World Cup referees and the US

[SouthRef]

As the assignments for the last first round games are being handed out, it appears that the USA S & D crew won't be getting on the field in Germany. I'd love to be shown wrong, but, we'll see. This seems to at least intterupt the trend of the last two tournaments where Baharmast and Hall received highly anticipated matches.

So - what do we have coming up? Mostly, I'm just curious. Here's the US FIFA list (as of January 1, 2006), and thinking about who's coming up for the next few years.



Referee Int'l Since Date of Birth
HALL Brian 1992 05.06.1961
KENNEDY Michael 1999 16.04.1961
PRUS Arkadiusz 2004 06.02.1964
SALAZAR Ricardo 2005 06.09.1972
STOTT Kevin 1995 09.07.1967
VAUGHN Terry 2004 01.04.1973


Assistant Referee Int'l Since Date of Birth
BARKEY Gregory 1995 20.08.1963
CLEMENT Nathan 1999 02.04.1961
DAVIDSON Steven 2003 02.05.1967
FEREDAY Robert 2000 18.05.1962
GANSNER George 2002 13.10.1971
LOWRY Craig 1998 21.04.1961
QUISENBERRY Kermit 2004 27.09.1968
STRICKLAND Chris 2002 29.11.1966
SUPPLE Thomas 2004 17.12.1965
TOVAR Fabio 03.01.1967

As a starter, Stott will be 43 for WC 2010 in South Africa.

Love to hear thoughts.

[MassachusettsRef]

STOTT/Strickland/Gansner for 2010...if nothing happens fitness-wise, that should be almost a guarantee. Gansner is the only wildcard. Stott may be more comfortable with someone else, or USSF might want to push Quisenberry or Supple, since 2010 is their last chance.

VAUGHN is clearly our next guy after that. I know some think he could make it in 2010, but I severely doubt it. For one, he's not well-known in CONCACAF, yet. In fact, I don't think he's even done one Hexagonal match. 2008-9 will be where Vaughn gets his feet wet. He then should be a lock for 2014. Who his ARs are, other than Gansner, is anyone's guess. The person might not even be on the FIFA list, yet (I have a specific person in mind here).

I also don't think we'll get a second person for 2014. Most of our current FIFAs will be retired, and I just don't think Salazar has what it takes. I think 2018 will be the first WC the US gets two referees. I have two favorites for that second spot, both are current MLS centers, both are still only nationals, and both could be getting FIFA badges soon. But seeing 12 years into the future in the refereeing world is almost impossible--a lot can happen in the meantime.

[usatowin]

Eligible

2010 Refs
Stott
Salazar
Vaughn

2010 ARs
Davidson
Gasner
Quisenberry
Strickland
Supple
Tovar

2014 Refs
Salazar
Vaugh

2014 ARs
Gasner

2010: Stott is the clear #1, but they should push Salazar/Vaughn in the early stages to get them recognition and maybe at least an S&D spot. AR team 1 Strickland and Quisenberry/Gasner. AR team 2 Gasner/Quisenberry and Supple.

2014: Even then, it's not safe that we'll have two unless they bump the numbers back up. A toss up between Salazar/Vaughn. AR spots are wide open with only Gasner left.

If the retirement age is ended:
2010: Too late for Hall as he'll retire at the end of this year before the change is made. Prus (46) might jump in the running and Barkey (46) probably goes back.

2014: FIFA is probably done with Stott (46) and the rest of the current list is 50 or better. Quisenberry (45 and 9 months) probably gets another shot. Strickland (47) is probably the only other one who'd still be in shape.

[MassachusettsRef]

2010: Stott is the clear #1, but they should push Salazar/Vaughn in the early stages to get them recognition and maybe at least an S&D spot. AR team 1 Strickland and Quisenberry/Gasner. AR team 2 Gasner/Quisenberry and Supple.USSF will certainly push Vaughn as much as they can, but remember it goes USSF-CONCACAF-FIFA. For FIFA really to see Vaughn, he has to get his foot squarely in the door of the CONCACAF Champion's Cup and the Hexagonal. There's an outside shot, but I really don't see that happening this time around.

2014: Even then, it's not safe that we'll have two unless they bump the numbers back up. A toss up between Salazar/Vaughn. Is that your opinion or do you really think it's a 50/50 shot? Because, I feel that is stretching the definition of "toss up" to a level I've never seen before. Based on assignments--for MLS, for international matches on US soil, and for CONCACAF appointments--that decision has quite clearly already been made.

To really appreciate the chances of American referees, we have to look at the general prospects for officials in CONCACAF. Yes, we could get 3, 4 or even 5 referees at the tournament. But, most probably, we're still only going to nominate about 6 or maybe 7 to compete in the first place. So, who's out there?

[when I say 'lock' below, I mean a lock for nomination, not for WC2010 itself]

Archundia is still age eligible (he's 40 this year), so that's a lock [1].
Stott, barring something strange happening in USSF or an injury, is a second lock [2].
As much as I hate to say it, since the Mexican FA won't try to rock the boat, Rodriguez is probably a lock [3].
Batres--to my own personal shock--will still only be 42 in 2010. Unless he gets injured again, or never recovers, he's a lock [4].

So that leaves 2-3 open slots for nomination.

Brizan, of Trinidad & Tobago, judging by his nationality and the assignments he was starting to get in 2006 qualifying, will probably get a nomination [5].

Navarro of Canada, who is 40, will probably get a nomination [6].

So, unless CONCACAF gets more nomination slots, there's really not even a slot for Vaughn to start with. IF there's a 7th slot, I bet Vaughn would be fighting it out with a yet unknown Central American. And, really, if he got on the nomination list, the chances of his selection, purely for political reasons, are very slim.

Actually, reasoning it out like this (frankly, I'm shocked Batres, Archundia and Navarro are still age-eligible), I'm now even more convinced that Vaughn has little chance for 2010. USSF should back Stott hard and hope for the best.

[usatowin]

Is that your opinion or do you really think it's a 50/50 shot? Because, I feel that is stretching the definition of "toss up" to a level I've never seen before. Based on assignments--for MLS, for international matches on US soil, and for CONCACAF appointments--that decision has quite clearly already been made.

It's way too far out to determine 2014. Vaughn is the front runner for #2 in 2010, but there's plenty of time for Salazar in either, and moreso in 2014. Vaughn could screw up, Salazar could smell WC and turn it up, someone could come out of nowhere for 14, politics could shift, too many factors and too much time.

[MassachusettsRef]

It's way too far out to determine 2014. Vaughn is the front runner for #2 in 2010, but there's plenty of time for Salazar in either, and moreso in 2014. Vaughn could screw up, Salazar could smell WC and turn it up, someone could come out of nowhere for 14, politics could shift, too many factors and too much time.Fair enough, but look at past CONCACAF assignments.

Baharmast was set up for 1998 with some qualifying matches in 1994. Hall for 02, with some 98 matches. Then Stott this time, as he had the "second tier" qualifiers in the 02 campaign. If Salazar wants a shot at 2014, he needs to be somewhere on the map with CONCACAF in the next 2 years. And Vaughn quite clearly has the inside track on that.

As my above post should show, because of age considerations, a lot of what's going to happen in CONCACAF the next 4-6 years is pre-scripted. There's just not much room for a second 'top tier' American referee and certainly no room for a third. Vaughn continues to impress at all levels, and he's going to get his shot starting in 2007. I'm sorry to say it, but I think Salazar's had the past 4-5 years (yes, even before they got their white badges) to surpass Vaughn. He hasn't. Is it the complete end of the story? No. But Vaughn has limitless potential in front of him and, in my personal opinion, he just keeps getting better, so I don't forsee the slip-up necessary for Salazar to work his way in to this equation.

[SouthRef]

A point for those who may be interested:

The last time a USA referee was on the field for a WC match outside of the first round was July 1, 1990, when Vinnie Mauro was AR1 on the England:Cameroon quarterfinal in Naples.

-also-

David Socha was AR1 on July 8, 1982 in the Poland:Italy semifinal in Barcelona.

I can't seem to find any WC post-first-round matches in which a US ref was in the middle.

Ever


What does this mean for US referees?

Those with experience are (home and abroad) are respectfully asked to provide insight into this, as it has nagged me for a while.

[MassachusettsRef]

Well, consider that prior to 1994, FIFA had one type of official (not distinct referees and assistant referees), the accomplishments in the 1980s and, in particular, 1990 (Mauro was on the field for the ARG/CMR, NED/GER, and CMR/ENG matches) are definitely something to be proud of.

1994 was an anomaly. Quite frankly, we didn't have that strong of an entrant (Angeles) and he had a little bit of a mini-debacle right before the tournament as a fourth official.

1998, Baharmast had great assignments in the first round and stayed at the tournament even after his controversial (correct) penalty. He was available for the rest of the tournament and worked as a 4th.

Same thing basically happened with Hall in 2002.

Honestly, if Stott goes back in 2010, he might be one of the most well-positioned US refs for a knockout stage middle.

[USSF REF]

I for one, fully expect to be refereeing at the 2026 World Cup. I should be on the FIFA list by then... no problems... :rolleyes:

I hope to make the FIFA list by 2015... :p

You gotta have goals right? I for one can't wait to reach the top of this profession, only to have a bunch of people on a blog board disect every decision I make, and to say how much I suck and how I am terrible. But by then, we should have instant replay anyway, right?!

[usatowin]

I for one, fully expect to be refereeing at the 2026 World Cup. I should be on the FIFA list by then... no problems... :rolleyes:

I hope to make the FIFA list by 2015... :p

You gotta have goals right? I for one can't wait to reach the top of this profession, only to have a bunch of people on a blog board disect every decision I make, and to say how much I suck and how I am terrible. But by then, we should have instant replay anyway, right?!

Just make sure when you pull a Poll you get on within hours telling us about your random match. :p

[USSF REF]

Just make sure when you pull a Poll you get on within hours telling us about your random match. :p

I should have known I was opening up that can of worms.

But OK, It's a promise. :) But Can I be the first to show 4 cautions before a red?

[litlewojo7]

Does anyone think that the aftermath of Aus/Cro. is going to hurt Stott in the future of FIFA since he was the 4th Official and did not act on the double booking to notify Poll?

[USSF REF]

Does anyone think that the aftermath of Aus/Cro. is going to hurt Stott in the future of FIFA since he was the 4th Official and did not act on the double booking to notify Poll?

Of course it is. It's part of his job to point out this sort of thing to the referee.

[SouthRef]

Well that was a &$@! game

I really hate to say this, but honestly, I think that any potential USA referee participation in the 2010 WC is now wide open.

We may have just lost our spot as well.

Well, what do I know?! - I'm just on the periphery of all this, enough to be pretty durn interested, but not enough to be in the thick of it.

I just felt sick for Poll and his crew, and Stott and Barkey. I really did.

My ultimate reaction:

Well &%#!

We shall see what happens. Ultimately, on the positive side, this game did NOT start a war, and no one was hurt. That's about all the positives I can take from this. I have the feeling that this does not bode well for the US referee program on the international level.

:(