City of Miami Courting MLS

[snorklefish]

Miami Today, a small, respected business newspaper, is reporting in its February 27, 2003 print edition that "The city of Miami is actively courting sports franchises to makes the Orange Bowl Stadium their home." Specifically, the article states that the mayor of Miami met with MLS officials in New York.

Local Developer Jorge Perez was interviewed about becoming an MLS investor. "I love soccer...I would like to invest in a soccer team. If it makes economic sense, I am interested."

Said a city insider Jorge Perez "has been doing a lot of things with the city lately...I would not be surprised if the mayor passed this idead on to him."

Now... why the MLS would want to go into an 80,000 seat stadium is beyond me... but from a personal standpoint, I don't care-- I'd go.

As for the economics of a huge football stadium...well that all depends upon your lease. And since the Orange Bowl sits vacant for most of the year... a good lease shouldn't be out of the question.

In any event...whether you're located in Seattle, Tulsa or Miami...I suggest that their is only ONE real requirement for an MLS franchise-- Finding a sugar daddy. With the mayor pushing MLS, and a prominent developer publicly considering MLS...Miami just took a surprising step forward.

[neilgrossman]

I thought Horowitz had MLS rights to the city. Until it makes financial sense to him, I doubt Miami gets a team.

[michael greene]

I'd be shocked if MLS went back to Miami before trying a new market, esp. if the proposal is to use the Orange Bowl. If the developer is really interested, they should pitch a proposal for him to back a franchise elsewhere. MLS certainly needs investors.

[snorklefish]

I'm sure Miami isn't in the top 5 preferred sites for MLS. But what matters is money. More specifically...what matters is people willing to lose millions for years on the hope that their will be a big payoff 10 years down the line. THAT'S what is holding up MLS expansion...not stadiums or demographics.

[Mr. Bandwagon]

I think you're wrong to suggest that Miami only needs someone with deep pockets.

Because of single entity, half of all Miami franchise losses would be shared with the rest of the league - thus the entire league would be negatively affected by another money-losing Miami franchise regardless of whether the Miami I/O was willing to lose money.

MLS surely will not expand into a market where there is no foreseeable way to break even in the near future, and Miami has already proven to be a money-losing market. I'm sure that Garber and the MLS Board of Governors are willing to consider al expansion proposals, but when it comes down to selecting 2 expansion franchises for the 2005 season or beyond, it's going to come down to which 2 cities/investors can promise the best ownership, stadium and market situation and Miami is not going to be competitive.

[USAsoccer]

If MLS were to go back to Florida, it would be far far wiser to go back to Tampa over Miami.

1) Tampa has always outdrawn Miami in MLS. Miami had one of the best teams in MLS, and Tampa had the ALLTIME WORSE teams in MLS, and Tampa outdrew Miami in average attendence. Even in the old NASL days, the Rowdies doulbed the average that the old NASL Strikers drew.

2) Look at the average attendence in every sport, and Tampa draws better crowds. NFL: Bucs sellout every game, with 45,000 people waiting for season tickets. Miami rarely sellouts, unless it involves the J-E-T-S. NHL: Even when the Lightning had the worse team in the league, Tampa out drew the Panthers. Baseball: Tampa has the worse team in Major League Baseball, and out draws Miami by nearly 30 percent.

3) If Steinbrener is willing to build a SSS in Tampa, near the Yankees complex, MLS would be crazy to go anywhere else!

[soccerfan]

Miami ,Florida go AWAY !!!


If anyone wants to invest in soccer they can always for a partnership with other investors and get that expansion in one of the best locations (whatever that turns out to be after the home work is done ), but don't talk to me about Florida.

[caputobd]

Take a look at RFK Stadium and DCU's position. They are the only tenants (I don't count the WUSA garbage) and they have one of the worst lease deals in the league. The DC Sports and Entertainment Commission is raping and pillaging them. The Orange Bowl will do the same; they are just trying to make money. There is no way that the City of Miami will support MLS, we saw proof of this last time. They certainly won't now that it has been taken away once...

[Revolt]

Orange Bowl is only 50,000 seats - still too large. I love the stadium though & hope MLS can return there in the future because the South Florida market could potentially be a gold mine. Team West Indies FC, perhaps?

In Tampa, the only hope I can ever see is a combined Baseball Spring Training/Soccer facility. I think a right-sized dual purpose stadium could make economic sense. Someday.

[NACIONAL]

Originally posted by caputobd
Take a look at RFK Stadium and DCU's position. They are the only tenants (I don't count the WUSA garbage) and they have one of the worst lease deals in the league. The DC Sports and Entertainment Commission is raping and pillaging them. The Orange Bowl will do the same; they are just trying to make money. There is no way that the City of Miami will support MLS, we saw proof of this last time. They certainly won't now that it has been taken away once...

Agree totaly with you!!!

Originally posted by Revolt
Team West Indies FC, perhaps?


geez.... that is ugly ;)

[chichi]

Originally posted by Mr. Bandwagon
I think you're wrong to suggest that Miami only needs someone with deep pockets.

Because of single entity, half of all Miami franchise losses would be shared with the rest of the league -thus the entire league would be negatively affected by another money-losing Miami franchise regardless of whether the Miami I/O was willing to lose money.

MLS surely will not expand into a market where there is no foreseeable way to break even in the near future, and Miami has already proven to be a money-losing market. I'm sure that Garber and the MLS Board of Governors are willing to consider al expansion proposals, but when it comes down to selecting 2 expansion franchises for the 2005 season or beyond, it's going to come down to which 2 cities/investors can promise the best ownership, stadium and market situation and Miami is not going to be competitive.

For the love of God!

I wrote this in another post so I'll paste it so I wont have to type it again:

The Fusion was one of, if not the only team that actually made a profit it's last year in the league and we out drew 3 other teams in 2001. So you can't say we didn't go to the games. The owner didn't want to keep losing money because of the single entity B.S. and he didn't stick around to lose more money because other teams had bad stadium deals, etc. Thats why we really have no team. All the other excuses are made up justifications. Without the "Single entity" MLS system the Fusion would have survived. San Jose would be gone and many more.

That there will be a Profesional team in South Florida again I have no doubt. The question is when.

You want to know why there will be a team here again? Frankly, because everybody wants to come to sunny Miami and S. Florida.

[joe guy]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by neilgrossman
[B]I thought Horowitz had MLS rights to the city.

What does this mean? If I have big bucks and want to bring a team to Lauderdale, what happens? Does Horowitz have the hammer? And what is his leverage? This situation seems more than strange to me. Please explain.

[superdave]

Originally posted by snorklefish
what matters is people willing to lose millions for years on the hope that their will be a big payoff 10 years down the line. THAT'S what is holding up MLS expansion...not stadiums or demographics.
????

I don't get this. It's like asking, I don't care whether a company has a good balance sheet or a good profitable product in the pipeline, I care whether or not it's price is gonna go up. As if the latter doesn't flow inexorably from the former.

[Paul. A]

In years to come MLS should come back to Florida if the situation is right. I'm not saying that MLS should come back here before other cities, but one day it will come back I hope. I know more about Tampa than Miami, and things in Tampa weren't where they should be but an hell of a lot of kids used to come to the games.
I live in a redneck town and I'm starting to see an hell of a lot more kids with soccer balls around the street. It's encouraging! I've only lived here 8 years but the game I'm sure is slowly catching on. So Florida shouldn't be completely forgotten about down the line.

[Mike T]

Whats up with all the negativity, especilly Soccerfan. Once and for all you all have got to stop making comparison's about Miami when you are only speaking of Ft. Lauderdale. Though they are both in the region called "South Florida" when in many ways and particularly with regards to the sport of soccer are as different as the Washington/Baltimore area if not more.

Many of you speak of as if you know this area personally. Let me tell you you will never understand this difference until you live down here. I have lived down here nearly all my life and I will not stop reiterating the fact that Miami is NOT Ft. Lauderdale and continued comparisons are pointless and grossly erroneous.

PS: You can be sure if MLS can get near 15k or more to show up for at least one of those preseason games for the "Carnival Miami Cup" competition you can bet Miami WILL suddenly become "interesting" for MLS no doubt about it.

[bright]

Originally posted by Revolt
Orange Bowl is only 50,000 seats - still too large. I love the stadium though & hope MLS can return there in the future because the South Florida market could potentially be a gold mine. Team West Indies FC, perhaps?

In Tampa, the only hope I can ever see is a combined Baseball Spring Training/Soccer facility. I think a right-sized dual purpose stadium could make economic sense. Someday.

The capacity of the Orange Bowl is much more than 50,000 seats. Check out this link:
http://www.ci.miami.fl.us/PublicFacilities/Stadiums/Orange_bowl/Quick_Facts.htm

- Paul

[GIO17]

It's not so much that the people didn't come because they didn't want to see the Fusion, they never showed up because Horowitz was a jerk and he forfitted his right to invest in Miami as well in the MLS. Horowitz was suppose to be theinvestor for the Dallas Burn, but he gave it up. Lamar Hunt now has the Burn to add with the Crew & Wizards.

Can MLS turly work in Miami & or Florida? Yes with the right investor who truly wants it and can promote it to the hilt. I truly believe it can work in Florida with the right person.

Does this mean going back to scratch one? yes. Got to rebuild the trust from the Miami faithful all the way northeast towards Ft. Lauderdale since those are the areas that truly support soccer.

A good retirement community as well as alot of people who immagrated from Central & South American as well as Europe who have come to South Beach near Roadway A1A & I-95.

I know of the area because my Grandparents live down there and I visit at least twice a year. Would MLS try to go back to Florida?, I think so. It would be nice to see the state get a pro club back in MLS, but I agree that there should be caution to the wind.

[Mike T]

Originally posted by GIO17
.... Ft. Lauderdale since those are the areas that truly support soccer.


Based on that short but totally ignorant statement which is absolutly contradicted by all soccer data in the past 15 years of south florida soccer... I can tell you have not touched ground anywhere west of Miami Beach. The data greatly supports the Miami area as a significantly better supporter of soccer than Ft. Lauderdale... Gold Cup, International Friendlies, MLS games you name it... its not even close.

Do you know about the soccer rich areas you have totally ignored. Only as follows... the City of Miami, Coral Gables, Hialeah, East/West Kendall, Pinecrest, Cutler Rigde, North Miami/Little Haiti, Miami Springs, Miami Shores...etc, etc, etc. Next time you are down here try to catch some of the areas I mentioned you'll be rather surprised at what's going on west of the Beach.

[TommyMack]

My big regret is that I would have loved to fly out to see a game in Miami. That's a party town!

tm

[Freddy Garcia Lives]

suffer in Florida. Some great teams, ie Bucs, but especially in the summer, no one goes to games. Look at the terrible state of baseball in Forida, the two laughing stocks of baseball. But like Phoenix or Houston, not enough people are going to sit there in the blistering sun to see a positive result. Too bad to, with great latino cultures baseball and soccer should thrive.