BVB General Discussion 2006/2007 Part I [R]

[footyfan1]

Bert tested him as a midfielder in the last match though. He's variable and I say he is our biggest talent! :)


Yeah. That's what I hear from one of the guys on the list. He told me about Tyrala last season. I've never seen him play yet myself, but I can't wait to. I hope he plays against Spurs in two weeks. I'll be there to see that one.

[HeyaBVB]

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6:2 bei Union Berlin - Borussia setzt ein
"Ausrufezeichen" in der Saisonvorbereitung

[23.07.] Erstmals mit den neuen Trikots lief Borussia Dortmund heute beim 1. FC Union Berlin auf - und setzte beim 6:2 (3:1)-Sieg vor 6.067 Zuschauern in der "Alten Försterei" gegen den Regionalliga-Aufsteiger buchstäblich ein "Ausrufezeichen" und bot eine engagierte, sehenswerte Leistung. An vier der sechs BVB-Treffer war Florian Kringe beteiligt.

Auf dem Weg ins Trainingslager nach Göttingen - die leicht angeschlagenen Weidenfeller, Amedick sowie Vrzogic waren bereits voraus gefahren - machte der BVB den Umweg über Berlin und gastierte beim DDR-Pokalsieger von 1968. Die Borussen boten über die gesamten 90 Minuten eine sehr engagierte Leistung und überzeugten ihren Trainer Bert van Marwijk mit flüssigen Kombinationen.

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Drei Tore, eine Vorlage: Florian Kringe.
Bereits nach zehn Minuten führte der BVB mit 2:0, nachdem sich Florian Kringe jeweils mit einer energischen Einzelleistung in Schussposition gebracht und eiskalt vollendet hatte. Fünf Minuten vor dem Halbzeitpfiff schloss Alexander Frei eine "Schweizer Co-Produktion" per Kopf mit dem dritten Treffer ab: Smolarek hatte den Ball steil nach rechts außen gespielt, Degen das Leder erlaufen und mustergültig auf seinen Landsmann geflankt. Überhaupt gefielen die Außenverteidiger Dede und Degen im neuen 4-4-2-System und brachten Schwung über die Flügel, und auch die Stürmer Frei und Smolarek fühlen sich in der neuen Grundordnung offenbar sehr wohl. Berlins Anschlusstreffer in der 43. Minute ging ein krasser Ballverlust im Mittelfeld voraus.

Sieben Minuten nach Wiederbeginn erhöhte Ebi Smolarek auf 1:4, als er einen Pass von Sahin aufnahm und nach einer feinen Körpertäuschung freie Schussbahn hatte. In der 60. Minute markierte Kringe per Kopf seinen dritten Treffer - die Flanke kam von Smolarek. Kringe hatte auch beim 6:1 seine Füße im Spiel: Per Lupfer bediente er Amoah (62.). Den Endstand erzielte der Berliner Benyamin aus klarer Abseitsposition (68.).

BVB: Meier - Degen (73. Saka), Brzenska, Wörns (46. Hünemeier), Dede - Kruska - Kringe (73. Ricken), Sahin - Pienaar (73. Tyrala) - Frei (56. Amoah), Smolarek (81. Amachaibou). Tore: 0:1 Kringe (4.), 0:2 Kringe (11.), 0:3 Frei (40.), 1:3 Benyamina (43.), 1:4 Smolarek (53.), 1:5 Kringe (60.), 1:6 Amoah (62.), 2:6 Benyamina (68.). (JS/br)

BVB won the friendly at Union berlin with 6:2
Frei made his first goal , after Degen gave him the ball, Kringe was the player of the match ... 3 goals and he gave amoah the ball for the 6:1
(his first goal for us too)

[smithfan]

Yeah. That's what I hear from one of the guys on the list. He told me about Tyrala last season. I've never seen him play yet myself, but I can't wait to. I hope he plays against Spurs in two weeks. I'll be there to see that one.

I saw him playing for the German U17 squad in a few matches. He was great in those matches, by far the best German player.

[footyfan1]

I saw him playing for the German U17 squad in a few matches. He was great in those matches, by far the best German player.

Awesome. I hope the talent meets the hype. :)

I love what the new management has done in developing our own young talent and finding new young talents. The smartest things the old management ever did was the hiring of their first and last coaches. Hitzfeld and van Marwijk......

[smithfan]

Awesome. I hope the talent meets the hype. :)

I love what the new management has done in developing our own young talent and finding new young talents. The smartest things the old management ever did was the hiring of their first and last coaches. Hitzfeld and van Marwijk......

why is that when you have a dutch coach, you suddenly develop some good youth or rather you get to see the youth players actually playing? (the talent has always been there imo).

That's the only thing I love the dutch for. :p

[footyfan1]

why is that when you have a dutch coach, you suddenly develop some good youth or rather you get to see the youth players actually playing? (the talent has always been there imo).

That's the only thing I love the dutch for. :p


What I hate is that you're right. The talent was always there, but our illustrious trainer before van Marwijk was f#cking clueless as to how to develop it. :mad:

Because of that, we let a lot of talent get away and didn't develop others well enough......

[The Old Lady Hertha]

I think we can finish anywhere from third to sixth. I think Bayern and Bremen will battle for the title and I think Bremen wins it.

I can't pinpoint a place we will finish now. Talk to me after the weekend of August 5th.

And even then, it will depend on what happens with the likes of HSV, Scheisse, Bayer 04. A lot will depend on whether Metzelder stays too.

I think HSV are going to miss Barbarez' leadership on the pitch more than people understand.

I think we are ahead of Hertha and Stuttgart now and even if we sell Metzelder.






European places for BvB too. Good team there. All depends on whether Frei can regain the form of two years ago. Last year he wasn't as good (just 7 goals). If he regains form and Valdez can show he can contribute more consistently, then they should be fine. Because now Metzelder (if he stays) is healthy and pretty much at WM 2002 form or better. Pienaar will be a good creator. Kringe, Sahin, Degen, Weidenfeller will continue to develop. A good bench too (possibly Smolarek, Brzenska, Gambino, Buckley [if he stays]).

As for Hertha, we are not Titanic yet, we are just listing. :)

[footyfan1]

European places for BvB too. Good team there. All depends on whether Frei can regain the form of two years ago.
Last year he wasn't as good (just 7 goals).


Wasn't he hurt a lot of last season? Besides, if he gives us the effort he showed at the World Cup, we'll be fine.


If he regains form and Valdez can show he can contribute more consistently, then they should be fine.

Valdez says he wants to score about fifteen goals, but if Frei does what I think he will do (Between 15 and 22 goals), between ten and fifteen from Valdez would be fine. As I said before the end of last season, I think you will see Pienaar attack more than Rosicky did and I also believe we'll get a few goals (No more than five or six) from Odonkor. I think his performance at the World Cup will do wonders for Odonkor's Bundesliga performance.


Because now Metzelder (if he stays) is healthy and pretty much at WM 2002 form or better.

Whoa! Stop! What did you see that makes you think Metzelder is in 2002 form or better?? His work at the World Cup? I didn't think that was "2002 Form". It was better than the form he was in, but Mertesacker saved Metze's ass quite a few times during the World Cup. I think Metze has to start for us, but I don't think he's back to that form he showed in 2002.

Hell, he may never get there again.



Pienaar will be a good creator.

As I said, I think you'll see him attack more than Rosicky did. I think you are going to see more "Dutch styled" football from BVB this season......



Kringe, Sahin, Degen, Weidenfeller will continue to develop.

Kringe will get to play at the beginning of the season, but will more than likely have to step aside for Tinga not long after Tinga arrives. Tinga is being brought in the be the ballwinner in midfield we hoped Kringe would develop into by now. I think Tinga is only being brought in because we need to finish in the top five this season. I think BvM will give Kringe the opportunity to win that job though.

I hope BvM begins to train Kringe to also be a backup for Dede. I don't want to have to depend on a 17 year old kid (Vrzogic, who is 16 now, but will be 17 when the season starts) to be our only backup at that position.



We also may switch to a 4-4-2, but it will still more than likely be:

GK: Weidenfeller

D: Degen, Woerns (Brzenska - first two matches), Metzelder, Dede

Sweeper: Kehl

Midfield: Odonkor, Pienaar, Tinga (Kringe)

Strikers: Frei, Valdez

If we play a 4-3-3, I think you'll still see the same guys, but just move Odonkor down to the front line with Frei and Valdez. However, I think we are going to switch between the two schemes depending on our opponents. That will help too. Under Sammer, BVB was too predictable. With BvM, you've always known you'd get the 4-3-3.

Now, they'll have to guess. And, later in the season, I wouldn't be shocked to see BVB switch back and forth between the two formations during matches.


I think you will see Degen get his wish to help in attack more when we are in the 4-4-2. You may get to see him go forward more than he did last season because he knows how to play with Frei up front.

Weidenfeller continue to "develop?"

Dude, Weidenfeller is "developing" like a mother f#cker.

He's been statistically the top GK in the Bundesliga two years in a row. Had he not injured his knee last season, he would have been on everyone's team of year lists. I don't see how much more he has to "develop."

He doesn't make stupid mistakes and he's rarely caught in a bad position. I believe he's already ready to make an assault on Lehmann and Hildebrand.

I just wish we still had Gentenaar in case Weidenfeller gets hurt again. I don't have a lot of confidence in Bernd Meier.



A good bench too (possibly Smolarek, Brzenska, Gambino, Buckley [if he stays]).


Smolarek will almost certainly start the season on the bench as BVB reports today that Valdez is now fit again. Valdez came back from vacation nursing a torn muscle he says he tore in Paraguay's final match at the World Cup.


Brzenska should start the first two matches as Woerns finishes his four match suspension for his "elbow" to former FCN striker Stefan Kiessling. After that, unless there's a problem with BvM and Metze or an injury of some sort, Brzenska should return to the bench.


Dude, Gambino is with 1. FC Koln now. He left right after last season. :D


BVB are actively trying to either sell Buckley or loan him out. I guess when you are bought to score goals and you go through an entire season without scoring one, a club will try to get rid of your ass. Were it me, I would have kept Buckley on for this season, but that's because I have a "fan's faith" in him. I rarely have that in players, but I have it in Buckley for some reason. However, I fully understand what the club are trying to do.

I guess you know Buckley is currently on trial at Everton right?

I think BVB are more interested in Amoah's potential than in giving Buckley another shot. Plus, as far as I know, Amoah is much cheaper.



As for Hertha, we are not Titanic yet, we are just listing. :)

Dude, I'm not saying this to be an a$$hole but I truly think you guys are a sinking ship. What your club is going through right now reminds me of BVB going into the 2003-2004 season when all of our problems first came to light. However, one thing that bodes well for you guys is that you aren't in as deep as we were.

Perhaps the team will come together after they dump Marcelinho, but if he stays, you guys will have problems.........

The UI Cup win was nice, but at that time we did the same thing. I wish you guys the best, but I can't say I see an overall good season for you guys.

Sure, I think Hertha will make some noise. Especially early in the season, but I just see things coming apart there.

Sorry. :(

But take heart. I was never more wrong than I was about this last World Cup. Maybe my inaccuracies will continue...... :o

[HeyaBVB]

Wasn't he hurt a lot of last season? Besides, if he gives us the effort he showed at the World Cup, we'll be fine.




Valdez says he wants to score about fifteen goals, but if Frei does what I think he will do (Between 15 and 22 goals), between ten and fifteen from Valdez would be fine. As I said before the end of last season, I think you will see Pienaar attack more than Rosicky did and I also believe we'll get a few goals (No more than five or six) from Odonkor. I think his performance at the World Cup will do wonders for Odonkor's Bundesliga performance.




Whoa! Stop! What did you see that makes you think Metzelder is in 2002 form or better?? His work at the World Cup? I didn't think that was "2002 Form". It was better than the form he was in, but Mertesacker saved Metze's ass quite a few times during the World Cup. I think Metze has to start for us, but I don't think he's back to that form he showed in 2002.

Hell, he may never get there again.





As I said, I think you'll see him attack more than Rosicky did. I think you are going to see more "Dutch styled" football from BVB this season......





Kringe will get to play at the beginning of the season, but will more than likely have to step aside for Tinga not long after Tinga arrives. Tinga is being brought in the be the ballwinner in midfield we hoped Kringe would develop into by now. I think Tinga is only being brought in because we need to finish in the top five this season. I think BvM will give Kringe the opportunity to win that job though.

I hope BvM begins to train Kringe to also be a backup for Dede. I don't want to have to depend on a 17 year old kid (Vrzogic, who is 16 now, but will be 17 when the season starts) to be our only backup at that position.



We also may switch to a 4-4-2, but it will still more than likely be:

GK: Weidenfeller

D: Degen, Woerns (Brzenska - first two matches), Metzelder, Dede

Sweeper: Kehl

Midfield: Odonkor, Pienaar, Tinga (Kringe)

Strikers: Frei, Valdez

If we play a 4-3-3, I think you'll still see the same guys, but just move Odonkor down to the front line with Frei and Valdez. However, I think we are going to switch between the two schemes depending on our opponents. That will help too. Under Sammer, BVB was too predictable. With BvM, you've always known you'd get the 4-3-3.

Now, they'll have to guess. And, later in the season, I wouldn't be shocked to see BVB switch back and forth between the two formations during matches.


I think you will see Degen get his wish to help in attack more when we are in the 4-4-2. You may get to see him go forward more than he did last season because he knows how to play with Frei up front.

Weidenfeller continue to "develop?"

Dude, Weidenfeller is "developing" like a mother f#cker.

He's been statistically the top GK in the Bundesliga two years in a row. Had he not injured his knee last season, he would have been on everyone's team of year lists. I don't see how much more he has to "develop."

He doesn't make stupid mistakes and he's rarely caught in a bad position. I believe he's already ready to make an assault on Lehmann and Hildebrand.

I just wish we still had Gentenaar in case Weidenfeller gets hurt again. I don't have a lot of confidence in Bernd Meier.






Smolarek will almost certainly start the season on the bench as BVB reports today that Valdez is now fit again. Valdez came back from vacation nursing a torn muscle he says he tore in Paraguay's final match at the World Cup.


Brzenska should start the first two matches as Woerns finishes his four match suspension for his "elbow" to former FCN striker Stefan Kiessling. After that, unless there's a problem with BvM and Metze or an injury of some sort, Brzenska should return to the bench.


Dude, Gambino is with 1. FC Koln now. He left right after last season. :D


BVB are actively trying to either sell Buckley or loan him out. I guess when you are bought to score goals and you go through an entire season without scoring one, a club will try to get rid of your ass. Were it me, I would have kept Buckley on for this season, but that's because I have a "fan's faith" in him. I rarely have that in players, but I have it in Buckley for some reason. However, I fully understand what the club are trying to do.

I guess you know Buckley is currently on trial at Everton right?

I think BVB are more interested in Amoah's potential than in giving Buckley another shot. Plus, as far as I know, Amoah is much cheaper.





Dude, I'm not saying this to be an a$$hole but I truly think you guys are a sinking ship. What your club is going through right now reminds me of BVB going into the 2003-2004 season when all of our problems first came to light. However, one thing that bodes well for you guys is that you aren't in as deep as we were.

Perhaps the team will come together after they dump Marcelinho, but if he stays, you guys will have problems.........

The UI Cup win was nice, but at that time we did the same thing. I wish you guys the best, but I can't say I see an overall good season for you guys.

Sure, I think Hertha will make some noise. Especially early in the season, but I just see things coming apart there.

Sorry. :(

But take heart. I was never more wrong than I was about this last World Cup. Maybe my inaccuracies will continue...... :o


I wonder if Marcelinhos Agent is named Nivaldo Baldo .... *whistles* if yes that guy has a nose for a**es

[footyfan1]

It's funny to try to start a conversation by responding to my own quotes, but things have changed in the following scenario and I think we can have a BVB/Bundesliga relevant discussion about it.

Those on our BVB e-mail list have seen me do this before.....



It's just Bayern being Bayern. That's what they do. I don't think Bayern has a snowball's chance in hell of getting RvN.

I think he's ticketed for Real Madrid to replace Ronaldo, who will probably have his fat a$$ sold back to Inter.


It's starting to look more and more like I was wrong here. Bayern seem to be confident they will get RvN and when they feel like that, they normally have information they haven't let out.

Either that, or it's a case of Real not wanting to come close to Man U.'s price.

The thing is, if this goes through, how does it affect the rest of the Bundesliga?

How does it affect BVB??


However, if that miracle does happen, how about tossing Pizarro our way??! :D

Pizarro says he doesn't want to leave Bayern even if they get RvN, but there are reports that Bayern are so confident they will get RvN, that they're already negotiating with HSV for a transfer of either Makaay or Pizarro to Hamburg.......... :(

[footyfan1]

I wonder if Marcelinhos Agent is named Nivaldo Baldo .... *whistles* if yes that guy has a nose for a**es


I think the guys who follow Baldo's advice are a$$holes for doing so.

And stupid on top of it.

And yes, I know who I'm referring to and it's not Marcelinho....... ;)

[smithfan]

It's starting to look more and more like I was wrong here. Bayern seem to be confident they will get RvN and when they feel like that, they normally have information they haven't let out.

Either that, or it's a case of Real not wanting to come close to Man U.'s price.

The thing is, if this goes through, how does it affect the rest of the Bundesliga?


I've read somewhere that Real Madrid still hasn't paid the full price for David Beckham, they pay installments. However, Bayern could pay in cash so to speak.

No matter what, I don't think that it will affect the Bundesliga that much. Maybe Bremen will have it a bit harder to win the Meisterschaft, but I still believe that Werder Bremen has the best choice and after all, they have Klose. I don't rate Ruud better than Klose at all.

[footyfan1]

I've read somewhere that Real Madrid still hasn't paid the full price for David Beckham, they pay installments. However, Bayern could pay in cash so to speak.

I'll try to look into that. If that was the deal, I don't think there's anything wrong with that. It's convenient for them and gives Manchester United a steady flow of cash. As small as it may be, anything incoming looks good on Man U.'s books.

However, I find it hard to believe that Real cannot (or could not) pay a 22M Euro transfer fee for RvN in one payment.

With the credit lines they still have, that should not be a problem.



No matter what, I don't think that it will affect the Bundesliga that much. Maybe Bremen will have it a bit harder to win the Meisterschaft, but I still believe that Werder Bremen has the best choice and after all, they have Klose. I don't rate Ruud better than Klose at all.


I think when he is on his game, RvN is better than Klose.

Problem is, during the final part of the Premiership season and during the World Cup, RvN was not on his game. Despite his problems with injuries and Alex Ferguson last season, RvN still scored 21 goals in the Premiership alone. That's no small feat. The season before that, despite injuries, RvN scored 10 goals in the CL alone.

Again, no small feat.

Besides, Klose told BayScum a long time ago that he'll never play for them! LOL!! :D It's one of the reasons I love that kid so much! He sees right through them!

However, I think Bayern are making a huge mistake here. Instead of focusing on getting another "name" on their team, I think they should be spending that money on a playmaking/attacking midfielder. Deisler has already said he's not coming back until he knows he's 100% and he probably never will be.

Scholl is great for a few matches or in a sub's role, but he can't carry the load again. Haregraves is a hard worker, but he's more of a ball-winner and attacker, not playmaker. Pig Mounter (Schweinsteiger) is a flat out attacker. He doesn't do much more. I don't think they trust Ali Daei to carry the load.

One of the guys on our e-mail list thinks Bayern should spend that money on Riquelme. Then he pretty much said it doesn't bother him that Bayern are "f#cking up with their money".

I agree with him. 100%! LOL!! :D

To the other part of my question. "How does this affect BVB?"

In my opinion, it doesn't. If they get RvN, he might torch us for a hat-trick on opening night, but other than that, unless we somehow find ourselves playing for the title, I don't think BayScum getting RvN affects us one way or the other.........

[Neutral2]

RvN is not as good as Klose, stop dreaming. The only thing RvN can keep up with Klose is scoring from inside the box. In every other aspect of the game Klose is better.

[footyfan1]

RvN is not as good as Klose, stop dreaming. The only thing RvN can keep up with Klose is scoring from inside the box. In every other aspect of the game Klose is better.


Not dreaming. We simply disagree.

But I like someone who can be as rude as me about it!

BTW, next time at least TRY to throw something about BVB in there......

[The Old Lady Hertha]

Dude, I'm not saying this to be an a$$hole but I truly think you guys are a sinking ship. What your club is going through right now reminds me of BVB going into the 2003-2004 season when all of our problems first came to light. However, one thing that bodes well for you guys is that you aren't in as deep as we were.

Perhaps the team will come together after they dump Marcelinho, but if he stays, you guys will have problems.........

The UI Cup win was nice, but at that time we did the same thing. I wish you guys the best, but I can't say I see an overall good season for you guys.

Sure, I think Hertha will make some noise. Especially early in the season, but I just see things coming apart there.

Sorry. :(

But take heart. I was never more wrong than I was about this last World Cup. Maybe my inaccuracies will continue...... :o

No, Marcelinho is NOT the problem, you should know by now from me that H*eness and G*tz are the problems. :D

@ Metzelder: World Cup I thought he was tremendous, especially the Italy game. I think he got stronger and stronger as the tournament went on, which will do no harm. I think he saved Mertesacker's bacon some times too. I say Mertesacker was slightly better, but Metzelder was more than good.

@ Frei: He scored a debatable goal against Korea, and nothing else (scoring wise)...He's there in Dortmund to score goals, effort is one thing (Nando Rafael gave a lot of EFFORT but he couldn't do jack for us in front of goal), but he needs to score. I think he will though, don't worry. I've got him scoring 15-20 too and in the top 5 in the scoring charts.

[The Old Lady Hertha]

RvN is not as good as Klose, stop dreaming. The only thing RvN can keep up with Klose is scoring from inside the box. In every other aspect of the game Klose is better.

I dunno about this one. Maybe this year we will find out. :D

[smithfan]

RvN is not as good as Klose, stop dreaming. The only thing RvN can keep up with Klose is scoring from inside the box. In every other aspect of the game Klose is better.

agreed :)

Vrzogic has an injury btw - back in 3 weeks.

[footyfan1]

No, Marcelinho is NOT the problem, you should know by now from me that H*eness and G*tz are the problems. :D

Agree. Marcelinho is just PART of the problem. Just like the guy "HeyaBVB" loves to hate was only PART of our problem. I think Marcelinho's "problem" is largely the same "problem" our guy had.

But, "HeyaBVB" is right in saying their actions are completely a$$hole.



@ Metzelder: World Cup I thought he was tremendous, especially the Italy game. I think he got stronger and stronger as the tournament went on, which will do no harm. I think he saved Mertesacker's bacon some times too. I say Mertesacker was slightly better, but Metzelder was more than good.


I think we have to have our "Sanneh Disagreement" here. LOL!! :D


@ Frei: He scored a debatable goal against Korea, and nothing else (scoring wise)...He's there in Dortmund to score goals, effort is one thing (Nando Rafael gave a lot of EFFORT but he couldn't do jack for us in front of goal), but he needs to score. I think he will though, don't worry. I've got him scoring 15-20 too and in the top 5 in the scoring charts.

The reason I stressed effort is that Frei will have more HELP up front in Valdez and more service and HELP in midfield from Pienaar and Odonkor than he did from the Swiss midfield in the World Cup.

Oh, BTW, Frei seemed to get a lot more service from the right wing in the World Cup than he did from the middle.

Guess what? The guy who provided that service? He plays for BVB too.

I have no worries about Alex Frei. I don't expect him to break goal-scoring records, but I do expect more consistent scoring from him and Valdez than we got from Koller and Smolarek the past two seasons.

And that's the only thing that kept us out of the top four or five both seasons. Lack of scoring........

Am I wrong guys?? :cool:

[smithfan]

I still don't like Valdez. He was my absolute "concentrated hate" player in Bremen. And now he's a player of my favourite club. :(

I don't like his attitude. He plays for himself and not for BVB. He's too selfish as a character and as a football player and imo he's a Chancentod ;)

What if he plays bad and must sit on the bench? Will he do the same shit he did in Bremen?