From the starting line ups Ballack was placed to the right in midfield in a 4-4-2 which doesn't suit him. Liverpool was dominating most of the game anyways :p

I heard he did really well in the Celtic game though, must have been due to a clearer and spread out midfield.

I've said this about Hleb last season and I'll say it about Ballack, it'll take a while before he adapts but because he is such a great talent he will eventually settle in and Mourinho will see the benefits of having a midfield centered around him. I see him kicking ass in the second half of the season.

[scorpio81]

White Ballet - A Bavarian Tragedy!


us bayern fans have always been divided over ballacks usefulness, ability and worth to the squad...

there are some of us who think he fell desperately short of expectations during his time at bayern - in the sense that he didnt step into effenbergs shoes and lead us to a CL title...

of course, thats a pretty tough ask, and ballack isnt effenberg, but while we won 3 doubles in his four seasons at bayern, we never got past the quarterfinal stage of the CL, either...


im not one of his detractors and never have been... ive always been of the opinion that it was makaays arrival that wrecked us at bayern and we were so obsessed with the guy from the time the signing had become imminent, that the entire team changed its pattern to ensure we would fit into his game rather than the other way around...

he, imo, has always been best suited for counter attacking teams and at the time of his arrival, bayern were not one of those - with the signings of deisler, ze roberto and ballack the season before...

ironically, i think makaay would have fitted perfectly into the team under hitzfeld but elber was the far better choice for the plans hitzfeld had enivisioned when he brought in those 3 midfielders in 2002...


ballacks first season in 2002-03 saw us crash out of the CL in the first round with 2 draws against lens being the only points to show...

horrible, i know - we drew them 3-3, 2-2 or summat, and finished bottom of the group with lens getting the uefa cup spot...

who else was in that group? none other than the eventual champions, milan - to whom we lost 2-1 in both legs of a superb set of double headers - and some of the best champions league football ive witnessed...

the fourth team was one deportivo la coruna, who came to the olympiapark on the opening day of the CL as bayern began their campaign with the fans expectations absolutely astronomical (because of the signings of the new stars) and some of us fully expected to repeat our 01 triumph before the season had even begun...
facing us was the small matter of opening the campaign with a win that would put us in a good position to take top spot in the group from milan, once each of us had played 6 games...
a mighty 5 year unbeaten streak at the olympiastadion (which was only that short because ifk goteborg had come to munich on the last day of the group phase and we had already topped the group, so kahn can be forgiven for looking at the crowd as linkes tame back pass under no apparent pressure slipped under his foot and comicaly rolled over the line...) was all set to continue, especially after 'white ballet' had seen us romp to a pre-season title in madrid, comprehensively outplaying real AND milan along the way...

but a certain dutchman had other ideas, firing the spanish side into a quick 2-0 lead, before some good old german never-say-die spirit pulled the scores level midway through the second half...
the momentum had completely shifted, although, tbh, depor had got both the early goals on counter attacks that read: djamilnha wins the ball, passed to valeron... lifted into space for makaay to run onto - goal!

the great comeback never really materialised, though... and to compound matters, valeron completed his hattrick of assists and makaay had the rare distinction of being the first visiting player to register a hattrick in munich on a european night!

poof... that 5 year unbeaten home record was gone just like that...

back to the drawing board for ottmar?
thankfully not, because despite the tie at lens in the next game, we went into the milan looking to play football and get 6 points vs what looked like the best team in europe at the time and get our own campaign back on track...
one grossly underrated italian striker, though, had other ideas, starring in both games and capitalising on individual mistakes by linke to knock us out of the competition after just four games...

we did have time for the second-stringers to play out a 3-3 draw with lens though, cos ottmar obviously felt the qualifying for the uefa cup wasnt as important as winning the bundesliga back from bitter rivals dortmund, and even that gave further evidence of the plethora of exciting and dynamic talent the general had at his disposal as a certain bastian schweinsteiger made his debut and crossed for fellow youth product markus feulner to score...

it seemed like a good enough decision in may 03, as bayern romped to the bundesliga double with a certain german world cup hero chipping in with ten goals along the way and both starting strikers (elber and pizarro) combining for a total that has yet to be beaten by any combination since...
the season ended with michael ballack registering both goals in the cup final victory over kaiserlautern...
'white ballet' had officially wowed the crowds!

but, "the best bayern squad in years" had still crashed out of the CL by finishing bottom of the group and the management had not forgotten that...

what could be done to remedy that situation? we had already bolstered the midfield and front line as evidenced by our superb offensive play and prolific goal return during the course of the season... surely, it was the defence that needed reinforcements?

but ottmar & co. contrived to commit the biggest blunder i have seen them make till date, and looked to one man who was still fresh in their minds a year later, to make a spanish omelette from the egg they had had on their face at the beginning of the season...

no, not the creative genius, valeron...

the goal-poacher extraordinaire - makaay... a hattrick at the olympiastadion to defeat bayern munich! what more needs to be said?
lets do everything we can to get him here - including shipping out bundesliga joint-top scorer and bayern hero, elber to lyon for a cut-price deal because he had only one year left on his current contract!

a 3-3 draw in hannover, when the bundesliga champions twice came back from two goals goal down to tie the match in searing heat with an injury time freekick by owen hargreaves following a long distance piledriver by ballack and a superb goal for my hardworking MOM, pizarro, and give further evidence of the stunning variety of football they had played in the previous season...

3 goals was not enough in those conditions... yeah, it was clearly the offensive department that needed to be rectified.

the longest transfer saga i have witnessed at bayern finally ended as the mgmt. hailed one of the bundesligas (not just bayerns) best and biggest signings at 18mn euros... you would have been forgiven for thinking we had signed golden boot winner ronaldo from real madrid...

so in comes the lfying dutchman... the management had only one expectation from him - to score goals!
thousands showed up for his first training match
where he promptly fails to score, despite many clear chances...

this becomes a barren run of sorts as he goes scoreless again for the next 3-4 competitive fixtures despite getting many, many opportunities to open his account...

has the management cocked up again?

the fears are allayed as makaay registers his first goal in bayern colours at wolfsburg, and the celebrations can finally begin - forget about the small matter that we actually lost the match 3-2... the big new signing will lead us to the bundesliga AND CL title...

ailton goes on record to claim that he, and not makaay, is the best striker in the bundesliga and by the end of the season few would argue as 'fatman' plays a major role in taking werder bremen to the bundesliga double!
the exclamation mark in the statement coming when werder clinch the bundesliga against a by-then disjointed bayern with ailton getting on the scoresheet in an unimagineable 3-0 humbling...

much earlier in the season, another brazilian striker had returned to olympic stadium midweek, to help his new side register another home defeat for the proud germans, who were then forced to scramble to qualify from the group and avoid crashing out at that stage for the second season in a row!


makaay gets a respectable goal total himself (somewhere in the early-20s) and despite many instances of ottmar employing a 433 formation with both pizarro and roque starting behind him in supporting roles, the overal goal return is meagre nobody else on the squad gets into double figures (?)

predictably, he is the only man that is absolved of any criticism for his performance in that season to forget...
we did, after all, get further in the CL than in the previous year - so despite the domestic double, THAT WOULD be the season to forget, not this! no...

forgotten is the matter of teamwork and the previous season when ballack, pizarro AND elber dominated the bundesliga scoring charts...


hitzfeld is finally sacked after two(!) consecutive seasons of failure and a new coach brought in whos first few signings include the best centre back in the bundesliga and we win back the double from the norhtern rivals and go out in the CL quarter finals...
our star striker is replaced by a youth product midway through the second half when we trail by 3 goals in the aggregate tie, only to come within 1 goal of extra time with two goals and a heroic, yet utlimately tragic fightback against the premiership champions-elect...
bayern munich becomes the only side to score 3 goals against chelsea that season (who set a domestic record for clean sheets and goals conceded) as scholl, pizarro and guerrero give us a consolatory 3-2 win...

another season, another bundesliga double and an impressive goal haul for the german midfielder but another average display in europe where we fail to capitalise on numerous chances to bury milan in munich...

buoyed by the home display though, we had gone to milan full of confidence only needing a high scoring draw to advance, but our record of avoiding defeat away to top european competition was extended as we were thrashed 4-1, with the most chances being squandered by the man who is ultimately blamed for not LEADING his team - AGAIN...!
how come so many chances fell to ballack in the first place? what were the forwards doing?


despite desperate negotiations that would last for around 8 months, michael ballack signs for two-time defending champions, chelsea and bids adieu to munich and the people at bayern in the most dignified of interviews considering the treatment he received during his four years there...

the bayern management for their part, go on to state that he was a limited player who failed to step into effenbergs shoes and despite being an 'okay' header of the ball, provided not much else...

we would be much better off with a conventional playmaker in his stead...

like hargreaves, dos santos? schweinsteiger? (no discredit to them - i like all 3) in a 442 diamond? or a staggered 442 wide midfield? or maybe a 433?
just semantics it would seem! no matter what the formation, we are simply better off without that liability in the centre of the pitch...)

a brilliant job done over the past four years, by the best managed team in the bundesliga!

we're definitely in for the best season in europe in years, to go along with our domestic domination!





what a loads of ballacks!





epilogue: i dont know why i typed all that up... please forgive me and feel free to point out any factual errors i may have committed as i have typed this up in one sitting over the last hour on a pure whim - as one thought just flowed into the other... this was written only by drawing on my memory of certain events and feelings that i went through during specific times over the past few years, and i have concentrated on the period before i starting getting into online forums and reading others fans opinions - so these are my thoughts, and mine alone...

the net speeds here mean that i didnt have the benefits of wikipedia, fussbaldaten, etc, etc either, to help me strengthen this passage, so apologies for the amateurish research-work and compilation of events...

cheers,
a bayern fan.

[scorpio81]

i apologize to all my fellow bayern fans who are offended by the above article...

ive carried these feelings and thoughts for years on end now, so theyve always been there but my support for the club has never waned..
i will never desert this club... my support for it remains unwavered and while i keep harping on about how the other clubs have strengthened better than us, i would LOVE nothing more than to be humbled and proven wrong at the end of the season, if we beat bremen to another title...

rest assured also, that i will not gloat about being right (cos i know how irritating that would be) if we dont win, either...

i want to see us play good football and learn from (admit through actions, if not words) our mistakes along the way... i appreciate that the management dont want to make a panic buy to replace ballack and want to see what internal options we have at the club and hopefully assess the situation later down the line (continously, winter break, end of season - doesnt matter)...

its a continous learning process and we have to evolve year after year if we have to remain competitive... i may disagree with the way theyve gone about certain things but even if we slip into midtable obscurity through our lack of ambition or inactivity in the transfer market, i will not change my support of the club...

i like and respect the management and i dont want to see any of them leave... those were just my feelings as a fan, but they bring a lot of positives to the club, which i fully appreciate...



weve made a solid start to the season, and i hope we build from there...
i would like nothing else... i have not lost faith.

never will... i just have an opinion, that id love to be disproved!

[eissman]

SCORPIO...

No apologies necessary mate. That was shear brilliance! I loved it. Very well thought out rant. Your and my therapist would have been oh-so-proud!!! ;)

Some interesting points. I can definitely see the "shift" in tactics once Makaay arrival came to past. His style led to a counter-type offense, which as you stated, would have suited Hitzfeld more (the defensive stalwart and tactical genius he was).

I think Makaay has to have the best year he has had at Munich in since his arrival this season in order to secure a contract renewal. Your wish may be already in the thoughts of Bayern management... then again, that is a dangerous place to put any decision!!!

[ForeverRed]

Those are class posts scorpio.

I agree with most of it and shared your frustration through those seasons......that 02/03 CL campaign was just a nightmare to witness. It was a disaster any way you put it. There was so much hope for the "white ballet" which really went nowhere after that season but the team eventually came around with Makaay's arrival.

After the CL win in '01 I knew things were going to change as we entered a turbulent period of transision-many players leaving, just a matter of time before Hitzfeld would be sacked etc...so I wasn't expecting any further European glory but I didn't expect such let downs either..although the year we got eliminated by Chelski, we put up quite a fight and almost got past them. The first leg against Arsenal was quality stuff!

Maybe management should have tried to form the team around Ballack ala Leverkusen instead of mashing it up with Bayern's tactics prior to Michael's arrival.

In any case, thats all in the past....I'm sure once all our young talent comes around we'll be back to our best. Just a matter of time.

[BMike86]

holy crap Tosh!!! i dont expect another post from you in the next few days with all that typing :p lol, breath a little, let your fingers rest. let them have a nice rest. lol, when i came across your first post i was like wow this is a big one and scrolled for a few seconds to the end of it. then i went back up to the beginning of it and read it. it was a quality post. then i look at the post after it expecting a response from somebody, though to my surprise and utter laughter it was you posting again but already apologizing for your thoughts in advance.

ps...i think you should come back to Drake and play footy asap :D bust out some of that mad style dribbling you possess like in that one match we played indoors like 5v5 when the internationals had that formal thingy. you surprised me there i didnt think you had it in you because you fall back and played so defensively when many ppl were there so when i saw that i smiled and was aww sh!t :) too bad my side still beat yours anyways, hahahahaha

[eissman]

ps...i think you should come back to Drake and play footy asap :D bust out some of that mad style dribbling you possess like in that one match we played indoors like 5v5 when the internationals had that formal thingy. you surprised me there i didnt think you had it in you because you fall back and played so defensively when many ppl were there so when i saw that i smiled and was aww sh!t :) too bad my side still beat yours anyways, hahahahaha

We talkin' The Odeum, my Chicago brothers?
Cheers.

[scorpio81]

ps...i think you should come back to Drake and play footy asap bust out some of that mad style dribbling you possess like in that one match we played indoors like 5v5 when the internationals had that formal thingy. you surprised me there i didnt think you had it in you because you fall back and played so defensively when many ppl were there so when i saw that i smiled and was aww sh!t too bad my side still beat yours anyways, hahahahaha


haha, i remember that game cos we only got to play together 3-4 times, unfortunately! dont remember the result - never do - so ill take your word for it! ;)

i play the game exactly the way i feel about it - even though i love watching the beautiful game - sort out the defense first, then think about the offensive aspects! :cool:

[scorpio81]

SCORPIO...

No apologies necessary mate. That was shear brilliance! I loved it. Very well thought out rant. Your and my therapist would have been oh-so-proud!!! ;)

Some interesting points. I can definitely see the "shift" in tactics once Makaay arrival came to past. His style led to a counter-type offense, which as you stated, would have suited Hitzfeld more (the defensive stalwart and tactical genius he was).

I think Makaay has to have the best year he has had at Munich in since his arrival this season in order to secure a contract renewal. Your wish may be already in the thoughts of Bayern management... then again, that is a dangerous place to put any decision!!!

im glad we agree, eissman! just keep your therapists number handy next summer, in case things dont pan out as i hope... ;)

[Macedonian]

Today Ballack featured in the 2-0 victory of Chelsea against Blackburn.Ballack played the entire match and he really played a poor match..
His role in Chelski is completely different to that in Bayern.He played sort of DM leaving Frankie the OM role.He didn't made good passes to Scheva,his shots were poor....Maybe he is still adapting to the EPL style.

[ForeverRed]

Today Ballack featured in the 2-0 victory of Chelsea against Blackburn.Ballack played the entire match and he really played a poor match..
His role in Chelski is completely different to that in Bayern.He played sort of DM leaving Frankie the OM role.He didn't made good passes to Scheva,his shots were poor....Maybe he is still adapting to the EPL style.

I'm telling you, he will not work as long as Mourinho doesn't change the midfield tactically to suit Michael.

You can't just put a player into a midfield and expect it to work...you have to have some strategy behind it....Mourinho will never do that because, like Sven with the NT, is afraid to drop some players

[Macedonian]

I'm telling you, he will not work as long as Mourinho doesn't change the midfield tactically to suit Michael.

You can't just put a player into a midfield and expect it to work...you have to have some strategy behind it....Mourinho will never do that because, like Sven with the NT, is afraid to drop some players

Yes Mourinho wants some sort of Utopia ,playing Lampard,Balla,Essien all together....
During the match even Essien who is a DM,was playing infront of Michael!

[Pakalolo]

The Chelsea midfield won't work with Essien, Lampard, Ballack and Makelele. In todays match this became obvious. They cancelled each other out mostly because of the fact that all of them wanted to play in a central position and forgot to use the flanks more often... They badly need Robben.

[Dr.Phil]

Ballack Lampard = Gerrad and Lampard

It works on paper but does not work on the field

[scorpio81]

Today Ballack featured in the 2-0 victory of Chelsea against Blackburn.Ballack played the entire match and he really played a poor match..
His role in Chelski is completely different to that in Bayern.He played sort of DM leaving Frankie the OM role.He didn't made good passes to Scheva,his shots were poor....Maybe he is still adapting to the EPL style.


what did he do that was so poor? i only watched the second half and although he wasnt as attacking as he used to be at bayern, i didnt see him give up possession even once and his intelligence and awareness was there for all to see...
he sprayed the ball around nicely and his control, first touch and superior technical skill over lampard and essien was quite evident...*

btw, after carvalho (i think?) went up for the 50-50 ball that fell into the vacant area, who latched onto it and initiated the passing movement that eventually lead to the second goal?



* - wasnt his inability to play in a proper central midfield role the reason why some of us criticised him at bayern so much? reason being that he got forward far too much for our own good and as a result of which we lost our shape? well, away to blackburn is as hard a premiership debut as it gets for foreigners and at least in the second half, chelsea didnt look too threatened while getting forward whenever they could as well...
surely ballack deserves some credit for this comfortable away victory?
imo, ballack showed today what a complete player he is (again)...

[GetIn]

I thought Ballack played a solid game. I just got done watching it. It seems though that his teammates aren't trusting him yet 100%. There have been a couple of occasions were they simply did not use him or chose another option to get out of trouble. I think that will come with time.

[ForeverRed]

Yea I just watched the entire game as well and to be honest, I don't know where all the criticism comes from. He had a very solid game, he didn't give up posession and wasn't any poorer than anyone else in the team. It was an overall consistent performance throughout the game.

He still hasn't found his game though, and thats why he was not totally present in all the plays and again, he was played out of position along with a player that usually does his job. It was a decent debut for him, against one of the most defensively stable and physical teams in England. He was pretty much all over the field, he was on the flanks, going forward and drifiting back to win posession and distribute the ball...really what he, as a box to box, player does best.

Ballack is great at adapting to different circumstances and because he's such a class player, he'll get better and more comfortable in this scrambled and tactically insufficient lineup that Mourinho fields thus getting better and actually getting involved in the goals.

Now, if Mourinho gets his head out of his arse and actually plays him in a proper midfield, it'll be a different story.