Is the Galaxy's shade of gold slightly different this year?

[um_chili]

First, my definition of poacher is slightly different. I think of a guy who pops up opportunistically in the 18 yard box and has an uncanny ability to knock in goals from half-chances and odd angles. The striker who capitalizes on opportunities that other strikers wouldn't even notice. This doesn't mean the poacher is a great striker of the ball; I think the poacher typically embodies the maxim that "all goals count the same." The archetype is Gerd Muller. Now I've only seen vids of Muller goals from a couple WCs and the 72 EC, but none of the many, many goals he scored were Eskandarianesque. They weren't power jobs ripped from deep in or outside the box. They were far more commonly cleverly flicked headers or backheels or toe-pokes that he managed to get to thanks to a combination of goalmouth instinct, speed, and an uncanny leaping ability for a man of average height.

The definition of poacher--which I understand is not a criticism--posed above strikes me as descriptive of Esky but not quite right. That just seems to be the point that Esky doesn't create on his own. But even that doens't really seem right. I was at RFK in 2004 when Esky ran from midfield to score a ridiculous solo goal to open the scoring in the east semis against NE. That was all him. At least one of the goals he scored in MLS Cup that same year were self-created as well, I think.

Now two things are true. First, Esky doesn't really do much to create in the way Jaime (or Gomez, or increasingly, Freddy) pass the ball cleverly to create space and scoring chances. Second, Esky may be ineffective at the international level because he's far less likely to find the kind of defensive breakdowns that he so effectively capitalizes on. But I don't think either of these make him a poacher. I think he's an excellent MLS striker who's somewhat one-dimensional. It's a damn good dimension, but I'm not sure if it will be good enough to help out the USMNT at the concacaf or WC level.

[Crafty Bernardo]

First, my definition of poacher is slightly different. I think of a guy who pops up opportunistically in the 18 yard box and has an uncanny ability to knock in goals from half-chances and odd angles. The striker who capitalizes on opportunities that other strikers wouldn't even notice. This doesn't mean the poacher is a great striker of the ball; I think the poacher typically embodies the maxim that "all goals count the same." The archetype is Gerd Muller. Now I've only seen vids of Muller goals from a couple WCs and the 72 EC, but none of the many, many goals he scored were Eskandarianesque. They weren't power jobs ripped from deep in or outside the box. They were far more commonly cleverly flicked headers or backheels or toe-pokes that he managed to get to thanks to a combination of goalmouth instinct, speed, and an uncanny leaping ability for a man of average height.

The definition of poacher--which I understand is not a criticism--posed above strikes me as descriptive of Esky but not quite right. That just seems to be the point that Esky doesn't create on his own. But even that doens't really seem right. I was at RFK in 2004 when Esky ran from midfield to score a ridiculous solo goal to open the scoring in the east semis against NE. That was all him. At least one of the goals he scored in MLS Cup that same year were self-created as well, I think.

Now two things are true. First, Esky doesn't really do much to create in the way Jaime (or Gomez, or increasingly, Freddy) pass the ball cleverly to create space and scoring chances. Second, Esky may be ineffective at the international level because he's far less likely to find the kind of defensive breakdowns that he so effectively capitalizes on. But I don't think either of these make him a poacher. I think he's an excellent MLS striker who's somewhat one-dimensional. It's a damn good dimension, but I'm not sure if it will be good enough to help out the USMNT at the concacaf or WC level.

Well, that sounds pretty damn good to me. I think I'm sold on what "poacher" is.

Man law?

[thepundit]

an excellent passer.

i won't pass judgement because he didn't play that much and it was only one game, but Rico Clark's passing was horrendous during the All-Star Game.

[Crafty Bernardo]

This if the first time I've talked on BigSoccer about my personal playing style , but this:

"They were far more commonly cleverly flicked headers or backheels or toe-pokes that he managed to get to thanks to a combination of goalmouth instinct, speed, and an uncanny leaping ability for a man of average height."

... pretty much describes my style to a "T"... made my league's all-star team as a Striker this year... scored roughly a dozen goals in about 10 games and only one was struck from more than 15 yards and only one other came off beating defenders off the dribble.... about half came off my head (I'm only 5'10"... but get off the ground pretty well due to a lifetime of basketball) and the rest were positioned tap-ins or full volleys.

Seriously not trying to brag (I think it's ugly :o )... just saying that the "just a poacher" comment this thread was started on kind've hit a little close to home. I'm a poacher and damn proud of it.

[Crafty Bernardo]

And Chili.. I just noticed your Avatar... Herbert Kornfeld.. very nice. :D

[Talion]

That was a great goal and a great finish. But when have you ever seen that type of team passing sequence from the USMNT? I never have. And left to his own devices, I rather doubt that Esky could carve out that kind of chance on his own.
Good grief. Can Esky "carve out" chances for himself in MLS? Occasionally, though not nearly as frequently as some other players on his own team. Could he at the international level? No. Can any other American? Well, Donovan and Beasley can do it, sometimes, against CONCACAF minnows. How's that been working out for them in the WC?

So come on, just beacuse the USMNT isn't usually capable of eight one touch passes leading up to a clinical strike against decent competition doesn't mean the only other alternative is a mazy run or some sort of sweet move to get the time and space to shoot. Our much maligned '06 WC team's only goal came off a turnover by Beasley followed by a good cross and a nice finish from Dempsey (everyone's favorite Nats player, even though at the international level his game is pretty much just drawing fouls and...yep...being a poacher). Our celebrated 2002 team's goals were all "carved out" or "created" by crosses or passes of varying difficulties (and the occasional lucky bounce), not by self-sufficient forwards carving up defenses.

There's plenty of reasons to think Esky won't be a good international striker without expecting things from him that no American has ever done against WC-level competition...he's not as fast or as talented with the ball at his feet as Donovan or Beasley, he's as short as they are, he doesn't create chances for others like even Wolff can, and he doesn't hold up the ball as well as McBride or Ching or play the aerial game like they do either. What you get from him is hustle, an amazing shooting left foot from the run of play and from free kicks, and perhaps most importantly an aggression, a willingness to shoot instead of trying to dribble into the goal. Is that enough to merit a spot on the team? I think it might, but we'll have to see what the new coach thinks.

[Matrim55]

Well, that sounds pretty damn good to me. I think I'm sold on what "poacher" is.

Man law?
Me too. I'll now refer to Eski as a "sniper" - same for Razov - whereas Twellman is closer to being a pure "poacher".

Man law.

[the Next Level]

Chris Gbandi. It's a shame he took that cap from Liberia.

Are you serious???? That was really stupid.

[FakeFlopper]

Clearly, the above is one of the pressing questions of the MLS season.

Others:

Is Alecko Eskandarian just a poacher? Or is he a forward who can take on a defender or two with the ball on his foot?

I still think he's primarily a poacher, but he's definitely added dimensions to his game that weren't there in the past. The question is whether or not he'll become proficient enough at these aspects to become a dominant force within the league and win a regular role with the USMNT for the next cycle and possibly beyond.

I'm betting against him.




I think you're a bit harsh on him. He has scored qualities goals, and coming from such a long injury he's doing very well. I don't know if he's a quality international forward, but he's earn a shot. Look at EJ - he came off injury and really hasn't done much for the US against harder competition. EJ's a poacher in my book, just look at his international goals, there weren't spectacular. I'd just be worried if we can't produce a quality forward to challenge EJ.

[DSM1]

I like Rico Clark. At his best he is outstanding, though he has been inconsistent in the past, I think mostly due to injuries. I'd really like to see him get a real chance with the USMNT.

[DSM1]

How the Gold has Dimmed.

Gold? Like most, if not all, Quakes fans I always thought the color was yellow.

[ButlerBob]

My take on "poacher" is someone that scores those opportunistic goals in the box, the back post taps ins. For those that remember the '96 season and followed DC United, I consider Steve Rammel a poacher. He had the ablity or maybe even knack to score goals. They were never what you would call pretty, but they still counted and helped to turn a bad season around. On On the other hand I think Esky can do more then just score goals.

[Line9Foul]

Gold? Like most, if not all, Quakes fans I always thought the color was yellow.


dude the color is definetly Gold..... cant you notice the difference between columbus Yellow and Galaxy Gold?

[Kenobi]

(clip)That was a great goal and a great finish. But when have you ever seen that type of team passing sequence from the USMNT?(/clip)

Naturalize Gomez now! :)

I guess I didn't read the entire question very thoroughly... I stopped at "just a poacher"... I agree that Eskandarian isn't on the fast track to representing the US in WC 2010... unless he gets much, much, much better. I'm hoping that someone steps up big at striker for us because that was definately a soft-spot for the USMNT this go-around...

I don't really see "that guy" just yet for 4 years down the road.. who's it gonna be?

Ching?
Johnson?
Twellman?
Donovan? (I'd rather have him playing attacking mid)

Maybe Jaqua if he continues to improve?

Blech... I don't really have a great feeling about any of them... honestly, & sadly, I think Donovan & Dempsey are the coolest/calmest with the ball in a scoring position, but their both ideally midfielders and not strikers.

We need someone to step up & become a goal-scoring lockdown machine...

How about Kenny Cooper?

[Crafty Bernardo]

Naturalize Gomez now! :)



How about Kenny Cooper?

He's definately physically gifted enough... Let's hope he continues to get better.

Good call.

[chessplayer]

While he is better with the ball at his feet and is getting better at linking play, it is not his strength and I personally wish he would quit it (at least for his club) because we have enough guys who play around with the ball as it is.

:confused:
Wait a minute- we got our butts kicked by Chicago last year becuase Gomez/Moreno were worn down and our attack wasn't mature enough to move the ball into scoring chances without them. Any ballhandling/linking ability that Esky develops will go nicely with the developing ball skills of Adu, Gros, Jamil Walker, Olsen, etc. to keep the speed of possession going and keep the defense from being under attack for long stretches while providing scoring chances. If Esky becomes a complete forward, that is the best thing for United I think. As Moreno/Gomez become lesser, others will have to step up, and while we don't have a proven playmaker to replace Gomez next year (I assume Adu already has tickets to Europe), Walker and Esky are developing into competent linking players who can help sustain a possession in addition to finishing chances. If we go with the offense-by-committee instead of running through a No. 10 next year, this will be important.

[Baysider]

I am so sick of that question, I could scream. It's the same damn color, all right? The MANUFACTURER is different, so maybe it doesn't look totally eye-to-eye identical in every respect. But for all practical purposes, it's still Galaxy gold.




Really? I see it as being much more yellow than previous years. The difference looks less to me when I see it on TV, but the difference is pretty striking when you see it live.

[QuakeAttack]

Gold? Like most, if not all, Quakes fans I always thought the color was yellow.

Piss yellow...to be accurate...:D

I have always thought that Esky had the best shot of the current crop of forwards. He deserves a shot at proving himself at the international level (which due to injury I believe has been delayed). However, I don't believe that he would be successful outside CONCACAF. He is too small and doesn't create his opportunities. At a minimum, McBride created opportunities with his superior jumping ability and ability to hold the ball. However, if he can stay healthy, Esky has a chance.

On a side note, I love Ricardo Clark, but I don't think his skill with the ball is good enough. Too many bad touches and poor passes.

[Dan Loney]

Piss yellow...to be accurate.When it comes to piss, accuracy is important.