Clubs using too many Foriegners?

[OrientFan]

Ive been watching football for 40 years (im 46) and Im wondering what you all think of the amount of foreigners the clubs are bringing in, I know the EEC rules allow them to do it .
Someone told me that EUFA are considering rules about the amount of foriegn born players a club is allowed to have.

Didnt Arsenal field a complete side of non english players once and Chelsea have a high amount too.

For me I see a quota as a good thing , because I think its making it even more difficult for our youngsters to get in the game.
Id say a quota of 20 percent would be perfect.

Who knows, if this keeps up we might never discover another Best, Charlton, Marsh , Beckham, Banks, Shilton etc.

PS what is it with these "Superstars" wearing GLOVES when they play now? the old hard men of football must be laughing thier socks off.

[Clint Eastwood]

I was watching the Bolton vs. Fulham match this past weekend and decided to count the number of English players. I was watching, of course, for the American players McBride and Bocanegra for Fulham. If I'm right, Rosenior was the only English player on Fulham that day. Crossley I don't think is English, but I could be wrong. Bolton had Nolan and Davies for them out there. So if I'm doing my math correctly there were the same number of English players as those from Senegal (Diop, Diouf, and Faye). That just seemed incredible to me.

Are good English players too expensive? Is McBride cheaper than the English equivalent? Are there not enough quality English players with which to fill the rosters? I find that hard to believe. What effect will this have on the English National Team? So far it doesn't appear to have been a problem. Anyway, a lot to think about.

If I was English I don't know if I could root for Bolton. There have got to be players out there that I can relate with. I can't just root for the shirt blindly. It just seemed like a pack of international soccer mercenaries. There's got to be English players better than Jaidi that Bolton can afford, and I'll leave it at that.

[Miles Brasher]

I was watching the Bolton vs. Fulham match this past weekend and decided to count the number of English players. I was watching, of course, for the American players McBride and Bocanegra for Fulham. If I'm right, Rosenior was the only English player on Fulham that day. Crossley I don't think is English, but I could be wrong. Bolton had Nolan and Davies for them out there. So if I'm doing my math correctly there were the same number of English players as those from Senegal (Diop, Diouf, and Faye). That just seemed incredible to me.

HAve you only just realised the huge number of imports into this country ??

Are good English players too expensive?

Yes
Is McBride cheaper than the English equivalent?

Yes
Are there not enough quality English players with which to fill the rosters?

Yes
I find that hard to believe.

It's true though

What effect will this have on the English National Team? So far it doesn't appear to have been a problem.

There are negatives and positives. The players gain from playing with the cream of world football. Ashley Cole has Henry ahead of him on the left, he'll learn from that and improve. If he had Jeffers he wouldn't learn as much.


If I was English I don't know if I could root for Bolton. There have got to be players out there that I can relate with. I can't just root for the shirt blindly. It just seemed like a pack of international soccer mercenaries. There's got to be English players better than Jaidi that Bolton can afford, and I'll leave it at that.

If the player plays for the shirt rather than the money, to a great extent his nationality is unimportant.

[Dr_Intoxicated]

Ive been watching football for 40 years (im 46) and Im wondering what you all think of the amount of foreigners the clubs are bringing in, I know the EEC rules allow them to do it .
Someone told me that EUFA are considering rules about the amount of foriegn born players a club is allowed to have.

Because of the EEC work regulations they cannot do it by country so they have developed the notion of "home grown" they are proposing to set a limit for the number of players developed through a clubs youth system

Didnt Arsenal field a complete side of non english players once and Chelsea have a high amount too.


Well Chelsea did that once but seem to be stuck with that now although these days they usually play with an above average number of England qualified players. I think Arsenal have done this several times, as have an increasing number of other clubs.


For me I see a quota as a good thing , because I think its making it even more difficult for our youngsters to get in the game.
Id say a quota of 20 percent would be perfect.


Well professional football is a business and it has to operate under normal commercial law


Who knows, if this keeps up we might never discover another Best, Charlton, Marsh , Beckham, Banks, Shilton etc.


I think the cream will always rise to the top, it just means that average journeyman players no longer get contracts.


PS what is it with these "Superstars" wearing GLOVES when they play now? the old hard men of football must be laughing thier socks off.

To some extent this is almost a fashion thing. I had to laugh the other week when one of Chelsea's players came on with gloves and a SHORT sleeved shirt!

[King-James]

There are hundreds of clubs for players to play in, in England. If they're good enough players then they will make it to the EPL. But getting rid of foreigners just so less skilled English players can play doesn't make much sense.

Do you really want to see the EPL decline to a second rate league?

[OrientFan]

There are hundreds of clubs for players to play in, in England. If they're good enough players then they will make it to the EPL. But getting rid of foreigners just so less skilled English players can play doesn't make much sense.

Do you really want to see the EPL decline to a second rate league?

Thats a fair argument, the EPL is the toughest league in the world without a doubt.
it often makes me wonder, do you think Pele would have scored 1000 league goals if he played in the EPL?
or would Maradona or Cryuff, Eusabio been as devestating?

[act smiley]

I'd say its not just so much a tendancy to buy foreign players as a tendancy to buy instead of develop, which obviously makes there less english players available.
Some rather interesting statistics here:
English players (English-born players who play for international sides like Wales or Jamaica get counted as foreign, because its easier) in last premiership game (including unused subs) compared to players who have never played for any other club (excluding loans) and those who will count as "developed" under UEFA's new rules (player must have played for team for 3 years while under-21):

Arsenal - 1, 0, 0
Aston Villa - 9, 3, 4
Birmingham -
Blackburn - 3, 0, 0
Bolton - 3, 3, 3
Charlton - 7, 1, 1
Chelsea - 5, 2, 2
Everton -
Fulham - 4, 1, 1
Liverpool - 4, 3, 4
Man City - 10, 6, 6
Man Utd - 7, 5, 6
Middlesborough -
Newcastle -
Portsmouth - 4, 1, 2
Sunderland -
Tottenham - 8, 2, 2
Wigan - 5, 2, 2
West Brom -
West Ham - 9, 2, 2

[Miles Brasher]

I'd say its not just so much a tendancy to buy foreign players as a tendancy to buy instead of develop, which obviously makes there less english players available.



Wenger is a manager who does develop talent as opposed to buying it. But he has on several occasions complained about the lack of English talent that is available. I think he refers to it as the 'Playstation ' problem or something similar...

[act smiley]

He shops around for the best young talents, then picks them up and develops them - but other than Bentley, Hoyte and Smith, I can't think of any english ones and I think that most have played for another side before Arsenal, while Man City's young players have been more English and aren't bought at all.

[Miles Brasher]

He shops around for the best young talents, then picks them up and develops them - but other than Bentley, Hoyte and Smith, I can't think of any english ones and I think that most have played for another side before Arsenal, while Man City's young players have been more English and aren't bought at all.

The problem being that with respect to ManC, Arsenal are after better players. Bentley is a good example. He's good enough for some PL sides but at present he's not good enough for the best sides. So he'll get into a Blackburn team, but not a Arsenal/Manu/Chelsea side. Pennant was actually about to offered another contract, when he went and ********ed up again. It was his mental attitude that let him down. Hoyte and Smith may well be good enough, time will tell, but Wenger's unique scouting ability means that he'll normally pick up better and cheaper players from overseas. Of all the English youngsters at Highbury since Wenger turned up, only Cole has gone on to make it in the 1st team, but no-one else has really been good enough.

[Gooner_for_Life]

Originally Posted by Clint Eastwood
Are good English players too expensive?

I have the same answer as Miles Basher, and its yes. But to look into more in depth current established english stars, lets say who play for the national team, are vastly overpriced compared to other stars on other national teams. With this being the case i can think of only 3 teams with the budget to buy one of these players. Arsenal, Manu, and Chelsea. I think Liverpool or Newcastle could maybe afford them due to stadium size but it would be that years budget and thats it. Football is a business and why buy a player for more money when you can get someone of the same class for less money. Thats just poor business.

Another aspect is the overpriced youngsters. Have Arsenal bought a rising english talent? Not that i can remember recently, and not since Wenger came to the club. Again, why spend more money than neccesary? The only way new english players are going to be developed is if they join an academy and come through the ranks. This will happen as long as that players is good enough, good talent never goes unnoticed.

So maybe in my opinion the prices need to be lowered a bit to help increase competition for signatures. Also i think if UEFA imposed a limit or rule that this would be very detrimental and would turn the Premiership into a second rate league.

[act smiley]

If the Premier League make their own rule, it would be a problem. But if UEFA apply one like what they're doing with the UEFA Cup and Champions League, its going to be applied to all the other top leagues - its the clubs own fault if that has an impact on them.

[Dave_M]

My stance is fairly clear cut. I love watching top quality football. Simple as. What do I care where the players were born, and what difference does it really matter. A good footballer is just that - a good footballer.

The ONLY downside to this is that perhaps youth grassroots talent suffers, but really high competition should improve standards, rather than stiffle them.

[Dave_M]

but other than Bentley, Hoyte and Smith, I can't think of any english ones and I think that most have played for another side before Arsenal

Ashley Cole?

[The Double]

it often makes me wonder, do you think Pele would have scored 1000 league goals if he played in the EPL?
or would Maradona or Cryuff, Eusabio been as devestating?

What the hell are you on about?

[Clan]

This debate comes up all the time - it's funny though, how it's always directed at the English.

Why don't you bang on about Italy and Spain?

[OrientFan]

What the hell are you on about?


You cant read or understand English?

[Gooner_for_Life]

Originally posted by Clanblue
This debate comes up all the time - it's funny though, how it's always directed at the English.

Why don't you bang on about Italy and Spain?

Because a majority of the players who play in these leagues are Italian or Spanish. Without doing any research and off the top of my head i can't think of one Italian national team member who plays in the Premiership. As for the Spanish there are a few and it seems that players come and go between these leagues with players frequently stating that they would like to play in either.

[Walter3000]

Because a majority of the players who play in these leagues are Italian or Spanish. Without doing any research and off the top of my head i can't think of one Italian national team member who plays in the Premiership. As for the Spanish there are a few and it seems that players come and go between these leagues with players frequently stating that they would like to play in either.

Beckham is the only regular for England playing elsewhere

[spursman]

HA! this is why im so proud to be a spurs fan at the moment. we're doing the best we've done for a long time and the spine of the team is english. young englishmen that can only get better. long may it continue! when i look at arsenal i see a team that i hate!!! and its even easier to hate them being mostly foriegn. and french!!! spit