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AGF Aarhus
03 May 2006, 05:41 AM
I went to the game last night (Hertha-Leverkusen), and here on some thoughts on the stadium ahead of the World Cup. I’ve tried to be as detailed as possible. Some of these points are minor or possibly insignificant, so attach whatever weight to whatever point you see fit.

Positives:
1. Transportation:
The S-Bahn station is right next to the stadium, and the number of platforms will allow for a very high capacity. Getting to and from the stadium by train will be as easy as is humanly possible.

2. Room outside the stadium:
Both before and after the ticket turnstiles, there is an enormous amount of room. At no point should you feel cramped for space.

3. Stadium Interior:
They have done a fantastic job with the renovation. It looks fantastic. On the outside you still get the feel of the historic stadium, but the interior is fully modern. Excellent work.

4. Rest Rooms:
Pristine, as they normally are in Germany.

5. Concessions:
Everything costs about half as much as it does in the US.

6. How Obstructed is ‘Obstructed View’:
As far as I can tell, not very. Unless I missed something, at worst you’ll have to crane your neck around a pole, but it isn’t that bad.

Negatives:
1. Transportation:
While the S-Bahn platforms offer high capacity, the two bridges connecting the platforms to the stadium could be bigger. This is not a huge issue, though. On the other hand, those arriving by U-Bahn will find things a lot more crowded. My advice is that even if it means travelling a bit farther when you’re downtown to get to the S-Bahn rather than the U-Bahn. Do it.

2. Game Day Ticket Sales:
Probably not an issue as there will be none for the World Cup, but I thought I would still mention it. After spending several hundred million euro on renovation, stringing four portable trailers together to act as a ticket office strikes me as a bit unprofessional.

3. Entrance Gates:
There is plenty of space before and after, but having only two entrances to the stadium (they could easily have added more) seems a bit, well, dumb. Furthermore, if I understand correctly, one of the two entrances will be exclusively used by VIP and press, meaning the rest of us all have to squeeze through one area.

4. Signage:
Things are generally not very well market. The signs indicating sections are too small and written in black on white background, this means that despite there being plenty of room to spread out around the stadium, to find your seat you have to crowd pretty close in. It is also not really clear which way to go to get to concessions or restrooms, and the writing on the signs for the VIP and press areas is miniscule (not that this is an issue for most of us.

5. Restrooms:
While pristine, as you leave there is a plate with a sign above it saying that while the toilets are free, the cleaning is not, and they suggest that you leave €0.30. I would personally find it much more professional to tack an extra €0.30 on the ticket price and use that to pay the cleaning personnel. Also, how often are you able to make €0.30 change in your pocket? And at peak times, do you really want people stopping right in front of the door to the restroom? Again, this seems rather unprofessional to me.

6. Concessions:
Not that I want a prawn sandwich, but the selection is awful, there are not enough of them, and they are done as individual windows rather than long counters.

7. Video Screens:
There are only two, and from where I was sitting I could not see either of them. I would add that I was not in the ‘cheap seats’, either.

8. Running Track:
There is one. Enough said.

What the local paper reported after the Cup Final this weekend (billed as the test for the World Cup):

1. Ticketing:
Simply put, the electronic ticketing system failed. The turnstiles did not read the tickets, and this led to chaos as people flooded the aforementioned four portable trailers that serve as the ticket office. The stadium authorities’ response is that this doesn’t matter for the World Cup because the Cup Final used bar codes while the World Cup will use RFID chips in the tickets. I take their point, but what concerns me is not so much that the technology failed, but that there was not contingency plan.

2. Public Urination:
The press made a big deal about the hordes of people pissing, well, everywhere. The fans response was that there aren’t enough toilets and a local politician responded that it was down to poor behaviour and negligent upbringing. If a reporter had asked me, I would have responded by asking if the reporter had ever been to a football match in Germany before. In the stadium there are plenty of toilets and no excuses, and frankly I do think a lot of it is people behaving, well, badly. Outside the stadium there are a couple of Honeybuckets, but let’s be honest here, I don’t care how many Honeybuckets you have, your average German football fan will never, ever use them. If you are used to American family friendly stadiums, you will be surprised to find a the booze fest and pissing free for all that happens right outside every stadium I’ve been to in the country. I have a feeling that the city will try to clamp down on this as it would hurt its reputation, but I’m not sure how possible that will be. The stadium is in the middle of nowhere, so people arrive early, have some drinks outside the stadium, take a piss in the trees and head into the game. Afterwards they do the same. With no bars nearby, it’s inevitable.

3. Rude Ushers:
Apparently some reporters had trouble finding the press box (see Signage above), and when they asked ushers they got responses like ‘I don’t know’, ‘I’m too busy right now’ and ‘um, uh, gee, why don’t you ask that guy over there’. I couldn’t be less surprised. I’ve found Germans, and Berliners in particular, in service positions to be about the least helpful people on the planet.

I would just add that despite having written more on the negative than on the positive side, it is a great stadium that is worthy of hosting a World Cup final. In no way did any of the negatives outweigh the positives in affecting my enjoyment of the game.

globalexplorer
03 May 2006, 08:28 AM
Thanks for this excellent preview - certainly has increased my eagerness to get the show started!

Every time I go back to Germany, I am amazed how unfriendly a lot of people employed in the service sector are. They just don't seem to understand that it is part of their job to help customers.

After running the NYC marathon last year nothing will shock me again as far as public urination is concerned :D

snike
03 May 2006, 01:06 PM
Thanks for the preview. It was good.

I got one question: How much does the track affect the atmosphere and the abilitiy to view the game?

Also, I wanted to comment on two of the things that you mentioned for those not familiar with Germany:

Bathroom: Having to pay or at least tip to go to the bathroom is not unique to the Berlin stadium. In many bathrooms across Germany this is customary. It's used to supplement the cleaning-persons salary. Sometimes you have to pay to use it, at other times it's just a recommended tip. In any case, it'd be useful to cary around some loose change.

Customer Service: You guys are right. Germans are still only vaguely familiar with the concept of customer service. Some employees will downright refuse to help, others will blame the bureaucracty at their workplace to try to get out of having to help you. It's a very sad thing. I hope that the World Cup will inspire people to be forthcoming, but I don't think it'll happen. A lot of employees get cranky just having to deal with german customers... now add to that the stress and language barriers introduced by dealing with millions of foreign visitors...

Yggdrasil
03 May 2006, 10:17 PM
Being from Berlin myself and a Hertha fan a few comments...

I went to the game last night (Hertha-Leverkusen), and here on some thoughts on the stadium ahead of the World Cup.
Yep, that was a pretty hefty drubbing we got by Leverkusen... I was there myself.

- As for the obstructed views: actually depending on the seat it can be annoying to have a pole in your view. Unfortunately they were forced to use these for static reasons because of the monument protection regulations (Denkmalschutz) they were not allowed to extend the roof over the historic Marathon gate. But it really depends where you sit. For Bundesliga games you can choose your seat yourself and I always avoid the o.v. seats. But for the WC I got one.

- As for the tickes sales / gates: you're right but again because of the regulations they were not allowed (yet) to erect new buildings in the historic Olympic area. You may have noticed that everything inside the area is in the historic buildings. So you cannot it compare to new build stadia like the ones in Munich or Gelsenkirchen where they could do everything from scratch. AFAIR there is a ongoing political debate.

- As for the restrooms: I only tip in the Olympic stadium restrooms when I have change since it was always free regardless what the signs says. So it is nice to tip the cleaning personnel but you don't have to do it there. They get paid anyway. (In Germany it is quite common to tip the cleaning personal but actually this tradition comes from the so-called "Pachttoilette" were the personal had rented the whole operation to make big money. :))

BTW, the only place on the planet where the men's restrooms have queues (at halftime) while the women's have not. :D

As for public pissing: quite common when large numbers of young men drink lots of beer before the games since it is much cheaper outside the stadium area. I doubt it will be the same "atmosphere" during the WC though since AFAIK FIFA does not allow anybody else to sell around the stadia.

As for the ushers: not all are rude. Actually there are even some nice girls among them.

As for Germans and Berliners being often unfriendly: I cannot agree about all German regions in general but as for Berlin this is unfortunatly true even by German standards. People from the Rhineland or Swabia who moved to Berlin often have a bit of a hard time until they get used to it. But I don't think it will be a big issue during the WC since there is a raising awareness since some months that something must be done about it. They have created special programs for the personal how to be very helpful to guests. :D There is even a large volunteer program whose sole task is to help the guests to find their way etc..

Yggdrasil
03 May 2006, 10:39 PM
Thanks for the preview. It was good.

I got one question: How much does the track affect the atmosphere and the abilitiy to view the game?
While not having one would be way better it is not as bad as in many other stadia which have one.

During the reconstruction they have lowered the playing field by about 3 meters which improves the view much even for the seats in the lower rows. And also most of the cheaper seats higher above you have a good view on the action. The hard core Hertha fans themselves use only the cheapest seats behind the goal on the eastern side (die Ostkurve :D).

snike
03 May 2006, 11:47 PM
While not having one would be way better it is not as bad as in many other stadia which have one.



have you been to the Stuttgart stadium? Is this one of the stadiums that are more affected by the track?

globalexplorer
03 May 2006, 11:51 PM
Guess what: I just witnessed GREAT customer service!

I placed an order for 3 Weltmeister Passes on the Deutsche Bahn website an hour ago and a few minutes ago got a call from one of their employees asking me for the names of the two additional passes (website only asked for my name). I asked how come they were open already (it was about 530am in Germany) and he said he is part of the nightshift. I am still in shock - maybe there is hope after all....

AGF Aarhus
04 May 2006, 04:12 AM
Thank you for your additions Yggdrasil, it is good to get some of the reasons for why things are the way they are (the ticket office and poles holding the roof, for example).

As for the track, I've seen much, much worse. As Yggdrasil says, it'd be better without it, but after seeing the Italy-Germany game and the joke of a stadium they have in Florence, I can't really raise too much of a stink.

@globalexplorer: I'm glad you found some good service. Sometimes they surprise you. I think Berlin is especially bad (they call it 'Berliner Schnäuze'). I've had mixed results personally with DB, but some are very helpful and competant.

Yggdrasil
04 May 2006, 08:22 AM
have you been to the Stuttgart stadium? Is this one of the stadiums that are more affected by the track?
I don't know if VfB fans would agree but I guess I would say so. I have been to the Stuttgart stadium before the second conversion which I think they started around 1998. AFAIK they changed the main stands but not the curvas behind the goals and I remember that these had a much worser view than in Berlin.

BarcaFan333
04 May 2006, 01:07 PM
hi, quick question

is sitting at the corners of the stadium that bad??the upper and lower decks., (aligned to the corner kick location)

i was wondering because when i was watching the virtual tour, it seemed like you would only be able to see small dots representing players

thanks

AGF Aarhus
05 May 2006, 04:26 AM
hi, quick question

is sitting at the corners of the stadium that bad??the upper and lower decks., (aligned to the corner kick location)

i was wondering because when i was watching the virtual tour, it seemed like you would only be able to see small dots representing players

thanks
It depends entirely on the stadium, but if there is a track it is worse. The corners in Berlin aren't that bad, but if you're down low it may be a bit of a problem.

Interesting thing about tickets:

I got mine yesterday for two games in Berlin (one of which I've sold back, but that's another story). My Cat. I OV tickets seem to be in almost exactly the same spot as my Cat. III OV tickets, only on the other side of the stadium (the stadium is symetrical, so this is inconsequential). They are both down low and getting close to the corner, but the Cat. I is in Row 1 while the Cat. III is in row 6. By my reasoning, this means that the €27 Cat. III tickets are actually a little better than the €60 Cat. I tickets. The Cat. III tickets are also on the side of the stadium that looksa cross at the video sceen, while the Cat. I tickets are not. Again, the Cat. III tickets seem better.

captdf
08 May 2006, 03:12 PM
I got mine yesterday for two games in Berlin (one of which I've sold back, but that's another story). My Cat. I OV tickets seem to be in almost exactly the same spot as my Cat. III OV tickets, only on the other side of the stadium (the stadium is symetrical, so this is inconsequential). They are both down low and getting close to the corner, but the Cat. I is in Row 1 while the Cat. III is in row 6. By my reasoning, this means that the €27 Cat. III tickets are actually a little better than the €60 Cat. I tickets. The Cat. III tickets are also on the side of the stadium that looksa cross at the video sceen, while the Cat. I tickets are not. Again, the Cat. III tickets seem better.

You may be right. I've got Cat. I tickets that are in the corner and Row 6 (i think - would have to double check at home). I don't really mind (just happy to be going to a match), but I would have preferred to be a few rows higher and/or closer to mid-field.

italcan
08 May 2006, 03:40 PM
hi, quick question

is sitting at the corners of the stadium that bad??the upper and lower decks., (aligned to the corner kick location)

i was wondering because when i was watching the virtual tour, it seemed like you would only be able to see small dots representing players

thanks
what and where is the virtual tour??

meininki
08 May 2006, 03:58 PM
what and where is the virtual tour??

http://www.t-online.de/wm-fankurve/fankurve3dstadien/Flash-Stadien.html

MeLikeChili
20 May 2006, 04:57 PM
Hi to all Berlin visitors,

I found a much better site for the Olympic stadium. Please enjoy!

http://www.olympiastadion-berlin.de/fileadmin/Begehung_Olympiastadion/start.htm

benztown
20 May 2006, 10:29 PM
have you been to the Stuttgart stadium? Is this one of the stadiums that are more affected by the track?

I've been in several German Stadiums and I don't think that any track is big of a problem in terms of visability (maybe in the first couple of rows, but above that there is hardly any difference). And from what I can say, Stuttgart and Berlin are quite similar in that respect (I've only been once to the renovated Berlin stadium though).
The biggest issue with tracks is more that the acoustics are quite bad compared to soccer specific stadiums. You need a lot more people to attend a game in order to achieve a unique atmosphere. But since all the WC games are sold out that shouldn't be much of a problem either.

Schalkoholic
21 May 2006, 03:29 AM
Sold out doesnt mean the stadium is full .
Only 30% of the world cup tickets are sold to the public mean Fans.

Some of the so called sponsor and ticket agencies have problems to sell
their VIP Tickets.

Lets see if stadiums are full.
They should have given at least 75% to the public.

Yggdrasil
21 May 2006, 09:03 AM
Sold out doesnt mean the stadium is full .
Only 30% of the world cup tickets are sold to the public mean Fans.

Some of the so called sponsor and ticket agencies have problems to sell
their VIP Tickets.

Lets see if stadiums are full.
They should have given at least 75% to the public.
The sponsors have just given back over 40000 tickets. They are sold in the ticket shop right now. Including Germany-Poland! Just in case you haven't seen it. But while I write they are probably sold...

Fortunately I have already Germany-Poland and Ecuador-Germany. :)