Rossi's playing time?

[haven]

I'm not making this a poll - because my experience has taught me that those suck ;). Here's the question:

Given only the quality of Rossi's first-team performances and reserve team performances - has he deserved more playing time than he has so far received?

To me, this is the greatest puzzle of the season (and the greatest puzzle of the offseason was United's failure to buy a CM). Rossi looks like class when you see him. The manager obviously rates him highly. You hear glowing reports of him from various players. When he plays for the reserve, you see what always seems to happen when a player is too good for that level: he looks different. I'm obviously relying mostly (but not quite) on 2nd hand information about that last bit, btw.

You'd think a player like that would get a good 20 minutes, at minimum, every other game as an attacking sub. An occasional start when we're at home against average-to-poor opposition. But he gets less than that.

My question is not "why" or "does SAF have a good reason." Let's restrict the discussion to: would a player of Rossi's quality and development ordinarily get more playing time than Rossi has thus far received?

[aussieunited]

I feel that Fergie is slowly bringing him into the first team to stop the media hype and obvious nonsense that would be spurted out by the English rags if he had a really poor game. Thats not to say that in the next couple of weeks with an easier schedule of games coming up that we won't see him start a couple or at least come on with 20-30 mins left.

Just my 2 cents

[bigtoga]

My thoughts are that Rossi's a great player but when do you play him? Ole just came back, Saha's now apparently healthy... Unless you want another one of Sir Al's "We're going to convert him into a defensive midfielder" experiements, I don't know where you would put him.

He's going to get minutes in the FA Cup, we hope, and maybe to spell Rooney/Ruud occasionaly but we're stacked (for the time being) with four guys in front of him.

[listen_up_fergie]

My thoughts are that Rossi's a great player but when do you play him? Ole just came back, Saha's now apparently healthy... Unless you want another one of Sir Al's "We're going to convert him into a defensive midfielder" experiements, I don't know where you would put him.

He's going to get minutes in the FA Cup, we hope, and maybe to spell Rooney/Ruud occasionaly but we're stacked (for the time being) with four guys in front of him.

I think Solskjaer will be used predominantly as a right winger, so he shouldn't get into Rossi's way.

[johno]

Rossi's playing time has been restricted for a few reasons, not least of which is the great pressure on us to get good results every single week and the fact that he plays the position of a proven creative player when our only other real creative player has been injured or off the boil.

Our over-reliance on Rooney is part of the reason Rossi isn't playing quite so much.

[Invincible]

Chelsea isn't the only reason we dont play Rossi as much, we have to look at our self too. If we were stronger in other areas of the pitch, namely the midfield, we could bring Rossi on as a sub in every match because we could be confident about our defence that they would clear their lines, and that the midfield will win and control the ball.

If Mourinho had a young talent like Rossi dont you think he'd be bringing him on all the time? We need to fix the pressing areas on the pitch, start getting consistent results and THEN we could really be confident about blooding our youngsters.

[Motterman]

If we had injuries to our frontline, like we have in midfield at the moment, we'd be seeing much more of Rossi.

And before somebody complains about our lack of numbers in midfield, look back and remember when we only had Smith for the first few months of last season, and look at our strikeforce today. Fergie knows what he has to do...

[bigtoga]

If Mourinho had a young talent like Shawn Wright-Phillips dont you think he'd be bringing him on all the time? FYP

[haven]

Eh? Chelsea are a reason to play Rossi more, not less.

I thought the EPL title race was over in November. Chelsea are probably better than United at about...ermm.. 7 positions (with Heinze out), in my estimation. After that, they have vastly suprior depth. Then you give them a nice, comfy cushion.

That's a reason to play Rossi more, not less. Realistically, we haven't been in the title race for a long time. This is when you play guys like him. The Chelsea factor is only an excuse when we're within true striking distance.

[DutchFootballRulez]

The Chelsea factor is not the reason Rossi sees little time. Its the "Morton Gamst Pedersen has owned us until now" Factor..

Dropping points to teams that Man Utd should not drop points to, that's what's hurting Man Utd. In some ways, Rossi can help, but in other ways he cannot.

[bigtoga]

Eh? Chelsea are a reason to play Rossi more, not less.

I thought the EPL title race was over in November...That's a reason to play Rossi more, not less. Realistically, we haven't been in the title race for a long time.Eh? Your argument makes total sense if *we* were the ones with the near 20-point lead over the next place team. Realistically, we are in the 2nd place race which is super important. Who sits in favor of Rossi then when we play Liverpool or Arsenal? Not Ruud, Rooney, Ole, or Saha. So who then?

[littleman]

Eh? Chelsea are a reason to play Rossi more, not less.

I thought the EPL title race was over in November. Chelsea are probably better than United at about...ermm.. 7 positions (with Heinze out), in my estimation. After that, they have vastly suprior depth. Then you give them a nice, comfy cushion.

That's a reason to play Rossi more, not less. Realistically, we haven't been in the title race for a long time. This is when you play guys like him. The Chelsea factor is only an excuse when we're within true striking distance.

2nd is still most important, because we don't want to go through the qualifying shit for the CL next year. I'm very disappointed that we aren't playing Rossi more as well, but I can perfectly understand it.

The lack of quality CMs is crippling the team and Manchester United as a whole. It is a devastating consequence. Not winning matches, getting dumped out of CL, forcing out-of-position plays, resulting in non-confidence from sponsors, making it hard to toss in youngsters.. etc.

It is hard to think that quality CMs are a cure-all for Man United's problems, but perhaps that's the only missing piece of the puzzle. And arguably one of the more important ones.

[johno]

excellent post littleman...

Our defence is now up to par. We've got excellent depth as well. Our frontline is the best in the prem and one of the best in the world and the wings are secure when we've got our guys fit.

The effect a solid CM pairing would have on the team is unbelievable. Chipping in with goals, protecting the defence and holding possesion.

Consider this...

we're unbeaten against Chelsea, Arsenal and Liverpool, Tottenham, Wigan and Bolton... the other top 6 sides in the premiership.

Many of those results came without a decent central midfield pairing. Imagine what we could achieve with 2 more solid performers in each game.

I think instead of so many matches going to the wire we can stamp our authority on more games and allow players like Rossi more time with 2 more acquisitions. We'll also be able to rest Rooney more often because even if Rossi doesn't come up trumps we can rely on CM to create chances as well.

[haven]

Oh, right. I'd forgotten how important 2nd was to SAF.

That doesn't fly empirically. SAF has consistently spouted off mouthy tributes to the idea of finishing 2nd. Then he's treated the race for 2nd like dross the past two seasons. Two years ago, we probably would have finished 2nd - but SAF fielded ridiculously weak lineups toward the end of the season.

Sorry, your argument is empirically false in the context of SAF. ARGH! But I've done what I wanted to avoid, and gotten into a debate about reasoning!

Anyway, I think it's all irrelevant anyway. Why? Because there's almost always a reason not to play youth based on table position, unless you're not competing for anything (such as if you've already pulled away or are hopelessly mid-table).

Teams are very seldom in such positions. Yet play youth anyway. So...your point doesn't really have much merit.

[bigtoga]

Oh, right. I'd forgotten how important 2nd was to SAF.

That doesn't fly empirically. SAF has consistently spouted off mouthy tributes to the idea of finishing 2nd. Then he's treated the race for 2nd like dross the past two seasons. Two years ago, we probably would have finished 2nd - but SAF fielded ridiculously weak lineups toward the end of the season.

Sorry, your argument is empirically false in the context of SAF. ARGH! But I've done what I wanted to avoid, and gotten into a debate about reasoning!

Anyway, I think it's all irrelevant anyway. Why? Because there's almost always a reason not to play youth based on table position, unless you're not competing for anything (such as if you've already pulled away or are hopelessly mid-table).

Teams are very seldom in such positions. Yet play youth anyway. So...your point doesn't really have much merit.Sorry to ruffle your feathers and get you into a debate here lol... Thanks for the insults lol

I think you'll see Rossi get some time with the upcoming fixtures being "lighter" competition, particularly in the next five fixtures. But you mention that we should've won 2nd place except for SAF fielding weak lineups... Surely Al's not fielding Ruud or Rooney so that a Reserve team player can get minutes instead has to be considered to be his fielding a weak lineup, right? I'll pose the same question to you again: Who sits so that Rossi can get minutes: Ruud, Rooney, Ole or Saha?

[StrikerCW]

Sorry to ruffle your feathers and get you into a debate here lol... Thanks for the insults lol

I think you'll see Rossi get some time with the upcoming fixtures being "lighter" competition, particularly in the next five fixtures. But you mention that we should've won 2nd place except for SAF fielding weak lineups... Surely Al's not fielding Ruud or Rooney so that a Reserve team player can get minutes instead has to be considered to be his fielding a weak lineup, right? I'll pose the same question to you again: Who sits so that Rossi can get minutes: Ruud, Rooney, Ole or Saha?
Rooney, he needs the rest. End of case.

[haven]

Sorry to ruffle your feathers and get you into a debate here lol... Thanks for the insults lol

I think you'll see Rossi get some time with the upcoming fixtures being "lighter" competition, particularly in the next five fixtures. But you mention that we should've won 2nd place except for SAF fielding weak lineups... Surely Al's not fielding Ruud or Rooney so that a Reserve team player can get minutes instead has to be considered to be his fielding a weak lineup, right? I'll pose the same question to you again: Who sits so that Rossi can get minutes: Ruud, Rooney, Ole or Saha?

Oooof. Didn't mean to sound insulting. You always bring solid points to the table, I just think that this time you're wrong.

I wouldn't be utterly shocked if, given a chance, Rossi is better right now than Saha and Ole at striker.

Now, there's no doubt that Saha offers something different in that he's an aerial threat. So as a partner to Rooney, you'd prefer Saha. And Ole is probably better on the wings. But I'm not buying Ole to ever play striker effectively for Man Utd again. Hope I'm wrong.

And if there's any doubt, Rossi wins those debates because of the "P" word. Saha is a mediocre striker on an elite team. We know this. Ole is a loyal servant of the club whose best days are almost certainly behind him. We know this.

Rossi? At times, he looks absolutely magnificent. Why not find out?

[omar_mufc]

saha is anything BUT mediocre, he just needs games to get back to his level, and the fact that he is scoring goals, despite not playing very well, shows that he's first and foremost, a good goalscorer, well, better than drogba anyway....

[littleman]

saha is anything BUT mediocre, he just needs games to get back to his level, and the fact that he is scoring goals, despite not playing very well, shows that he's first and foremost, a good goalscorer, well, better than drogba anyway....

Hmph! May I kindly remind you that Drogba cost TWICE as much as Saha! :mad:









:D

[bigtoga]

Rossi? At times, he looks absolutely magnificent. Why not find out?I'm certainly not against giving him minutes - we all want to see how he plays when given consistent minutes in the first team. But there's a bit of a conundrum here for Sir Al: what would it say to the team if he dropped the recently rehabbed players for a reserve team player? Let's assume that, until proven otherwise, Ole rates highest, then Saha, and then Rossi. How would Saha take being benched for Rossi? Or Ole? How would it affect team morale?

Everything else aside, I just think that the timing is really not on the kid's side at the moment.