France vs. Togo [R]

[BenP]

not from what I've seen. Moreover the style that they play - i.e. a possession game - directly damages ours. As we've seen against Togo, we need loads of chances to score, and we can't create them if they pressure our wingers and our midfield. We gave away the ball too many times today, the main culprits being Silvestre and Makalele, and that's going to haunt us against Spain as they won't give us a lot of looks at goal.

I'm glad you noticed that with Makelele. I'd consider sitting him against Spain - or certainly subbing him as the game went on. He was France's worst player in the last 20 mins of that game. He gave a way the ball too much.

Also, I don't know how to feel about the way France played after getting the 2 goal lead they needed. I understand they wanted to hold the lead and kill the game off, but I think playing this way is a mistake, esp. against a team like Togo. It reminded me sooo much of England, that last 20.

BTW, France's defense continues to look very good. I actually think Abidal's return is more important than Zidane's. With him back, their backline is just very good. One of the best in the tournament, frankly.

The problems are: Barthez, and scoring goals. At least the first would be easy to fix . . . The American commentators were harping on about that today - that Barthez is shaky, he is France's weak-link . . .

[BenP]

I agree. We killed the demons that haunted us (lack or no scoring, no victories, refereeing, etc...). On the bright side we missed a lot of chances that we should have made especially with Ribery, so we had the possession and the opportunities. If we are to defeat Spain we need to be sharp and on target and with the chances we get we need to score! The question I have in mind is what freakin formation are we reverting to with Zidane coming back into the lineup?!!?
I'm still in awe at how great Pat Vieira was in this game. He took the captain's armband and completely took over the duties of winning this game.

Happy Birthday Patrick Vieira!!!

Personally, I'd drop Makelele. He was single-handedly trying to give Togo a goal in the last 20 mins. He made at least 3 or 4 unneccessary give aways. Thats simply unacceptable for a player in his position.

[ilv2]

I'm glad you noticed that with Makelele. I'd consider sitting him against Spain - or certainly subbing him as the game went on. He was France's worst player in the last 20 mins of that game. He gave a way the ball too much.


I'd make a case for the entire game as well, he just wasn't on today - his positioning was terrible, his work rate, reading of the game, etc. It's abnormal for a player of his quality to stink it up that badly. Usually it's others that should be the question mark, and considering the importance of the upcoming game, this was really a poor moment to gave a substandard performance. I doubt Domenech will drop him though, so I hope Maka finds his usual form again.


Also, I don't know how to feel about the way France played after getting the 2 goal lead they needed. I understand they wanted to hold the lead and kill the game off, but I think playing this way is a mistake, esp. against a team like Togo. It reminded me sooo much of England, that last 20.

Agreed, it reminded me of the game against South Korea. Everything could've changed had the Koreans equalized and had we snatched a third. It would be us playing Ukraine. If the coach puts on two attacking players late in the game, it's quite obvious that he wants you to go for more. Instead, the players passed it back, slowed down, and were generally dissapointing.


The problems are: Barthez, and scoring goals. At least the first would be easy to fix . . . The American commentators were harping on about that today - that Barthez is shaky, he is France's weak-link . . .

Spot on. Barthez doesn't inspire any confidence, and all his 'saves' from the grand total of what 3 togolese shots were all a little worrying.

[sl7vk]

It would be great if Domenech dropped Maka and played Zidane ahead of Vieira in a diamond midfield.... It would also be great if I had laser vision, or could fly....

[AfrcnHrbMan]

what a heart attack first half! I think Ribery's slowing working the kinks out, even though he blew two great chances. Barthez, didnt impress. Talk about a performance on your birthday, I know I would have tried to kick ass.

[triplesevn]

I'm caught between a cat and a dog. My wife is Spanish and for Espania and of course I'm for France (And USA).

I'm actually nervous about Spain this year. They are the deepest of any team and I one of the younger teams out there. And after today's match against SA, I'm even more nervous now, than ever! Just imagine, they played their past 1st, current 2nd string players.

Although, I am in agreement that we tend to play up to the tougher teams and down against the teams we should beat. I think this match is going to PK's with France (Barthez) coming out on top!

I'm highly upset that we could face Brazil in the QF's.

I'm also highly upset at Ribery today. You can't be held the next Zizou with poor finishing like that. He better work in practice on better touches.

The Dom better stick to the current formation and team, with exception to Zizou back in the line up, Silvestre out, and possible fitting in Ribery at some point. Maybe even start him over Malouda in M. I doubt that though but just a suggestion.

[triplesevn]

what a heart attack first half! I think Ribery's slowing working the kinks out, even though he blew two great chances. Barthez, didnt impress. Talk about a performance on your birthday, I know I would have tried to kick ass.

And please explain how he did not? He had almost nothing to do the entire match.
But, the few things he did do, like that excellent save in the 1st half where he punched the ball away from the on rushing attacker. If you listened to the US Commentator, Balboa, he was wrong. If Barthez tries to hold on to a low swerving shot and you make an error, then the Togo player has a goal. He did proper on that save. Punch away.

He came out in the 2nd half on a 50/50 ball that he could not have gotten to with his hands, so he used his feet and put his hands above him in case of a lob. The play was called off side anyhow.

He controlled his back line and had good distribution of the ball.

So tell me again how he was unimpressive????

[BenP]

And please explain how he did not? He had almost nothing to do the entire match.
But, the few things he did do, like that excellent save in the 1st half where he punched the ball away from the on rushing attacker. If you listened to the US Commentator, Balboa, he was wrong. If Barthez tries to hold on to a low swerving shot and you make an error, then the Togo player has a goal. He did proper on that save. Punch away.

He came out in the 2nd half on a 50/50 ball that he could not have gotten to with his hands, so he used his feet and put his hands above him in case of a lob. The play was called off side anyhow.

He controlled his back line and had good distribution of the ball.

So tell me again how he was unimpressive????

I agree with you, on these two instances at least. I think Balboa is a lousy commentator in many ways, who talks to much, and contradicts himself every 5 minutes.

However, I don't know, maybe its an inbuilt prejudice - but when I see Barthez, something about his style of play doesn't inspire confidence in me.

[ilv2]

So tell me again how he was unimpressive????

He fumbled a save in the second half - the ball ended up rolling about 6 feet in front of him and he scrambled to cover it. Fortunately because Togo was playing on a counter attack there was nobody in the area to get a look at a rebound.

Of course, there's the South Korea game if you want other examples.

[jlscrub]

So how are you dudes gonna celebrate?

I'ma play some soccer in a lil bit then go and get intoxicated...

I wish i was in Paris or somethin, to go party at the clubs overthere.

[Allez Lyonnais]

Fab has been decent throughout this competition. I've gotta admit.

[jlscrub]

Congrats again..

enjoy these French hotties

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XR80iV_Ny9k

[lefutur]

i still havent seen the goals :(

[triplesevn]

He fumbled a save in the second half - the ball ended up rolling about 6 feet in front of him and he scrambled to cover it. Fortunately because Togo was playing on a counter attack there was nobody in the area to get a look at a rebound.

Of course, there's the South Korea game if you want other examples.

I just watch the save you speak of and that is typical of any keeper. The Togalise keeper did the same thing as well. I watched Buffon do the same thing. Not worried by that at all. But because most of you hate Barthez, you'll find any excuss to take a hit at him.

Tell me about the Korea match again? I know he fumbled the ball when he went to throw it out, which I would say is an error on his part, but I can look at countless other keepers during the WC so far who've made bigger errors that have cost their team a goal.

And as I said after the Korean match regarding the goal that was scored, (When I said Barthez was a far better keeper than Coupet, I didn't mean it like that. I meant he is more acrobatic than Coupet. I think they are both great keepers.)

Re: Ian Wright laughing like a girl at Gallas fury on english TV live

Let' see, Barthez is 182cm and Coupet is 181. Barthez is far better and "known" for his acrobatic ability.

Your gonna tell me that Coupet would have gotten the ball, with Park pushing in on him?

Look at this picture. Park is shoving Barthez as he reaches for the ball.

http://soccernet.espn.go.com/report?id=191946&cc=5901

I seem to remember Barthez making a crucial save in the Swiss match... I guess most of you have forgotten that already.
Other wise, we would be out of the cup already!!!!!

[Lensois]

So with the return of Zidane, where this formation headed?!?!

Perhaps it's blasphemy, but am I the only one who thinks we should leave Zizou out of the first 11 for this game and use him off the bench for a potential spark or to kill off the game (if we are fortunate enough to be in such a position)?

[sl7vk]

Perhaps it's blasphemy, but am I the only one who thinks we should leave Zizou out of the first 11 for this game and use him off the bench for a potential spark or to kill off the game (if we are fortunate enough to be in such a position)?

No, it isnt blasphemy.... Far from it. But it won't happe, not in a million years. Domenech making a stand like that.... Never..

All we can hope for, is that Zidane is rested and refreshed after sitting out. He knows these Primera League guys, lets hope he still has some fuel in the tank.

[allezlesbleusno1]

Well since it seems like we have to make due with Zidane in the lineup I propose what was proposed earlier, that is we replace Makelele with Zidane, push Zidane up and have Vieira remain as a DM...But I think we can all agree Vieira has hit form and he must be included in the starting 11...

------------------------Barthez-----------------------
----Sagnol-------Thuram------Gallas--------Abidal-----
------------------------Vieira-------------------------
---Ribery----------------------------------Malouda---
------------------------Zidane------------------------
-----------------Trezeguet----Henry------------------

perhaps this could be one of the potential formations?
We could substitute Trezeguet with Saha additionally?
No, it isnt blasphemy.... Far from it. But it won't happe, not in a million years. Domenech making a stand like that.... Never..

All we can hope for, is that Zidane is rested and refreshed after sitting out. He knows these Primera League guys, lets hope he still has some fuel in the tank.

[AfrcnHrbMan]

Yea never gonna happen, though it might make some sense. With Barthez the only play he seemed really confident making was that low cross into the box he punched away. Again this might be that Im a barthez hater which i fully admit to being. Or could it be that im a Coupet supporter....Anyway I wouldnt know what Balboa had to say on the matter because i was in a bar with no sound. I'm disgusted that you would think I take my footballing cues from that inept mongoloid.

[ilv2]

I just watch the save you speak of and that is typical of any keeper. The Togalise keeper did the same thing as well. I watched Buffon do the same thing. Not worried by that at all. But because most of you hate Barthez, you'll find any excuss to take a hit at him.

What? I have faith that, after all the matches throughout my years of watching footy, I can successfully identify a goalkeeping error when I see one. That's a fumble on the part of barthez, as it'd be a fumble if any other goalkeeper did it, and thank god nobody was there to pounce on the rebound.

You're right about hating Barthez though, I don't like the guy. That said, I don't go around complaining about him if there isn't a good reason to. pas la peine, if you will

Tell me about the Korea match again? I know he fumbled the ball when he went to throw it out, which I would say is an error on his part, but I can look at countless other keepers during the WC so far who've made bigger errors that have cost their team a goal.

right, well that doesn't excuse him. I don't want a keeper that makes lesser errors than others. I want a keeper that doesn't make errors at all.


And as I said after the Korean match regarding the goal that was scored...

Coupet's reflexes are better, so yes IMO.

[ilv2]

Well since it seems like we have to make due with Zidane in the lineup I propose what was proposed earlier, that is we replace Makelele with Zidane, push Zidane up and have Vieira remain as a DM...But I think we can all agree Vieira has hit form and he must be included in the starting 11...

------------------------Barthez-----------------------
----Sagnol-------Thuram------Gallas--------Abidal-----
------------------------Vieira-------------------------
---Ribery----------------------------------Malouda---
------------------------Zidane------------------------
-----------------Trezeguet----Henry------------------

perhaps this could be one of the potential formations?
We could substitute Trezeguet with Saha additionally?


I dunno, looking at the spanish lineup against ukraine their midfield and forwards were:
-----------Xabi-----------
---Senna--------Xavi-----
Garcia-----------------Villa
---------Torres-----------

If we play with one DM, we're leaving a big hole for the creative midfield players (Senna, Xavi) to interact with the three forwards (with two slighty withdrawn). Someone is going to need to man-mark torres, given his pace and strength, so that takes one of our centerbacks out of the equation. That leaves only thuram to deal effectively with the other two (as vieira would probably be assigned to stifle xavi and senna), who from what i've seen like to drift inside. Add to that their fullbacks who will get a chance to push up w/ possession play, and we're not looking good defensively.