Mexico v. Argentina [R]

[robviii]

Hey Apologists!

Kevin Stott worked his magic again.

I just finished watching Mexico v. Argentina as well as the blown call he made, letting the Argentinian captain tackle the Mexican forward in the box without even a glance.

It's disappointing. You all jumped on my case because I wasn't a referee, insinuating that I needed a badge before I could critique anyone.

Enough. I started off by critiquing Stott, and I don't regret a word I wrote. The guy's a horrible referee and he should find another way to pass his time.

If American ref's are on the rise, they still haven't hit sea level.

[Alberto]

Originally posted by robviii
Hey Apologists!

Kevin Stott worked his magic again.

I just finished watching Mexico v. Argentina as well as the blown call he made, letting the Argentinian captain tackle the Mexican forward in the box without even a glance.

It's disappointing. You all jumped on my case because I wasn't a referee, insinuating that I needed a badge before I could critique anyone.

Enough. I started off by critiquing Stott, and I don't regret a word I wrote. The guy's a horrible referee and he should find another way to pass his time.

If American ref's are on the rise, they still haven't hit sea level.

Kevin screwed the pooch. It's too bad too. Up until the last 5 minutes of the match he did a great job. Let them play and also issued cautions on the tactical and cynical fouls.

I agree the missed penalty was incredibly poor call. It was a foul when I first saw it. It was still a foul in the other two replays.

Ricardo Valenzuela should have alerted Stott to send La Volpe to the showers for running onto the field to protest the non-call.

Chip Read? or whomever the Senior AR was (Asian-American) missed an obvious send off on Cardona? The mexican clearly struck the Argentinian #15 in the face.

[RushOnze]

Originally posted by Alberto

Chip Read? or whomever the Senior AR was (Asian-American) missed an obvious send off on Cardona? The mexican clearly struck the Argentinian #15 in the face.

would have been Roger Itaya

[robviii]

Mexican Press:

-El Heraldo:
"El árbitro estadunidense Kevin Scot tuvo pésima actuación"

-La Cronica:
"Árbitro: Kevin Scott, de Estados Unidos, falló al no marcar una pena máxima cometida a Fernando Arce en el segundo tiempo."

-El Universal:
"Incluso, a cuatro minutos del final, Burdisso atropelló descaradamente a Arce dentro del área. El penalty sólo se lo perdió el árbitro Kevin Stott."

-La Jornada:
"Errores en la defensa y un mal arbitraje hundieron al Tri El silbante no marcó claro penal."

"Además, el arbitraje del estadunidense Kevin Scott terminó de apuñalar a los tricolores, al dejar de marcar un claro penal al minuto 86, cuando Battaglia dio un caballazo en la espalda a Fernando Arce."

-La Prensa:
"A tres minutos del final, el árbitro no marcó un empujón del defensa argentino Nicolás Burdisso sobre la espalda de Arce, dentro del área."

-La Reforma:
"El delantero del Veracruz recibió una clara falta del capitán argentino Nicolás Burdisso, pero el silbante Kevin Scott redondeó su mala actuación al no marcar el penal."

Argentinian Press

-Ole:
"Pocas luces, demasiado sufrimiento y penal de Burdisso a Olalde que el pito yanqui se tragó por mediocre fueron las últimas imágenes de un triunfo argentino medio tristongo, que además no agregará nada más que un detalle estadístico."

[Alberto]

In summary, all the press reports listed above state Stott missed a clear penalty. No issue there.

[Alberto]

Originally posted by RushOnze
would have been Roger Itaya

Thanks.

Yes, Chip is the older guy with the silver hair who is noted for assisting on the field on free kicks and the like.

[robviii]

Originally posted by Alberto
In summary, all the press reports listed above state Stott missed a clear penalty. No issue there.

"pesima"

"mal arbitraje"

"mala actuacion"

"mediocre"

and they're not talking about the penalty

[wjarrettc]

Did anybody catch the Mexico v. Argentina game last night on Telemundo. Kevin Stott had a tough atmosphere and very physical game to control. I think I counted six yellow cards in a "friendly". There were two non-calls near the end of the game that perplexed me and I was curious what you guys thought of them.

1) On about 85 minutes, Mexico had a deep throw-in near the Argentine goal. The throw went to a Mexican player who had taken up a position in the penalty area and was prepared to shield the ball from defenders behind him. Just as the ball arrived, he was flattened by contact with an Argentine defender. Stott made no call. My guess is that he ruled this a legal shoulder charge but to me it seemed excessive, and from behind. The shoulder charge is one of the grey areas for me and I'd be interested to hear what others have to say about this specific non-call.

2) A few minutes later, with time expiring, Argentina had taken the ball deep into the Mexican corner to stall, as part of a tussle to win the ball from the player who was shielding him, the Mexican player swung his arm around, with the fist closed, and struck the Argentine player in the face. The AR was right on top of the play and immediately flagged for a foul, but I was really surprised that there was no booking. I figured this for a direct red. I perceived this to be VC, mainly because of the closed fist. Anyone else see this and care to comment.


Jarrett

[IASocFan]

Jarrett, I added the earlier posts to yours. They were buried in "American Refs on the Rise" thread.
You were correct. They need their own thread. :)

[billf]

I wish I would have remembered that game was on, so I could watch. Sounds like there were a few problems, so I hope I can see the highlights at some point.

On the shoulder charge issue. The USSF put out instructions for referees at regional and national tournaments that stated a shoulder charge from behind can be legal if contact is not made with the spine (paraphrased). I've been told that shoulder to shoulder blade CAN be okay in certain circumstances.

This doesn't seem to describe the incident in the Mexico game though.

[Alberto]

Originally posted by billf
I wish I would have remembered that game was on, so I could watch. Sounds like there were a few problems, so I hope I can see the highlights at some point.

On the shoulder charge issue. The USSF put out instructions for referees at regional and national tournaments that stated a shoulder charge from behind can be legal if contact is not made with the spine (paraphrased). I've been told that shoulder to shoulder blade CAN be okay in certain circumstances.

This doesn't seem to describe the incident in the Mexico game though.

Not when the player was standing still and got laid out on the ground. In American football it would have been a clipping call. Clear! Clear! Blown penalty call. Stott was not far away either he was on the same side of the field 12-16 yards away.

[Greyhnd00]

Request that when you post long spanish text that you include an english translation for those of us still struggling with a single language.

[nsa]

I've been told that shoulder to shoulder blade CAN be okay in certain circumstances.This may be permitted in the case of Player A shielding a ball that is nearing the touchline or goal line. Player B may charge Player A in the back (area of the shoulder blade) in a non-agressive manner. Remembering that this is all ITOOTR.

I didn't see the match last might, however the descriptions that I've seen do not sound like a "non-agressive" act along a field boundary.

[nsa]

Originally posted by Greyhnd00
Request that when you post long spanish text that you include an english translation for those of us still struggling with a single language. http://babelfish.altavista.com/translate.dyn

- The Heraldo: "the American referee Kevin Scot had terrible performance"

- The Cronica: "Referee: Kevin Scott, of the United States, failed when marking a Maxima pain committed Fernando Maple in the second time."

- The Universal One: "Even, to four minutes of the end, Burdisso it ran over blatantly to Maple within the area. Penalty only lost the referee Kevin Stott."

- The Day: "Errors in the defense and badly an arbitration sank to the Tri the silbante did not mark clear penitentiary." "In addition, the arbitration of the American Kevin Scott finished stabbing to the tricolors, when letting mark a clear penitentiary minute 86, when Battaglia gave caballazo in the back to Fernando Maple."

- The Press: "three minutes of the end, the referee did not mark to a push of the Argentine defense Nicholas Burdisso on the back of Maple, within the area."

- The Reformation: "the forward of the Veracruz received a clear lack of the Argentine captain Nicholas Burdisso, but the silbante Kevin Scott cleared its bad performance when marking the penitentiary." Argentinian Press

- Ole: "Few lights, too much suffering and penitentiary of Burdisso to Olalde that the Yankee whistle swallowed by mediocre were the last images of an average Argentine triumph tristongo, that in addition will not add nothing else that a statistical detail."

[Alberto]

Originally posted by robviii
Mexican Press:

-El Heraldo:
"El árbitro estadunidense Kevin Scot tuvo pésima actuación"

The American referee Kevin Stott had a miserable performance.

-La Cronica:
"Árbitro: Kevin Scott, de Estados Unidos, falló al no marcar una pena máxima cometida a Fernando Arce en el segundo tiempo."

In the second half, American referee Kevin Stott failed to call the penalty committed against Fernando Arce.

-El Universal:
"Incluso, a cuatro minutos del final, Burdisso atropelló descaradamente a Arce dentro del área. El penalty sólo se lo perdió el árbitro Kevin Stott."
In addition four minutes from full time, Burdisso shamelessly ran over Arce inside the penalty area. Only referee Kevin Stott missed it.

-La Jornada:
"Errores en la defensa y un mal arbitraje hundieron al Tri El silbante no marcó claro penal."
Defensive mistakes and bad officiating sank the Tri. The whistler did not call a clear penalty.

"Además, el arbitraje del estadunidense Kevin Scott terminó de apuñalar a los tricolores, al dejar de marcar un claro penal al minuto 86, cuando Battaglia dio un caballazo en la espalda a Fernando Arce."
Also US referee Kevin Stott completed the barrage on the Tricolores by not marking a clear penalty in the 86th minute, when Battaglia violently charged Fernando Arce in the back.

-La Prensa:
"A tres minutos del final, el árbitro no marcó un empujón del defensa argentino Nicolás Burdisso sobre la espalda de Arce, dentro del área."
Three minutes from the end, the referee did not mark a push by Argentinian defender Nicolas Burdisso about the back of Arce inside the penalty area.

-La Reforma:
"El delantero del Veracruz recibió una clara falta del capitán argentino Nicolás Burdisso, pero el silbante Kevin Scott redondeó su mala actuación al no marcar el penal."
The Veracruz forward received a clear foul by Argentinian Captain Nicolas Burdisso, but the whistleblower, Kevin Stott came full circle with his poor performance by not calling the penalty.

Argentinian Press

-Ole:
"Pocas luces, demasiado sufrimiento y penal de Burdisso a Olalde que el pito yanqui se tragó por mediocre fueron las últimas imágenes de un triunfo argentino medio tristongo, que además no agregará nada más que un detalle estadístico."
Little brilliance, a lot of suffering and a penalty by Burdisso that the Yankee whistle swallowed. These were the medicore last images of a half sad Argentinian triumph that will amount to nothing more than a statistical detail.

[billf]

Originally posted by nsa
This may be permitted in the case of Player A shielding a ball that is nearing the touchline or goal line. Player B may charge Player A in the back (area of the shoulder blade) in a non-agressive manner. Remembering that this is all ITOOTR.

I didn't see the match last might, however the descriptions that I've seen do not sound like a "non-agressive" act along a field boundary.

Yep, that's exactly my understanding. I saw the replay and this certainly wasn't the case on this play.

[IASocFan]

Originally posted by csh2000 in the USA men Forum
There is no way that should've been a penalty. The attacker was not playing the ball and even if he wanted to, he wasn't going to get to the ball before it went out of bounds. Realizing this, he threw himself between the defender and the ball and dove.

Was there contact? Yes.

Did it deny an opportunity for the attacker to score or play the ball? No - he wasn't trying to score or play the ball.

I was surprised we didn't see a yellow card for the dive.

I didn't see the game, but here is a differing opinion on the uncalled penalty kick. FWIW. :)