Tactics

[USA4Life]

Against a 4-4-2 with a zonal 4 man back line.

McBride stays forward up between the two centerbacks
Donovan and Beasley take turns pressuring the outside back while the other stays central

x-------------x---------x-------------x
-----------------McBride
---------Beasley--------Donovan

x----------x-----------x-----------x
------Convey----Mastroeni---Reyna

------------x----------x
Lewis-----Gibbs-------Onyewu-----Cherundolo

The US owns the middle of the field with Beasley, Donovan, and the 3 midfielders swarming the ball. The key will be fitness and Dempsey will have to come on for Reyna at some point. Everyone else should be fit enough to keep up the pressure.

In the back Gibbs and Onyewu man mark the forwards
Lewis and Cherundolo get forward on offense, and cover the outsides on defense.

against a 3-5-2

-------x-----------x-----------x
---------McBride-------Wolff
-------------------x
-----------------Donovan
x----------x--------------x-----------x
---------JOB------------Reyna
---------------Mastroeni
Lewis-------x-------------x--------Cherundolo
-----------Gibbs----------Onyewu


Again the US owns the middle of the field with Mastroeni being the extra player in the middle. Donovan has the freedom to get forward while Mastroeni covers. JOB and Reyna will not be able to play 90 minutes so Convey, Dempsey, and/or Olsen will have to sub in.

[DiscoWarrior11]

I like that 4-4-2... but I'd be surprised to see Beasley neither start nor come in off the bench...

Has Arena ever used a 4-3-3 in a meaningful game? Not that I don't expect him to throw out some surprises considering the underperformance of this round's forwards... personally, I'd love to see Donovan and Beasley as twin withdrawn forwards/wingers... but our midfield would definitely lose some speed. I guess that wouldn't be too much of a problem considering the pace of our outside backs.

Good thinking though.

[Poachin_Goalz]

The USA has the peripheral players to play a 4-3-3 but we a lacking the crucial player to play this formation and not get totally destroyed. The central player in the midfield 3 has to be an absolute stud; a crunching tackler, good in the air, gas tank to play box to box for 90 minutes, durable and a very high quality distributer of the ball. We have players that have some of these qualities but not all. Reyna and JOB are to brittle and not solid enough on defense. Mastro's destribution isn't of a high enough quality to play as a loan central mid at World Cup level IMO. Donovan's air game and defense isn't developed enough to handle it. If we play a 4-3-3 on paper, we are basically saying that we will be playing a 4-5-1 because we will have to adjust to our central mid difficiences. This would result in McBride alone up top. There are very few players that I would even consider playing at center mid in a 4-3-3 at WC level. Vieira, Gerrard, maybe Lampard, Davids may be getting too old now, Zidane is my favorite player but his defensive ability isn't up to scratch for this job/formation. Of the formation's that utilize 3 forwards, I much prefer a 3-4-3 but we don't have the type and quality of players on our back line to play this formation either. IMO our options are a 4-4-2 or a 3-5-2 with two d-mids.

[schmuckatelli]

Has Arena ever used a 4-3-3 in a meaningful game? Not that I don't expect him to throw out some surprises ....
No, but he hadn't really used the 3-5-2 before employing it to beat Mexico in WC2002, either. It's really not out of the realm of possibility (or even likelihood). If nothing else, Arena is a student of the game, and seeing how clubs like PSV and Chelsea employ a 4-3-3 might give the man ideas. We'll see.

[eissman]

IN your first scenario you are saying the following would take place defensively with our shape:

------------X---------X-------------
-------------McBride----------------
X--------------------------------
Beasley--------Donovan----------X
-------------------------------------
-----------X-----------X-------------
-------Convey---------Reyna--------
---------------Mastroeni------------
X-----------------------------------X
Lewis----------------X------Cherundolo
---------Gibbs---X----Onyewu--------

Thinking off the top of my head, the "X" represent how I would personally try to attack this US formation (I am being Devils advocate here -- btw, X has the ball, X is the player free):
Stretch the flanks as deep and as wide as possible with my RM/LM almost to the backline, plant a target on the offside line, the other forward showing underneath as the real target behind the midfield but in front of the backline. The ball would need to switch the point of attack very quickly to the weakside back who becomes and attacking flank player. This would force Reyna in the above scenario to step into the flank if Donovan has not tracked back, therefore exposing the center into a 1v1 matchup and making Mastreoni step into a 1v1 role, therefore allowing space for the showing forward to check into and hopefully face up the defense. The wide players are now 1v1 with the outside backs, the two CB's have to make a decision on the lone target and all the midfielders must engage into a falling back scheme, thus making the two forwards playing underneath McBride spend energy getting back to defend on top of there responsibilities of spending a load of energy pursuing the ball and countering.

Hope that all made sense. Do we have the personel to effectively do all this? Better question -- do we have the back-up personel to do all this?

[Dr.Phil]

In the 4-3-3

the midfield shift like a windshield wiper

there will be a man open which will be at the far end of the field so the opposing team will have to switch the ball to find him. This gives time for the midfeild and to shift back over

the defence plays a normal 4 man backline

the fowards will be making runs that will replace the RM and LM

But I dont think Arena has used this formation so I dont think he will use it

[eissman]

In the 4-3-3

the midfield shift like a windshield wiper

there will be a man open which will be at the far end of the field so the opposing team will have to switch the ball to find him. This gives time for the midfeild and to shift back over

the defence plays a normal 4 man backline

the fowards will be making runs that will replace the RM and LM

But I dont think Arena has used this formation so I dont think he will use it

Correct. I don't believe this is something Arena has in mind. Not that it isn't feasible, but you really really need to have all the personel in order to do this. This means people who can come in off the bench in these positions as well.

The central players must be just that, specifically central players. Whereas we have guys like (injury report aside) Reyna, O'Brien, Mastreoni, Donovan to play there potentially, do we really have their "equals" on the bench ready to play in their stead? I don't think so.

Bruce will likely stay with his modification of a 4-4-2, whether box midfield or not, because most formations can adapt and adjust (or "morph" as I like to say) out of that basic formation.

Plus the 4-3-3 leaves a team too exposed from the midfield back if the (a) forwards are not pressuring enough up top or dropping enough when low pressure is required, and (b) the midfield does not keep its shape. Of course, when we haven't even talked about when the "wheels fall off" and it all breaks down tactically (ie. players not understand or performing roles as expected).

[gbalzac]

<b>The USA has the peripheral players to play a 4-3-3 but we a lacking the crucial player to play this formation and not get totally destroyed. <u>The central player in the midfield 3 has to be an absolute stud; a crunching tackler, good in the air, gas tank to play box to box for 90 minutes, durable and a very high quality distributer of the ball. </b></u> Vieira, Gerrard, maybe Lampard, Davids may be getting too old now, Zidane is my favorite player but his defensive ability isn't up to scratch for this job/formation.

Disagree with this statement completely...Two examples are two of the best teams around Barca & Chelsea. Both play a 4-3-3 with the wide players playing withdrawn off the target forward.

Chelsea fields Makalele in this spot. He is not a box to box player nor supreme distributor of the ball. He plays a smart defensive game and when he wins the ball he plays it to Lampard and Essien who flank him and are the more attacking element in midfield in this formation. They are the true box to box midfielders but generally only one pushes up at a time. Reyna seems suited to a similar role as Essien (ie the more holding of the two mids). Not sure who can play like Lampard but Convey/Dempsey are certainly more attacking players.

I have seen Barca use Marquez and even Thiago Motta in this position neither is an attacking stud. Both more defensive minded just like Mastro.

Quite frankly I don't see how this isn't our best formation. Donovan/Beasley seem suited to play in these positions. McBride is a good target forward. Reyna can stay at home in the middle and Mastro is a pure destroyer ala Makalele. We have the wingbacks to utilize the width as well.

[gbalzac]

Plus the 4-3-3 leaves a team too exposed from the midfield back if the (a) forwards are not pressuring enough up top or dropping enough when low pressure is required, and (b) the midfield does not keep its shape. Of course, when we haven't even talked about when the "wheels fall off" and it all breaks down tactically (ie. players not understand or performing roles as expected).

"Wheels falling off" can happen in any formation. I think the key to this are Donovan and Beasley controlling the wide positions and tracking up and down the flanks...Beasley plays this formation at PSV and I think Donovan can handle it.

The back line plays the same as they would in a 4-4-2.

Mastro plays the same...his job is to destroy-win possession-find an open player and let them deal with initiating the attack.

Reyna/Convey/JOB/Dempsey as the box to box mids play the same as they would centrally in a standard 4 man flat midfield...the caveat is neither is ultimately responsible defensively if the other pushes up...they have Mastro to cover them.

please do let me know the faults in this. I see the key players as Lando and Beas and Beas knows the formation and I don't see how Lando couldn't handle it...he's basically an attacking mid in this setup except he has semi-defensive responsibilities.

[gbalzac]

actually thinking on it further...the weakness defensively is either the hole behind our target forward or wide on one flank depending on where the high players cover. Could see a problem if we played this against italy and allowed Pirlo time to pull the strings from deep in his midfield. Other than that I think its our best formation.

[Bob Morocco]

actually thinking on it further...the weakness defensively is either the hole behind our target forward or wide on one flank depending on where the high players cover. Could see a problem if we played this against italy and allowed Pirlo time to pull the strings from deep in his midfield. Other than that I think its our best formation.

Guss Hiddink dealt with these concerns by man-marking Pirlo with DMB and pushing up his leftback, Lammey, and his LCM, Cocu, to fill the hole left by DMB moving inside. With the US it would look like this on defense:


---------Keller---------
--Dolo--Gooch--Gibbs--
--------Mastro--------
---Reyna------Lewis---
--LD-----DMB-----BC--
-------McBride--------

[XYZ123456]

No, but he hadn't really used the 3-5-2 before employing it to beat Mexico in WC2002, either. It's really not out of the realm of possibility (or even likelihood).This isn't true.

Arena used the 3-5-2 a lot in 1999 and 2000 even using it some in qualifying. I think he's only played the 4-3-3 twice.

That 4-3-3 is going to turn into a 4-5-1 especially on the left side with Beasley having to cover back for Convey. I don't want to see McBride stranded alone up top.

[sidefootsitter]

Guss Hiddink dealt with these concerns by man-marking Pirlo with DMB and pushing up his leftback, Lammey, and his LCM, Cocu, to fill the hole left by DMB moving inside. With the US it would look like this on defense:


---------Keller---------
--Dolo--Gooch--Gibbs--
--------Mastro--------
---Reyna------Lewis---
--LD-----DMB-----BC--
-------McBride-------- Arena did try Donovan on the right and Beez in the middle vs. Mexico. It was a disaster.

BTW, with regard to Chelsea and most 4-3-3 teams. They play the "pointy triangle", with the playmaker on top and two midfielders on the bottom, one of which is a destroyer, another is a 2-way mid.

----------Lampard----------

--Makelele----------Essien--

The key to this working defensively is the fact that both "bottom mids" are exceptional defenders and Lampard does a lot of backtracking as well.

Arena would have to play Mastroeni at "Makelele" along with either O'Brien or Reyna. I am pretty sure that, barring injuries, he wants to have both JOB and CR on the pitch at once. Without Mastro, it's a Box. With Mastro, it's a Christmas Tree.

I also think that a true 4-3-3 is not a promising lineup offensively because the US doesn't have an in-form DMB type on the right.

PPS. Bob, Hiddink did try to prevent Pirlo from controlling the flow but Seedorf and Kaka saw a lot of touches and Milan had a lot of chances and half-chances at Eindhoven.

[poobah_1]

Agreed SFS

Their are differences in the 'dutch' 4-3-3 and the 'chelsea/barca' 4-3-3. Chelsea plays the triangle and barca plays the tree.

We don't really have the forwards or mids for the dutch and don't have the mids for the chelsea. We can play the tree.

I would prefer us to play something like this against Italy:

4-4-1-1 'Counter'

---------Keller------------
Dolo - Gooch - Gibbs - Lewis
Reyna - Mastro - Job - DMB
--------Donovan---------
----------BMB-----------

Mastro and JOB play two way with mastro taking the more defensive role and Job playing more up. Reyna and DMB are really used to contain the wings and assist on defense as both are decent defenders in the midfield.

The key is Donovan runs the show; and the overall strategy plays to our team speed on the wings with dolo and lewis, while landon having the one thing he needs more than anything else...space.


For the czechs...harder tactically....easier for other reasons:

3-4-3

----Keller----
Dolo--Gooch--Gibbs
Dempsey - Job - Reyna - Convey
Donovan - Johnson - DMB

Nedved is the key to the czechs, but a 1v1 d-mid is not my solution (mastro). Instead, I would like to see if we could really take it too the czechs from the start, get a quick goal, and sub at the half to a 4-5-1 and hold on.

Not the pretty game plan, but, I really think the czechs have the greatest chance to underestimate us. Playing three forward in the 3-4-3 will be a surprise, and force the czech coach to react. Getting inside the Czechs head is the best chance for 3 points. We won't outsmart Lippi. The Czech coach.......

Ghana

4-4-2 Box.

SFS has the best line up I have seen for the box. I know he likes the skinny diamond as well, Ghana may be the time to pull that out as well.

Just my two pesos...

PooBah