Political Argument Arena!!!

[tigerdave]

Political expediency ftw.

[Dirt McGirt]

Clinton Administration was the Golden age and that Bush ********ed everything up is just a straight lie. Such is the story you often tell...


Don't fear the truth. George Bush's legacy (http://www.dems.gov/index.asp?Type=B_PR&SEC=%7BD68CD0B2-1442-4804-9F6B-AF67DE7FF585%7D&DE=%7BFDD09C4F-E958-4E13-A92B-179C2FAC6FEA%7D&Design=PrintView)

In conclusion ToonUSA. (http://toonusa.justgotowned.com/) Let's just say this seems to be the consistent pattern in our discussions.

[ToonUSA]

In conclusion ToonUSA. (http://toonusa.justgotowned.com/) Let's just say this seems to be the consistent pattern in our discussions.

O ******** off with that garbage Jay.

You think a link to a Democratic Party study of the President proves something? Would a Republican one proving opposite be accepted by you? Doubtful. Must be nice living in your world.

[Dirt McGirt]

O ******** off with that garbage Jay.

You think a link to a Democratic Party study of the President proves something? Would a Republican one proving opposite be accepted by you? Doubtful. Must be nice living in your world.Post one. I'm ready. To make it interesting try and find with statistics foot noted from the Federal/independent sources.

Honestly I would take you more seriously if you could just admit Bush was a ************ president and/or if you joined the Marine Corp.

[ToonUSA]

Post one. I'm ready. To make it interesting try and find with statistics foot noted from the Federal/independent sources.

Honestly I would take you more seriously if you could just admit Bush was a ************ president and/or if you joined the Marine Corp.

What's the point? You've already have your opinion set that you won't take me seriously unless I admit he's been a bad President. I won't, so we clearly have nothing to discuss without making it anymore personal than it needs to be.

[Dirt McGirt]

What's the point? You've already have your opinion set that you won't take me seriously unless I admit he's been a bad President. I won't, so we clearly have nothing to discuss without making it anymore personal than it needs to be.It's not personal it's business and business is good very good.

Speaking of which how stoked are you for Sen.Obama turn his rather powerful grassroots organization and significant financial backing loose on the esteemed but slightly loopy Sen.McCain tonight? It's on like Donkey Kong tonight.

[Russell1892]

Former White House Press Secretary Scott McClellan whacks Bush, White House in a surprisingly scathing memoir (http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0508/10649.html)

http://images.politico.com/global/080527_mcclellan.jpg
Snitch



Well it's nice to hear someone admit what the majority of us knew/thought to be true. I would anticipate I lot more of these stories once Bush slinks off into the sunset. I only wish one of these Republican "Patriots" had the courage to do it when it matters.

I actually just saw this guy interviewed on the Daily Show with Jon Stewart tonight. He actually defends the Bush administration personally and tends to adopt the position of "blame the game not the player". He does have a point, but if anyone thinks that the US government (hell the British government too) didn't use propaganda in selling the war they're delusional or uninformed. It was definitely a case of "worst case scenario" threat and "best case scenario" war in their plans.

From an international point of view, what Bush will be remembered for in the global scheme of things is Iraq and somehow managing to turn unprecedented support for America (immediately post 9/11) into widespread disdain bordering on hatred. His foreign policy has been a disaster.

[tigerdave]

I think this is all pretty much going to be decided by the VP selections, as superficial and naive as that might sound. If McCain picks a conservative running mate, he's got a good chance to pick up the bulk of that conservative bloc and make sure they come out and vote to stop Obama. If he doesn't, he might be in a bit of trouble. Likewise, if Obama tabs Clinton and they can get past their divisions, he has a really good chance of winning. If not, I think he may lose pretty badly because of his inability to win large chunks of the "Reagan Democrat" vote that generally decides the election. A lot of it will depend on how many Hillary supporters make good on their threat to stay home or vote for McCain, particularly if he doesn't choose Hillary as his veep.

Basically, if McCain picks a conservative and Obama doesn't pick Hillary, McCain will probably win 35-40 states. If anything else happens, it's pretty interesting.

[BayernWake]

Good points TD.

When do they pick their running mates, anyway?

[colinh9]

I think this is all pretty much going to be decided by the VP selections, as superficial and naive as that might sound. If McCain picks a conservative running mate, he's got a good chance to pick up the bulk of that conservative bloc and make sure they come out and vote to stop Obama. If he doesn't, he might be in a bit of trouble. Likewise, if Obama tabs Clinton and they can get past their divisions, he has a really good chance of winning. If not, I think he may lose pretty badly because of his inability to win large chunks of the "Reagan Democrat" vote that generally decides the election. A lot of it will depend on how many Hillary supporters make good on their threat to stay home or vote for McCain, particularly if he doesn't choose Hillary as his veep.

Basically, if McCain picks a conservative and Obama doesn't pick Hillary, McCain will probably win 35-40 states. If anything else happens, it's pretty interesting.

I think he's actually better off without Hillary. Dick Morris from the Hill had a good piece today on this subject.

http://www.realclearpolitics.com/articles/2008/06/no_menageatrois_for_obama.html

Right now she is using this as leverage for her positions, and I think that's why she immediately wants to sit down with Obama as it was reported last night. She wants to find out what he is willing to give her, and then she will come out and fully support him. I'm just worried she will want VP. The more I consider it, the less likely I think Obama will actually give in, but I'm scared about what lengths Hillary will go to. She hasn't ever surprised me in a good way, that's for sure.

Anyways, here are Obama's most recent comments on Iran.

"Contrary to the claims to some, I have no interest in sitting down with our adversaries just for the sake of talking. But as president of the United States, I would be willing to lead tough and principled diplomacy with the appropriate Iranian leaders at a time and place of my choosing if and only if it can advance the interest of the United States. That is my position. I want to be absolutely clear."

[BayernWake]

The only good thing about Obama possibly picking Clinton is that it would decrease his chances of getting assassinated.

Sorry, that's just how my brain works.

[Dirt McGirt]

Republicans are dreaming that Barack picks Clinton.

[BayernWake]

Conservative talk radio would have a field day.

[Dirt McGirt]

Republicans are in trouble and our grasping at straws big time right now. McSame(voted 95% of the time with the administration) is so out of touch with America and people don't want four more years of Neo Con garbage and out of control spending . Not only are Republicans threatened with losing traditional GOP states in the Pres election (Colorado, Nevada, Virginia) but also are expected to lose significant ground in the House and Senate.

[colinh9]

The only good thing about Obama possibly picking Clinton is that it would decrease his chances of getting assassinated.

Sorry, that's just how my brain works.

That makes no sense whatsoever, but ok.

Here goes another McCain talking point.

Hamas blasts Obama

Obama's AIPAC speech seems to have succeeded on one front: It convinced Hamas that he's no better than John McCain.

“Obama’s comments have confirmed that there will be no change in the U.S. administration’s foreign policy on the Arab-Israeli conflict,” Hamas official Sami Abu Zuhri told Reuters in Gaza.

“The Democratic and Republican parties support totally the Israeli occupation at the expense of the interests and rights of Arabs and Palestinians,” he said.

“Hamas does not differentiate between the two presidential candidates, Obama and Mccain, because their policies regarding the Arab-Israel conflict are the same and are hostile to us, therefore we do have no preference and are not wishing for either of them to win,” Zuhri said.

[ToonUSA]

Feel free to link the article.

[BayernWake]

That makes no sense whatsoever, but ok.

Exaggerate much? It does makes a bit of sense.

[JaredSS07]

Republicans are in trouble and our grasping at straws big time right now. McSame(voted 95% of the time with the administration) is so out of touch with America and people don't want four more years of Neo Con garbage and out of control spending . Not only are Republicans threatened with losing traditional GOP states in the Pres election (Colorado, Nevada, Virginia) but also are expected to lose significant ground in the House and Senate.
We will get our asses handed to us in Congress, but you are wrong that McCain is in trouble. Typically, McCain is within the margin of error and that is pretty bad considering Obama's "powerful grassroots organization and significant financial backing." Real Clear Politics Polling Data (http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/2008/president/us/general_election_mccain_vs_obama-225.html#polls)
Republicans are dreaming that Barack picks Clinton.
Not really. Most Republicans I have talked to hope that Obama picks someone just as liberal as him so it is easier differentiate him from McCain. Plus this Gallop (http://www.gallup.com/poll/105691/McCain-vs-Obama-28-Clinton-Backers-McCain.aspx)poll makes me want Hillary gone and her supporters up for grabs.

[JaredSS07]

I think this is all pretty much going to be decided by the VP selections, as superficial and naive as that might sound. If McCain picks a conservative running mate, he's got a good chance to pick up the bulk of that conservative bloc and make sure they come out and vote to stop Obama. If he doesn't, he might be in a bit of trouble. Likewise, if Obama tabs Clinton and they can get past their divisions, he has a really good chance of winning. If not, I think he may lose pretty badly because of his inability to win large chunks of the "Reagan Democrat" vote that generally decides the election. A lot of it will depend on how many Hillary supporters make good on their threat to stay home or vote for McCain, particularly if he doesn't choose Hillary as his veep.

Basically, if McCain picks a conservative and Obama doesn't pick Hillary, McCain will probably win 35-40 states. If anything else happens, it's pretty interesting.

As for conservatives and their turnout, you can't view this election with the same mentality of the past two. There was almost no one who worked for McCain in 2000 on the BC04 staff. McCain people are now back in the game and holding a grudge. BC04 staff, vendors, and RNC people that have supported Bush since 2000 are seeing themselves pushed out. Because of this the campaign plan will be radically different. I think wedge issues and right-wing votes won't be the focus anymore and the McCain camp is hoping they are trained enough, or anti-Obama enough, to default to McCai while he focuses on the middle.

[Dirt McGirt]

We will get our asses handed to us in Congress, but you are wrong that McCain is in trouble. Typically, McCain is within the margin of error and that is pretty bad considering Obama's "powerful grassroots organization and significant financial backing." Real Clear Politics Polling Data (http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/2008/president/us/general_election_mccain_vs_obama-225.html#polls)

Not really. Most Republicans I have talked to hope that Obama picks someone just as liberal as him so it is easier differentiate him from McCain. Plus this Gallop (http://www.gallup.com/poll/105691/McCain-vs-Obama-28-Clinton-Backers-McCain.aspx)poll makes me want Hillary gone and her supporters up for grabs.
I always like to hear your political opinions since you actually do this for a living. (Which is pretty cool). Honestly how do you see this thing playing out in November? Do you consider yourself more of a fiscal conservative or a social conservative? Growing up on the East Coast I met a few fiscal cons that didn't give to shits about the social agenda on either side it was all about what worked for GDP growth and the Street.