ADU vs. Soccer's elitists

[SteamerFan]

First, let's remember the great Landon Donovan. I listened to how great he was before he was even mediocre. He played MLS initially and sucked compared to Freddy's performances in his first year, but played, and the coach and everyone including Ty Keough was saying what a talent Landon will be once he gets his feet wet. And, he was played continuously every game and every lack luster result was explained away as a potential investment on a brighter future. Now Landon is an outstanding player because of his grooming. Why don't we hear that about Adu? Freddy has been beseiged with negativity by commentators and others from the get go. Why is Beasley in Europe? Why didn't the US national tout Beasley like Donovan? I have played for a long time and watched with dismay at the good ol' boys "club" of soccer infecting rational choices on talent, and am truly fed up with it. If you think Adu has no talent, I think you have issues that go outside the realm of soccer. Let's encourage the kid and play him consistently, then you can complain. He isn't going to do anything when he has a coach that is myopic and has an ego problem with some young guy that has more talent than he did, so Nowak never plays him consistently, so he never gets close to even realizing his potential. And second, Arena is a fool if he doesn't bring in some fresh young talent, whomever it may be. Has he forgotten that was the combination that got the team as far as it did in South Korea. The downfall of US Soccer is forgetting that the young kids are the driving force that creates a synergy with the veteran players. Just look at the loser teams the US has put up and their refusal to play strong young players that didn't go to the right schools or camps or training invitationals or know the right coaches or date USSF soccer officials daughters. Don't get me wrong, there is very good talent on the US squad, just hate to see them step backward and forget what got them there. If there isn't a ceiling on the non "club" members, tell it to Rolfie who was making 16,000 prior to a recent contract, and who barely got a college scholarship and barely got a tryout to a training camp. And, barely got invited to play with the Fire. Barely's are not a system that is working correctly.

[Arisrules]

Umm...Adu does have talent...but he's playing on an MLS Cup winning side. He's not good enough yet, to start. It's just that simple.

And Adu is very much part of the soccer elitist her in America...I'd consider him american soccer royalty.


Problem is, Nowak cares about one thing...the WIN. That's it, and for that he has to be commended.

[SteamerFan]

Myopia is not a lonely affair.

[MikeR]

Umm...Adu does have talent...but he's playing on an MLS Cup winning side. He's not good enough yet, to start. It's just that simple.

And Adu is very much part of the soccer elitist her in America...I'd consider him american soccer royalty.


Problem is, Nowak cares about one thing...the WIN. That's it, and for that he has to be commended.

Exactly right. Nowak's job is to win games, not to make sure Freddy gets to the World Cup. The same is true of coaches of professional teams around the world. Freddy just turned 16. The question is whether Freddy, at age 16, is better than the other options on DC United. I think I'll trust Nowak on this one.

I'm afraid Freddy is falling victim to the hype, what with his talk about Chelsea and complaining about playing time. Actually, I guess that makes him the perfect Chelsea player, so I guess we'll see him move there when he's 18.

As for fresh talent, I don't recall anyone in 2002 who was 16 or anywhere close at the time of the WC. Freddy will be 20 in 2010, which is about the age when most players, even phenoms, first appear for their countries in the WC.

As for the alleged Freddy-hating, I don't see much of it. I've heard a lot of players in MLS aren't happy that this 16-year-old kid is making vastly more money than a lot of veterans. But most rational people I've read and heard understand that a kid who just turned 16 isn't going to dominate MLS, period.

I'm not sure what to say about the idea that US soccer isn't promoting Freddy. He's got a starring role in NIKE's big commercial, he's making big money (relatively speaking) in MLS, and everyone would love to have the kid at WC 2006 if he was ready. He's just not.

[Chicago76]

He isn't going to do anything when he has a coach that is myopic and has an ego problem with some young guy that has more talent than he did, so Nowak never plays him consistently, so he never gets close to even realizing his potential.

He may in fact have more talent than Nowak at a similar age, but getting from talent/potential to what Nowak accomplished is a tough road. If Adu gets there, call me ecstatic.

The press has given him a lot of publicity and a long leash. Try getting that in Europe. Adu has been pampered from day one and is guilty of believing the hype generated by the press. He'd be better served keeping throughts of leaving his club to himself and his crying out of the press. That's what his mother is for.

[sidefootsitter]

Exactly right. Nowak's job is to win games, not to make sure Freddy gets to the World Cup... However ... in seller leagues, the pressure to polish the youngsters ASAP and sell them to bigger teams for a lot of money is huge.

[flash1316]

First, let's remember the great Landon Donovan. I listened to how great he was before he was even mediocre. He played MLS initially and sucked compared to Freddy's performances in his first year, but played, and the coach and everyone including Ty Keough was saying what a talent Landon will be once he gets his feet wet. And, he was played continuously every game and every lack luster result was explained away as a potential investment on a brighter future.

Landon came over when he was 18. Freddy is 16. 16 yr old's should not be starting consistently in a professional year. It's a development thing not a talent thing. When Freddy is 18, yes then he is ready to start for his team. Actually he would probably be ok at 17. And I repeat it's not about his talent it's about protecting him from burnout so the kid can actually play for 15yrs. This is about his future --- he has development that has not been completed ---- because he's 16 freaking yrs old. AND besides that Landon came back because he was picking splinters out of butt on the bench of Leveurkeusen's Reserves. And they weren't gonna start Landon when he went over at 16. Because that's not what you do. And if you want proof look at the ages that Sir Alex Fergurson broke in his great young generation. Look at what age Rossi is getting his debut now. 18. And Rossi is considered to be one of the brightest young talents in the game. Look at what age Ajax, the team of youth, lets its players start, no matter how good they are. It's 18 that's the freaking universal number.

Now Landon is an outstanding player because of his grooming. Why don't we hear that about Adu? Freddy has been beseiged with negativity by commentators and others from the get go. Why is Beasley in Europe? Why didn't the US national tout Beasley like Donovan? I have played for a long time and watched with dismay at the good ol' boys "club" of soccer infecting rational choices on talent, and am truly fed up with it. If you think Adu has no talent, I think you have issues that go outside the realm of soccer.

I understand your frustrations with the politics in US soccer, but none of that applies to Adu, Freddy has been the recipient of the best coaching and facilities has to offer. Beasely's in Europe cause he's always had more drive than Donovan, Landon was in a bad situation while Beasely went over to a very good situation, and Landon's got a pansy complex. Beasely's appreciated and adored by all knowledgable soccer fans, Bruce loves him and trusts him to perform much more than he does Landon and there are quotes to back me up I just don't feel like finding them. The media overlooks him, but who gives a crap about what the vast soccer media in this country thinks. I think I know more about the game than most of them anyway. Freddy's not being held back by any "ol boys club" and you can't accuse Nowak, a Polish immigrant, of being part of that club. The "ol boys club" that you're referring to is apparently whispering sweet nothings in Freddy's ear and corrupting him by telling him he's the next Pele, the greatest player on God's green Earth, ready to start for the nat'l team now, and everyone else is just jealous of his talent and holding him back. That's what's corrupting the kid. People who are telling him everything you just said.

Let's encourage the kid and play him consistently, then you can complain. He isn't going to do anything when he has a coach that is myopic and has an ego problem with some young guy that has more talent than he did, so Nowak never plays him consistently, so he never gets close to even realizing his potential.

See down below.

And second, Arena is a fool if he doesn't bring in some fresh young talent, whomever it may be. Has he forgotten that was the combination that got the team as far as it did in South Korea. The downfall of US Soccer is forgetting that the young kids are the driving force that creates a synergy with the veteran players. Just look at the loser teams the US has put up and their refusal to play strong young players that didn't go to the right schools or camps or training invitationals or know the right coaches or date USSF soccer officials daughters. Don't get me wrong, there is very good talent on the US squad, just hate to see them step backward and forget what got them there. If there isn't a ceiling on the non "club" members, tell it to Rolfie who was making 16,000 prior to a recent contract, and who barely got a college scholarship and barely got a tryout to a training camp. And, barely got invited to play with the Fire. Barely's are not a system that is working correctly.

First Point: You don't play him consistently because he's 16. He is being encouraged hopefully by the right people. If he was in Europe right now. Actually if he was a European with a European club so we can cut out any FIFA child labor laws. He would be slaving away in the reserves right now, working his butt off, so that maybe every now and then he can sit on the first team bench. And I'm not talking about the subs bench that comes later. Then after that he might be included on the subs bench for a meaningless Champs or Uefa Leage game or a meaningless Carling Cup game. Then at 17 if he's really good he might make his debut if there are some injuries in the first team, but it's more likely that he'll get his debut for the first time at a home game when he's 18.

Second Point: The young talent I look to seeing is EJ, Gooch, Quaranta, Marshall, Rico Clark, and Justin Mapp hopefully. When I think of what youth I thin we need in Germany. Freddy's real far down the list. After the ones above and after Convey, Spector, Feilhaber, Dempsey, Rolfe, Jacqua, and Parkhurst. Yeah Rolfe has been shafted, but that has like nothing to do with Freddy Adu. Yeah the system sucks, but that has nothing to do with Freddy Adu. Rolfe will get a real contract and will be able to stop eating Raman Noodles next year. Bruce doesn't need Freddy in Germany, the only reason to bring Freddy would be to give him experience in 2010. Which is debatable, but frankly I don't think we should waste the roster spot. Bruce needs Rossi much more than he needs Freddy. And to go on with Rossi, the politics left him out, same with Feilhaber. You don't need the USSF to suceed. Admitedly they did both need a lot of favorable circumstances to put them in the positions they're in now. But none of that has anything to do with Freddy Adu.

[Mountainia]

..snip.. [Donovan] played MLS initially and sucked compared to Freddy's performances in his first year ..snip..
I don't remember Donovan's first year performances, but I saw Adu's. He showed promise, great touch, speed, and quickness. He was also easily dispossessed, brought down easily, and showed a lot of inexperience. I thought he developed quite nicely his first year for a 14-15 year old.
Freddy has been beseiged with negativity by commentators and others from the get go.
I think you confuse realism with negativity. Saying he needs to learn is not negative. It's the facts, and it's what we all hope for. Negative is saying he can't or won't learn. But I've never seen anyone say that, not even here at BS.
Why is Beasley in Europe? Why didn't the US national tout Beasley like Donovan?
Beasley is in Europe because he is an extremely good player with potential to be even better. And because his team is paying big bucks. And what does 'tout' even mean? The US National Team only 'touts' players when advertising televised matches, and they most certainly did 'tout' Beasley.
If you think Adu has no talent ..snip..
I've never seen this posted. This is a straw man. Adu clearly has talent, or we wouldn't be talking about him.

[Shaydee]

However ... in seller leagues, the pressure to polish the youngsters ASAP and sell them to bigger teams for a lot of money is huge.


But MLS doesn't want to be a seller league.

[Fulham Fan]

I don't blame Nowak. He began playing pro soccer at age 15, so it's not like he doesn't bring sensitivity to this issue. If you're to blame someone other than Adu - who's a teenager and bound to say something when he's frustrated (or nervous, as with his USMNT chances) - then it's Arena. Arena should be making occasional phone calls to Adu and saying "I want this, this, and this to be worked on; don't say this, improve this, you did well here," etc. And he can make phone calls like that to a dozen different guys. He's the national team coach. If players want to be steered towards the national team, he should take out the guessing game and tell them what's wanted. Since Arena's not the type to say "be more selfish with the ball!" it's not like he'll run afoul of MLS coaches.

[Matrim55]

If players want to be steered towards the national team, he should take out the guessing game and tell them what's wanted.
I want to be steered towards the national team. Maybe he should give me a call, too?

[FirstStar]

I don't blame Nowak. He began playing pro soccer at age 15, so it's not like he doesn't bring sensitivity to this issue. If you're to blame someone other than Adu - who's a teenager and bound to say something when he's frustrated (or nervous, as with his USMNT chances) - then it's Arena. Arena should be making occasional phone calls to Adu and saying "I want this, this, and this to be worked on; don't say this, improve this, you did well here," etc. And he can make phone calls like that to a dozen different guys. He's the national team coach. If players want to be steered towards the national team, he should take out the guessing game and tell them what's wanted. Since Arena's not the type to say "be more selfish with the ball!" it's not like he'll run afoul of MLS coaches.

Oh, I think Bruce has sent his message. That message is "I don't take MLS players who aren't consistent starters." Whether Freddy would be taken if he was a consistent starter is quite debatable, but I think Freddy sees that lack of starting, not his lack of experience/ability, as the problem.

[Maldini#3]

But MLS doesn't want to be a seller league.

So long as all clubs are owned by one entity, the best role of the MLS is to be a seller league. There's no hope for the National team if we just keep all our players in MLS. Without deep pockets of a private owner, how do you expect to attract the talent out there? If you were an up and coming player, would you choose a $500,000 salary at an established, lower division European side or would you choose a $100,000 salary on an MLS side?

[FC Tallavana]

But MLS doesn't want to be a seller league.

But, they don't want to fold either.

[united9]

simple question... Wc 2006 2nd round...85 min down 2-1... who do you want to throw on the field to run at tired defenders.... ralston? albright? wiffman i mean twellman.. or Freddy.. someone who can run at defenders and create for other people.. 16 or 26.. i'd have freddy on the roster ahead of half the mls "regulars".. a spark is a spark.. twellman can score all the last minute mls goals he wants.. he's not going up for headers against japp stam or carragher.. and rimando coming off the line is not quite kahn..

everyone can say what they want.. in that situation..i want a gamechanger, talent and speed.. and i'd take freddy over 99.9% of the names anyone would want to throw out there.. and he's hiding it well.. but i have a sneaky suspicion bruce feels the same way.

[Metrogo]

If you think Adu has no talent, I think you have issues that go outside the realm of soccer.

NAme one person, either responsible or a yahoo on bigsoccer, who has said this.

Your straw man argument is untenable.

[the Next Level]

But, they don't want to fold either.

These types of arguments are ridiculous.

MLS owners know they will undermine their own investments if they become a seller league. It's a better investment, if you have the money - which these owners do - to keep players here than to sell them elsewhere.

[sidefootsitter]

These types of arguments are ridiculous.

MLS owners know they will undermine their own investments if they become a seller league. It's a better investment, if you have the money - which these owners do - to keep players here than to sell them elsewhere. There are two types of leagues : the "I'll meet the asking price, whatever it may be" or the "the whole world is negotiable" ... and there are basically no 1st type leagues, just a smattering of ultra rich teams, meaning that the majority of the soccer world fits the 2nd type.

Thus, if MLS can't meet the asking price - and it can only do so in special cases - then it's a seller league by definition and it better be open to negotiation.

Or be ready to let its players walk away on a free, including Adu.

[Matrim55]

There are two types of leagues : the "I'll meet the asking price, whatever it may be" or the "the whole world is negotiable" ... and there are basically no 1st type leagues, just a smattering of ultra rich teams, meaning that the majority of the soccer world fits the 2nd type.

Thus, if MLS can't meet the asking price - and it can only do so in special cases - then it's a seller league by definition and it better be open to negotiation.

Or be ready to let its players walk away on a free, including Adu.
Somewhere Carlos Bocanegra is nodding.

[Shackleton]

Myopia is not a lonely affair.

You seem to be speaking from experience. :rolleyes: