Dear President Ahmadinejad...

[BenReilly]

I found this article interesting. Most Israelis would like to have friendly relations with Iran, but friendly or otherwise, some dialogue is becoming a necessity.


If President Moshe Katsav were to send a letter to the president of Iran, this is what he might write:

Permit me to go directly to the heart of the matter without a long introduction or roundabout language. We have reached the edge of the cliff, and the situation that both of our peoples face is very dangerous.

While not diminishing the importance of the United States, Israel and Iran must also find the path to a less confrontational relationship. Unless we begin to communicate directly, with civility and mutual respect, we will soon be in a conflict which will cause unimaginable destruction. As leaders, it is our responsibility to prevent this.

(...)
After painfully regaining our sovereignty and independence, the Jewish people is not going into exile again. In the many wars and confrontations that have been forced on us, we have fought with all of our strength to survive as a people and a nation, and we will continue to do so now.

(...)

And unless we understand each others' traumas and fears, we will soon find ourselves in the situation of a nuclear crisis, like the United States and Soviet Union during October 1962, but without a way to avoid disaster.

In that complex crisis, Kennedy and Khrushchev found a difficult path away from mutual destruction, as did the leaders of India and Pakistan just a few years ago - but they had ambassadors, embassies, and intermediaries. We have no means to speak to each other, and no one to guide us in such a situation.

If we continue down this road, there is no turning back.

The language that you use obsessively to refer to Israel and the Jewish people is disturbing, but we have never gone to war or risked sacred lives because of insults, and have no intention of doing so now. However, if you understood Jewish and Israeli history you would also realize that we have no choice but to consider the day when these words threatening our annihilation can be backed by the missiles and nuclear weapons you are acquiring. Since you claim to deny the reality of the Holocaust, you may also not know whether or where to stop in pressing this hostility.

http://www.jpost.com/servlet/Satellite?apage=1&cid=1145961381268&pagename=JPost%2FJPArticle%2FShowFull

[sardus_pater]

It would be quite good if Moshe Katsav actually wrote a letter to Ahmadinejad or maybe better to Khamenei.

If it's done in a private way it could be received.

Anyway i would not be surprised if some kind of secret discussing already exists.

[entropy]

It would be quite good if Moshe Katsav actually wrote a letter to Ahmadinejad or maybe better to Khamenei.

If it's done in a private way it could be received.

Anyway i would not be surprised if some kind of secret discussing already exists.

:mad: What are you, some kind of Zionist shill?:mad:

[sardus_pater]

:mad: What are you, some kind of Zionist shill?:mad:

Based on Entropy's response to my previous letter, I believe it's safe to say that Entropy, having recently learned a smattering of scientific terminology, uses it to hoodoo us. It is worth noting at the outset that he is always trying to change the way we work. This annoys me, because Entropy's previous changes have always been for the worse. I'm positive that his new changes will be even more ghastly, because Entropy had promised us liberty, equality, and fraternity. Instead, he gave us neocolonialism, paternalism, and militarism. I suppose we should have seen that coming, especially since the dynamics of the situation are such that I, speaking as someone who is not a combative, headstrong smart aleck, am not able rightly to apprehend the kind of confusion of ideas that could provoke Entropy to wiretap all of our telephones and computers. That should serve as the final, ultimate, irrefutable proof that Entropy's compeers actually believe the bunkum they're always mouthing. That's because these classes of unrestrained, crafty dunderheads are idealistic, have no sense of history or human nature, and they think that what they're doing will improve the world by the next full moon. In reality, of course, Entropy's perspective is that the world's salvation comes from whims, irrationality, and delusions. My perspective, in contrast, is that every concert that Entropy attends degenerates into a free-for-all of slam dancing and scattered fistfights. Of that I am certain, because Entropy spouts a lot of numbers whenever he wants to make a point. He then subjectively interprets those numbers to support his excuses while ignoring the fact that if you were to tell him that he is the grand master of obfuscation and misdirection, he'd just pull his security blanket a little tighter around himself and refuse to come out and deal with the real world. Entropy is extremely uncivilized. In fact, let's see what my handy-dandy Uncivilized-O-Meter has to say about him. Whoa! The needle is off the scale! It's a good thing I checked, because Entropy's criticisms of my letters have never successfully disproved a single fact I ever presented. Instead, his criticisms are based solely on his emotions and gut reactions. Well, I refuse to get caught up in Entropy's "I think … I believe … I feel" game. Someone has been giving his brain a very thorough washing, and now Entropy is trying to do the same to us. I have frequently criticized his unspoken plan to create a mass psychology of fear about an imminent terrorist threat. He usually addresses my criticisms by accusing me of interdenominationalism, obstructionism, child molestation, and halitosis. Entropy hopes that by delegitimizing me this way, no one will listen to me when I say that it's our responsibility to change the minds of those who inculcate the hermeneutics of suspicion in otherwise open-minded people. That's the first step in trying to strike at the heart of his efforts to twist the history, sociology, and anthropology disseminated by our mass media and in our children's textbooks, and it's the only way to transform our culture of war and violence into a culture of peace and nonviolence.

Entropy teaches workshops on Stalinism. Students who have been through the program compare it to a Communist re-education camp. Aside from a few exceptions, this statement is clearly valid. Let me try to explain what I mean by that in a single sentence: We must fight for what is right. Only then can a society free of his blockish tracts blossom forth from the roots of the past. And only then will people come to understand that he seems to have recently added the word "floccinaucinihilipilification" to his otherwise simplistic vocabulary. I suppose Entropy intends to use big words like that to obscure the fact that he always demands instant gratification. That's all that is of concern to him; nothing else matters -- except maybe to insult my intelligence. I tell you this because some of us have an opportunity to come in contact with impolitic delinquents on a regular basis at work or in school. We, therefore, may be able to gain some insight into the way they think, into their values; we may be able to understand why they want to evade responsibility. For that reason, some people say that that isn't sufficient evidence to prove that Entropy is secretly scheming to substitute breast-beating and schwarmerei for action and honest debate. And I must agree; one needs much more evidence than that. But the evidence is there, for anyone who isn't afraid to look at it. Just look at the way that my general thesis is that his drones are quick to point out that because he is hated, persecuted, and repeatedly laughed at, Entropy is the real victim here. The truth is that, if anything, Entropy is a victim of his own success -- a success that enables Entropy to criticize other people's beliefs, fashion sense, and lifestyle. I'll talk a lot more about that later, but first let me finish my general thesis: He fervently believes that one can understand the elements of a scientific theory only by reference to the social condition and personal histories of the scientists involved. This shows that he is not merely mistaken about one little fact among millions of facts but that Entropy coins polysyllabic neologisms to make his biases sound like they're actually important. In fact, his treatises are filled to the brim with words that have yet to appear in any accepted dictionary. One could truthfully say that the fabric of Entropy's allegations is infused with malicious communism. But saying that would miss the real point, which is that if we are powerless to carve solutions that are neither presumptuous nor sanctimonious, it is because we have allowed Entropy to transform our little community into a global crucible of terror and gore.

My own position on this issue is both simple and clear: We mustn't let Entropy spoon-feed us his pabulum. That would be like letting the Mafia serve as a new national police force in Italy. He maintains that either superstition is no less credible than proven scientific principles or that mediocrity is a worthwhile goal. Entropy denies any other possibility. Finally, whatever your thoughts or feelings about Entropy are, I urge you to help me challenge the present and enrich the future.

[Iranian Monitor]

That kind of letter is not going to impress Iran.

If Katsav wanted to write a letter, it should be one more like the following.

To His Excellency,
The President of the Islamic Republic of Iran

Dear President Ahmadinejad,

I am writing you as the President of a state you do not recognize, not in hopes of winning that recognition, but in pursuit of finding ways to encourage a dialogue on issues we can agree. While there are a lot of issues that separate Iran and Israel, we have a lot in common as well. We can work to build on what we share in common, as well as to find ways to bridge our differences. In such a dialogue, we will come to table ready to listen, with an open mind, and request the same in return.

As an Israeli who was born in Iran, I share with more than 300,000 Israelis of Iranian origin, a desire to seek friendly ties with Iran. If not immediately between our two states, than at least between our peoples. That desire is strengthened for me by the fact that the Jewish community in Iran, having lived in that country for more than 2,700 years, is one of the oldest anywhere. That desire is informed by the fact that Iran has played a pivotal role in the history of the Jewish people more generally. Our scriptures, many of our traditions, and some of the most significant events in forging the Jewish identity, stand testimony to this fact.

In the long struggle between the West and the East, typically the Jewish people saw themselves as belonging to the East. That was true during the Roman period, when Jews sides with Iran under the Parthians in its wars with Rome. It was true after the Islamic period, when Jews treated the Moslems as liberators and benefited from Moslem rule. Yet, the undeniable fact is that after the diaspora, many Jews who had settled in the West, became Westerners, even as they were butchered and slaughtered by the civilization they had embraced.

We will not agree about the solution that was crafted to find the Jews a homeland in the one land which they had ancestoral ties to. Naturally, the creation of the state of Israel is viewed by those who weren't Jews, and who were being displaced as a result, differently than by Jews who were desperate for a land of their own. That difference in viewpoints, however, belongs to history. Several generations of Israelis have been born to the land they call their own, and there is no solution that will see them relinquish their homes to return anywhere else.

That still leaves a lot of room for common agreement. That still leaves room for us to try to find ways to bridge our differences and to build on what we share in common.

In coming to the table for such a dialogue, we will not be carrying a brief for any other powers, not even our closest ally the United States. When it comes to the issues between Iran and Israel, this dialogue should be first and foremost about our two countries and the interests of our two people. And then about the interests of the people in our region more generally.

While we will come to the table as representatives of the state of Israel, you are free to see us as representatives of the Jewish people in Palestine. Either way, the main issues between us should not be removed from discussion due to our political differences. Those differences instead invite a discussion that is increasingly urgent and necessary for the well being of this region generally and our two people specifically.

In closing, let me assure you that regardless of how you respond, I will not accept that the fate of our two people is destined to end in a disastrous conflict. I will do my part to make sure that we do become friends once again.

[Rostam]

Bibi, would you `copy&paste` IM's letter and print it for Mr. Kastav and have him sign it.

Aghaye Katsav, azizam, ba ma digeh bazzari-bazi dar nayaar. ;)

[entropy]

snip

I'm honestly at a loss to craft a comprehensive reply to such an inoccuous, misguided post, but I shall try.

In my last post, I claimed (more or less) that scapegoatism is the leitmotif of Sardus Pater's manifestos, and that claim is even more true now. You see, I unmistakably believe that a recent fact-finder's report revealed that Sardus is not just uncouth, but proud of it. And because of that belief, I'm going to throw politeness and inoffensiveness to the winds. In this letter, I'm going to be as rude and crude as I know how, to reinforce the point that many people who follow Sardus's obloquies have come to the erroneous conclusion that all any child needs is a big dose of Israeli television every day. The stark truth of the matter is that we find among narrow and uneducated minds the belief that his Zionism is a final line of defense against tyrrany. This belief is due to a basic confusion, which can be cleared up simply by stating that the point at which you discover that Sardus's pea-brained witticisms may have serious repercussions, even beyond the issue of absenteeism, is not only a moment of disenchantment. It is a moment of resolve, a determination that all of the bad things that are currently going on are a symptom of his subhuman scribblings. They are not a cause; they are an effect. Sardus's dissertations are based on hate. Hate, unilateralism, and an intolerance of another viewpoint, another way of life.

[christopher d]

That sardus_pater has now been accused of Zionism gives me hope for this board, if not the world.

[Karl K]

Here's the best "letter" so far.

http://corner.nationalreview.com/post/?q=Njc0MjdjMzAzNzRjMGU4NDk3NGM3NDIzNDZlMjY0YWE=



Dear President Ahmadinejad,

Please forgive this tardy response to your letter of early May. We did not reply at first because we doubted the letter’s authenticity. We suspected that someone was trying to play a trick on you. The discourse, you must admit, is unusual for a communication between heads of state. However, now that you have openly admitted that the letter is yours, I will respond.

Thank you for your invitation to accept Islam. As you know, I am a Christian. Throughout your letter you accuse me of being a bad Christian, which leaves me puzzled as to why you think I might make a good Muslim. However, before you proselytize outside your own country, you might want to address the condition of the Islamic faith in Iran.

I am genuinely sorry to hear that so many Iranians, especially the young, have lost their faith because of their profound disillusionment with theocratic clerical rule. Apparently, there is no way for them to distinguish between their religion and your rule. That is understandable since you claim there is none, that your authority comes directly from God and you are ruling in his name. It is no wonder you disdain “liberalism and Western style democracy.” Under it, you would be answerable not only to God, but to the Iranian people, to whom God gave certain “unalienable Rights” that you and the mullahs have chosen to ignore. How ironic that, in the name of God, you deny your people’s God-given rights.

When young Iranians survey the way in which the clerical regime has enriched itself and impoverished the country, and enforced its rule with such harshness, what are they to think of this “God” who rules over them in this way? As a result, they abandon their religion and, unfortunately, many turn to drugs.

Your answer to the abuses under which the Iranian people live is nuclear “power.” Since your country is so richly endowed in oil and natural gas reserves, this is a strange answer. In fact, you so often denounce “lies” in your letter, I am surprised you would engage in such a whopper yourself. No country has conducted a 20-year clandestine program to develop nuclear power for peaceful domestic uses. The reason is that it is perfectly legal to do so in the open. In fact, we would support your nuclear power program, if that is what it was. However, as everyone outside of Cuba, Syria and Belarus knows, you are developing nuclear weapons.

You know that we know you are doing this. In fact, you deliberately exacerbate the free world’s worries with your continued exhortations about wiping Israel off the map. I understand that your policy of confrontation helps you to consolidate your domestic power and that is why you generate so much tension. The more likely you can make it seem that Iran will be attacked from the West, the more Iranians will rally around you. You provoke us. We respond. You get stronger. Since the Iranian people will soon realize we have no intention of attacking them, they will soon weary of this artificial hysteria and begin to wonder why your government fails to provide even the most basic necessities.

We also understand the real reason you want nuclear weapons. Of course, you have the dream of being the regional hegemon, and the prospect of your having nuclear weapons already terrifies your neighbors. But you also want them for the same reason as North Korea. Once you possess nuclear weapons, you believe you will be immune, as is North Korea, from external pressure for domestic political reform. You can tell the world to take a hike and to leave you in peace to oppress your own people. This is why Iranians who wish to see a return to genuine democratic, constitutional order despair at the thought of your succeeding. They know they will be finished, that no one will then dare speak up on their behalf.

So this is not really about nuclear weapons; it is about the rights of the Iranian people – your desire to take them away, and our desire to see them respected. We don’t worry about Great Britain, or France, or now India, having nuclear weapons, because they are democracies; they are founded on the “unalienable Rights” of their peoples. People who are free to exercise those rights seldom seek to take them from others. We, and the rest of the world, are worried because of the nature of your regime, because you deny you own people its rights. Therefore, we take you seriously when you say you will take rights from others – most especially their unalienable right to life – by “wiping them off the map,” and we see you seeking to obtain the means to do this.

We do not think the Iranian people are going to let you get away with this. They see their religion prostituted to power and their great culture traduced by fanatic ideologues. We are on their side.

Thanks for writing.


Sincerely,

George W. Bush



P.S. I attach a copy of the Declaration of Independence.

[entropy]

That sardus_pater has now been accused of Zionism gives me hope for this board, if not the world.

That is what I do, I bring hope. :D


.


.


.


Actually, on second thought, the thought that someone would think Sardus is a Zionist should scare the bejesus out of you. And I was only joking. About everything.

[BenReilly]

In the long struggle between the West and the East, typically the Jewish people saw themselves as belonging to the East. That was true during the Roman period, when Jews sides with Iran under the Parthians in its wars with Rome. It was true after the Islamic period, when Jews treated the Moslems as liberators and benefited from Moslem rule. Yet, the undeniable fact is that after the diaspora, many Jews who had settled in the West, became Westerners, even as they were butchered and slaughtered by the civilization they had embraced


I would like to think that we can move beyond a struggle between the West and the East. Of course, Jews have had a monumental role in shaping "Western civilization," starting with its theological framework. The one book nearly every literate person in the West has read was written by Jews. If we're to believe Mahathir Mohamad (which we shouldn't), Jews invented the human rights that make living in the West such a pleasure.

Nevertheless, I agree that Israel must become more culturally integrated into the Middle East and that Iran is the most natural friend Israel could have in the region. Iran, not the "Islamic Republic of Iran"

[Scarecrow]

Well if you take Karls letter, and IM's letter and burn them both as well as the authors then we would all be off to a good start.

The original post and letter speak very well about the situation. It would be nice if that letter were indeed sent to Iran.

As for any negotiations, it is well past time that Iran, the US, and Israel all sat down with each other and acted like mature grown ups and discussed issues. All 3 need to recognize each other and treat each other with the proper respect and attitude if any real solution is to ever come about.

I agree with the letter when it states that unlike the US and USSR and India and Pakistan, there are no real means of direct communication to prevent a disaster from taking place. I hope that all concerned understand this and do something about this before it is too late.

[Iranian Monitor]

I would like to think that we can move beyond a struggle between the West and the East. Of course, Jews have had a monumental role in shaping "Western civilization," starting with its theological framework. The one book nearly every literate person in the West has read was written by Jews. If we're to believe Mahathir Mohamad (which we shouldn't), Jews invented the human rights that make living in the West such a pleasure.

How about this revision, which also corrects an inadvertent typo.

In the long struggle between the West and the East, typically the Jewish people saw themselves as belonging to the East. That was true during the Roman period, when Jews sided with Iran under the Parthians in its wars with Rome. It was true after the Islamic period, when Jews treated the Moslems as liberators and benefited from Moslem rule. Yet, the undeniable fact is that after the diaspora, many Jews who had settled in the West, became Westerners, even as they were butchered and slaughtered by the civilization they had enriched and embraced.

Nevertheless, I agree that Israel must become more culturally integrated into the Middle East and that Iran is the most natural friend Israel could have in the region. Iran, not the "Islamic Republic of Iran"

As long as Israel remains an outgrowth of Western policy and policies, as long as it is incapable of securing real roots in the region it has now resettled, and as long as it adopts a purely Western identity, it will also be viewed an alien entity. Broadly speaking, as a Western colonial outpost.

The best solutions for both the Middle East and Western civilization, however, are informed by a synthesis of the best from both of them. Something along the lines, ironically, of Alexander's vision formed at a time when the division between West and (Middle) East had recently emerged. Israel, along with Iran, can play a huge role in finding that synthesis to the betterment of mankind.

What is important is that Israel seek this dialogue without preconditions, and without trying to force any recognition of what is in fact a faulty foundation in the manner of its creation. You can rest assured that once Israel is no longer a threat to Iran, that no country on earth has as much interest in finding a viable, lasting, solution for the problem of finding Jews a home in the Middle East. Even a country of their own. That will be true regardless of the government in Iran, including the Islamic Republic. This same government has excellent relations with many non-Moslem countries, including siding with them against "Moslems" in a host of conflicts in the region (e.g., the Armenia-Azerbaijan dispute, where Iran followed a neutral policy fostering close ties with the Armenians while seeking to bring Azerbaijan closer to Iran as well; most clearly in its relations with post Soviet central Asian states, especially Tajikistan's secular government, where Iran hails former communist leaders in that country as cultural brothers and friends; even to some extent as it relates to Russia and its conflict with the Chechens).

If Israel had the foresight to take the right steps, instead of going down the wrong road, it could guarantee itself a permanent home in the Middle East with Iran as a friend. But Israel has been pursuing the wrong policies and the wrong framework.

[sardus_pater]

That sardus_pater has now been accused of Zionism gives me hope for this board, if not the world.

well, given that I am not for the destruction of the "zionist entity" I would be viewed like a zionist by an antizionist zealote, actually they would be right I am partially zionist. That "partially" runs along the 67 border.

It's a common fate of all the fair unbiased wisemen to be the preferred target of the extremists of the counterposed factions.

Given that here the wildeyed zionists are a majority and a vocal one I am the target of their attacks. The few wildeyed antizionists see that I am good in replying to the wildeyed zionists and decided to keep a low profile allowing me to post wiothout objections.

I make no mistake to think that my POV would be largely welcomed, say, in Gaza or Ramallah.

half joking, half true. :p

[sardus_pater]

I'm honestly at a loss to craft a comprehensive reply to such an inoccuous, misguided post, but I shall try.

In my last post, I claimed (more or less) that scapegoatism is the leitmotif of Sardus Pater's manifestos, and that claim is even more true now. You see, I unmistakably believe that a recent fact-finder's report revealed that Sardus is not just uncouth, but proud of it. And because of that belief, I'm going to throw politeness and inoffensiveness to the winds. In this letter, I'm going to be as rude and crude as I know how, to reinforce the point that many people who follow Sardus's obloquies have come to the erroneous conclusion that all any child needs is a big dose of Israeli television every day. The stark truth of the matter is that we find among narrow and uneducated minds the belief that his Zionism is a final line of defense against tyrrany. This belief is due to a basic confusion, which can be cleared up simply by stating that the point at which you discover that Sardus's pea-brained witticisms may have serious repercussions, even beyond the issue of absenteeism, is not only a moment of disenchantment. It is a moment of resolve, a determination that all of the bad things that are currently going on are a symptom of his subhuman scribblings. They are not a cause; they are an effect. Sardus's dissertations are based on hate. Hate, unilateralism, and an intolerance of another viewpoint, another way of life.

Wait for a harsh reply when I get back home from work, you dirty arab lover!

[odessit19]

As long as Israel remains an outgrowth of Western policy and policies, as long as it is incapable of securing real roots in the region it has now resettled, and as long as it adopts a purely Western identity, it will also be viewed an alien entity. Broadly speaking, as a Western colonial outpost.

What is important is that Israel seek this dialogue without preconditions, and without trying to force any recognition of what is in fact a faulty foundation in the manner of its creation. You can rest assured that once Israel is no longer a threat to Iran, that no country on earth has as much interest in finding a viable, lasting, solution for the problem of finding Jews a home in the Middle East. Even a country of their own

Are you effing kidding me :eek: Real roots - there is no other country in the world that has more roots in that region than Israel.
Faulty creation - you mean like Persia, you stupid hack, it was legally recognized by all, except muslim zealots, such as yourself.
Maybe a country of their own - :mad: IT'S CALLED ISRAEL AND IT'S 58 YEARS OLD NOW! Whenever a thought enters my mind that you still might be a normal, decent human being, you put on your true face, you piece of human waste. As long as people like you are present, there will never be true peace in ME.

[Rostam]

Are you effing kidding me :eek: Real roots - there is no other country in the world that has more roots in that region than Israel.
Faulty creation - you mean like Persia, you stupid hack, it was legally recognized by all, except muslim zealots, such as yourself.
Maybe a country of their own - :mad: IT'S CALLED ISRAEL AND IT'S 58 YEARS OLD NOW! Whenever a thought enters my mind that you still might be a normal, decent human being, you put on your true face, you piece of human waste. As long as people like you are present, there will never be true peace in ME.

I can keep reading this post over and over and still find it funny. Thanx for the comedy. :)