Blowing off Youth Soccer

[BronzeArt]

Okay, so my kids want to play soccer. But I'm not in enough green to shell out a gazillion dollars taking my kids a-freaking-cross the freaking country wasting every weekend to play the Stepford Kids.

So what do I do?

Every afternoon, we play. Buckets for goals, we burn up the backyard, tiny Ronaldinhos and Henrys, triple-stepping, heel-passing, goal-scoring machines. To them, its just fun. But they are getting it. Not just the fever. In our own version of street soccer, they are getting the skills.

The cheap, scarred Wal-Mart ball takes the place of the crushed Coke cans and tennis balls I used to play with, and our grass-dirt backyard serves where the alley used to be my stadium. But they are getting it.

Every time a bucket clatters down and they holler "Gooooooooal!" and every time they can actually get the ball past their Dad, its a rush. And they test their skills with the neighborhood 'Mexicans' on the weekend- from Argentina, Puerto Rico and Texas.

So the CEOs in their Sport-Utility lives can keep the youth soccer. I'm blowing it off. And the kids that play behind 'El Sombrero' restaurant are the future National Team of the US.

[JohnR]

And the kids that play behind 'El Sombrero' restaurant are the future National Team of the US.

Could be.

There's no precedent for these guys suddenly joining an organized team at age 17 and making it at a high level. Not here, not elsewhere. Just so we're clear.

But until age 12, 13, maybe even 14... sure, if these kids are really playing that often, with other enthusiastic players, they could do just fine with El Sombrero training.

[TimB4Last]

Could be.

There's no precedent for these guys suddenly joining an organized team at age 17 and making it at a high level. Not here, not elsewhere. Just so we're clear.

But until age 12, 13, maybe even 14... sure, if these kids are really playing that often, with other enthusiastic players, they could do just fine with El Sombrero training.

Could be, but highly unlikely, I would add. But that doesn't make 'unorganized' soccer a bad idea. First and foremost, soccer is a game - a game that should be enjoyed.

At some point, the players will have to join teams to take their game to the next level. The question is, at what point?

I would think that waiting until age 14 would be a big gamble, but I could easily see waiting until 9 or 10, keeping it fun, creative, unstructured for as long as possible. A particular benefit would be playing with a mixed age group - little kids learn a lot just by playing with the 'big kids' - and with light (if any) adult supervision.

Putting uniforms on four-year-olds, with coaches, refs, leagues, etc., and screaming (even well-intentioned encouragement) at them, sounds counter-productive to me.

But again, at some point a young player has to leave the relative safety of his 'backyard,' join a team and seek out better competition.

When that time comes, I hope your vehicle is gassed up and ready to go. Not yours, John - BronzeArt's.

The 'CEO' who owns 'El Sombrero' just called; he has his SUV ready to roll. You see, his son recently joined a select team, and he's willing to carpool to practices and games. No SUV required, just reliable transportation - and a willingness to take those kids to the next level.

[cleansheetbsc]

Okay, so my kids want to play soccer. But I'm not in enough green to shell out a gazillion dollars taking my kids a-freaking-cross the freaking country wasting every weekend to play the Stepford Kids.

So what do I do?

Every afternoon, we play. Buckets for goals, we burn up the backyard, tiny Ronaldinhos and Henrys, triple-stepping, heel-passing, goal-scoring machines. To them, its just fun. But they are getting it. Not just the fever. In our own version of street soccer, they are getting the skills.

The cheap, scarred Wal-Mart ball takes the place of the crushed Coke cans and tennis balls I used to play with, and our grass-dirt backyard serves where the alley used to be my stadium. But they are getting it.

Every time a bucket clatters down and they holler "Gooooooooal!" and every time they can actually get the ball past their Dad, its a rush. And they test their skills with the neighborhood 'Mexicans' on the weekend- from Argentina, Puerto Rico and Texas.

So the CEOs in their Sport-Utility lives can keep the youth soccer. I'm blowing it off. And the kids that play behind 'El Sombrero' restaurant are the future National Team of the US.

Nonsense.

Using baseball in the 1970's as an example. Every day the weather was good in the spring and summer, kids would be outside, playing catch, self hitting, if lucky you can get 10 kids together and play an unorganized game where you had ghost runners and hitting it to right field was an automatic out since there weren't enough players. If you got really lucky, games would be full teams. That was every other day, but it was also supplemented with playing Little League once or twice a week. The key is playing (disguised as practicing) every day. Organized/unorganized mix, but playing every day.

Basketball and hockey are the same way.

At some point, there is a need to teach the finer points of the game, which the organized part of the game is done. Hard to call offsides or for a defender to choose to make a run up the line in the backyard.

If the kid is only going to jump out of the van at the practice field twice a week, yeah they won't be complete players.

[BronzeArt]

The 'CEO' who owns 'El Sombrero' just called; he has his SUV ready to roll. You see, his son recently joined a select team, and he's willing to carpool to practices and games. No SUV required, just reliable transportation - and a willingness to take those kids to the next level.

My point exactly. Adrian's kids have spent their time learning some serious skills- even playing against adults- at 9 and 10 years old. Occasionally, some parents with kids in the leagues come to some of our pickup indoor matches on Tuesday and Thursday nights. They get blown off the basketball court where we play. They generally don't come back, and some don't stay the whole night. His boys can do moves I never could in High School, and when Adrian decides the time is right to introduce the local soccer leagues to his kids, it'll be awesome.


Putting uniforms on four-year-olds, with coaches, refs, leagues, etc., and screaming (even well-intentioned encouragement) at them, sounds counter-productive to me.

True that.

[JohnR]

Occasionally, some parents with kids in the leagues come to some of our pickup indoor matches on Tuesday and Thursday nights. They get blown off the basketball court where we play. They generally don't come back, and some don't stay the whole night.

Well, there are leagues and there are leagues. Doubt your guys would intimidate players who fit into the latter category. Still, as I wrote earlier, your guys can do just fine with the program that they are following -- and it sounds like they are!

[pokerjoe]

If there's one thing I'd recommend, to save money, it's to use the latino, azteca leagues until about 12 or 13, because I've seen so many kids come out of those leagues and play equal to the kids who are by then 5 year vets of club teams. Azteca is great, if they have it near you. You won't learn team skills and tactics, but you'll see, and from seeing it, learn, other skills. Here they play year round, it's cheap, it's tough (varies, but about equal to silver in CSL, and our third division is at least equal to other state's second division).

Helps a lot if your dad can teach you skills, or you can go to some good camps, I guess.

[JohnR]

If there's one thing I'd recommend, to save money, it's to use the latino, azteca leagues until about 12 or 13, because I've seen so many kids come out of those leagues and play equal to the kids who are by then 5 year vets of club teams.

Yup. You see Latino league veterans joining top suburban club teams and instantly being useful players. That never happens with standard rec league players, as they are way too far behind. I've also never seen it happen with kids who are just playing neighborhood soccer, I should hasten to add.

Only caveat is that this trick only works in certain pockets in the country, that is the ones with thriving Latino leagues.

[bing1985]

I'm with BronzeArt in this. I've started looking for other options to club soccer for my boys. I believe my kids would like to play high school, maybe small college level - but that's the extent. So I'm not talking ODP aspirations here.

With us the issue is less the money and more the time commitment. The clubs want us to basically commit the kid to soccer and NOTHING else. That is nuts. It's a shame that we're forced to choose a complete immersion as the only way to get our kids into the game at a high-school level.

My 10 year old swims and now wants to try volleyball. He's also a gifted musician. The poor kid was in tears this summer when we looked at the calendar and had to tell him, "If you do club soccer, you have to give up these other things." He just wants to play. Same with my 7 yr old.

I got a call from another parent in the same boat, and so we started pulling kids together for pick-up games once a week through the summer. By the second week, word spread and about 20 kids showed up. A couple of us parents that know the game play along with the kids and try to teach them a few things -- which I recognize is no substitue for professional coaching. But the point is, kids CAN learn soccer and can enjoy the SOCIAL lessons of the game without a year-long commitment and the $$$$ spent to the club.

It would be very sad if a whole generation never learns that all soccer really requires is a ball. :(

[JohnR]

With us the issue is less the money and more the time commitment. The clubs want us to basically commit the kid to soccer and NOTHING else. That is nuts. It's a shame that we're forced to choose a complete immersion as the only way to get our kids into the game at a high-school level.

Understood.

The nice thing about our area is that the 10 years old can choose at the club level anywhere from complete immersion, to glorified rec. There are about 5 different levels of commitment/cost/team quality. Plus, a player can skip club altogether and still get good games in the free Hispanic leagues. So it's not the all-or-nothing proposition that you seem to be facing.

[Damon]

The 'CEO' who owns 'El Sombrero' just called; he has his SUV ready to roll. You see, his son recently joined a select team, and he's willing to carpool to practices and games. No SUV required, just reliable transportation - and a willingness to take those kids to the next level.

My point exactly. Adrian's kids have spent their time learning some serious skills- even playing against adults- at 9 and 10 years old. Occasionally, some parents with kids in the leagues come to some of our pickup indoor matches on Tuesday and Thursday nights. They get blown off the basketball court where we play. They generally don't come back, and some don't stay the whole night. His boys can do moves I never could in High School, and when Adrian decides the time is right to introduce the local soccer leagues to his kids, it'll be awesome.


Putting uniforms on four-year-olds, with coaches, refs, leagues, etc., and screaming (even well-intentioned encouragement) at them, sounds counter-productive to me.

True that.

I think I missed something. Someone help me out: Who is Adrian? The owner of El Sombrero?

I think the perfect mix to this scenario is to have the kids play on a team that fits within a family's budget and schedule AND play like crazy every day in the backyard. If a young kid decides at an early age that soccer is his passion (or any other sport for that matter), then they should be playing 24/7 in the alley w/ buckets for goals. But I don't think a parent turning their back on organized club soccer is an extreme measure that will turn out to be a positive for their child. How many coaches reading this have worked with a truly gifted player, often one who is far and away the best "on-ball" player they have on the team, but who cannot understand team play if their toes depended on it? Players need to juggle, driibble, and "play" on their own, as well as train with a team.

[sockpuppet64]

Guys -- a lot depends on what you want for your kid -- maybe play high school soccer? maybe play soccer at a competitive club level? maybe college soccer? Now think of a giant triangle sitting on its base, say, in North Texas, 200,000 registered youth soccer players wide. How small is the top 1% ? 2000 players, or 100 teams of 20 players each. My point is that if you want your kid to play at any higher level you have to start early and work and train hard plus the kid has to have huge natural talent. The state championship high school baseball coach told me he had 90 kids at tryouts for the 6 open slots on his team. If you are unwilling to make sacrifices for your kids with good (professional) coaching and quality level peer play you just won't be able to keep the door open for your child when he is 14-16-18 years old, if competitive soccer in high school or college is a goal.

[eplkewell]

One thing I've found in my experience is that a very high percentage of the soccer prodigies created by playing select soccer their whole lives burn out on the game by the end of high school. I've found that the kids who played pick up soccer and rec soccer their whole lives are the guys who end up caring about the game ten, fifteen, or more years down the line. Kids who have played twenty "important" games a year since they were 8 just don't care in high school. I've seen plenty of vastly skilled players in high school who have the ability to become good college players not bother to keep playing because after joining club soccer in 2nd grade, they've been pushed too much. Great players who don't want to play aren't really worth anything.

The lesson here... just let the kids play pick up games in the park for now.

[sockpuppet64]

Well I have heard the burnt out argument before, don't believe it. The good players who drop usually have realized that they are not gonna be competitive at a higher level and opt out. At the highest level, the example of musical prodigies comes to mind. True prodigies are not forced to play by their parents, the force to succeed comes from inside. They are driven people, and when channeled appropriately, succeed brilliantly. Don't forget for that 1 in 1000 kid who is a superstar, 999 are not and many unfortunately are victims of inappropriately high expectations. Enjoying soccer, and playing for fun, at whatever level truly defines success in a more appropriate and perhaps healthier way. But I believe that the vast majority of really good players love the game and won't quit. If they grow up, though, with no left foot because the right was always good enough in the backyard, they have a real problem.

[JohnR]

When my kid was 6 and joined a competitive soccer team, I was told by the other parents of first graders that he would burn out. Seven years later, he's still playing. So are all 4 of the other first graders on that team. Meanwhile, 95% of the kids from the naysaying parents have quit the sport.

Maybe he'll get hit with burnout after high school. I ain't worried about that. He's already ahead of the 95% of kids who had parents who were fussing about burnout.

[allsport132000]

Could be.

There's no precedent for these guys suddenly joining an organized team at age 17 and making it at a high level. Not here, not elsewhere. Just so we're clear.

But until age 12, 13, maybe even 14... sure, if these kids are really playing that often, with other enthusiastic players, they could do just fine with El Sombrero training.

This hits home for me. My older son wanted to stay rec and so he did. Then he hated his coach and quit for two years. Years passed, but on his own, he gradually came back to rec soccer, then found a low-level competitive team, then another a little higher level, and - yes at 17 - finally made varsity at his VERY competitive high school. That might not sound like much, but the entire rest of the team is comprised of Elite players from various teams/club - it's a dominant high school team in this area.

This past summer he's been guesting on an Elite team at U17 (his own team is Premier II) but it took a lot of effort to get there. Of all his buddies who also stayed in rec soccer after U12, he's the only one who has really found a home in the competitive world. Most have quit soccer by 15; he's the last one still playing. The training, the discipline, the skill level of competitive clubs is really hard to catch up if you play at a "fun" level and don't have the coaching, game experiences, and just touches on the ball that I've seen with other kids. It gets harder to find a recreational league for games as the players get older.

Does he regret it? nope, he wanted to play with his friends and he did. The fact that he finally got noticed by a top team and the HS Varsity coach have more to do with his work ethic and natural speed. And "not giving up" which was a very real option only a month ago. It CAN happen that you can still change your mind and make a competitive team "later" in your teens, but it's pretty rare. If he'd stayed with the program (the competitive club) all along, he would have been in the natural flow to continue into a competitive position on one of their teams. Knowing this particular kid, he might have been burned out with 8 years of year-round soccer. As a late bloomer, it's working great for him, but I'll agree, it's a tough path to take.

Just to be clear ... if your kid likes the competitive schedule and you can come up with a way to afford it, that's probably going to provide your player with the training and experience to be the best they can be by high school.
Regular play is going to go a long way, but you'll need to be disciplined about making sure they are learning the footskills and strategies they will need.
BUT ... for the record, I have one kid who did it the hard way, skipping the early training and having to make up for it by working his @$$ off the last year and a half. But he managed to surprise us all.

[JohnR]

Interesting story!

That kind of thing is a lot more common on the girls' side, where the barriers are lower. But occasionally yes it does occur on the boys' side. Either way, the common denominators are what you outline -- footspeed and work ethic.

[allsport132000]

Interesting story!

That kind of thing is a lot more common on the girls' side, where the barriers are lower. But occasionally yes it does occur on the boys' side. Either way, the common denominators are what you outline -- footspeed and work ethic.

Let's just say it wasn't easy to watch, either. He sat on the bench the first two games this year. Then the coach put him in for just 6 minutes of a game and miraculously the ball came to him and he took it and outran their defense by a couple yards. Left them in the dust. Next game he played 15 minutes, then a half of the game, now he's starting some of the time. But if he hadn't had that game moment where everything lined up for him to show just how fast he is, I don't know if he'd see much time on the field. So your point about not many 17 year olds jumping into high-level soccer holds true from my experience.

When they practice small-sided games and even warmup drills, he is often struggling to figure out what everybody else is doing - he's never seen many of the drills competitive players take for granted. He gets better each time, but when a coach has 75-100 boys try out for a team, things like how you look in those drills can form an opinion. It's not that a kid isn't coordindated, but the competitive players LEARNED those drills five years ago, and it's like picking up a ballroom dance step by watching it once, pretty hard to do.

His brother, who has always been in the competitive path, does the drills without thinking and can concentrate on ball movement. Big difference.

[JohnR]

His brother, who has always been in the competitive path, does the drills without thinking and can concentrate on ball movement. Big difference.

Understood on the drills.

Here's a club example. (Meaning, I don't think you'll see a high school team do it.) Last week, the kids on my son's team were set up in a line and made to race each other, while juggling the ball. They weren't running flat-out fast of course, but most of 'em were jogging and the slowest was at least walking at a decent clip.

I think you could be a pretty good rec league player but have a lot of trouble if that drill was thrown at you! All the athleticism in the world won't help if you're trying to figure out how to do something like that in a hurry ...

[wingzero13]

i coach jv high school soccer in san diego, ca and this past year i had a junior on the team who had never played outside of AYSO. he runs track so he is an excellent athlete. the varsity coach didn't see much in him at tryouts and favored some other club players. he dominated the jv level. he needed work on his finishing but after a couple weeks i got him to finish pretty consistently. the Varsity coach picked him up around mid season to give him a shot and he went on to be the leading goal scorer for the team. he dominated the varsity level as well.

i'm not going to say my coaching changed him into a super star, but i think he could play the college game. never played on a travelling team outside the AYSO all stars and he's got the talent to play D-1. he still needs some work but he learns really quick, and has the tools and instincts to make it.

i guess you can always argue, "where would he be if he didn't skip competative youth soccer?"