How badly did Mapp have to suck in camp... [R]

[Nutmeg]

...to not get called in for Guatemala? If you can, watch him destroy LA over and over and over again, putting the nail in the coffin in stoppage time yesterday. Vid's up and available on MLSNet.com, and Justin was clearly the best player on the field.

For that matter, Ricardo Clark and crew once again destroyed their latest opponent, making it 9 games in a row since they last lost a league game. Again, Clark was all over the field, destroying FCD attacks and initiating those of San Jose, partnered with Danny O'rourke to shut down and shut out Dallas.

If there are two kids who I'd like to see before Germany, here they are.

[Brushes Sand]

During last night's azteca/deporTV hour-long wake over the columbus result,
they showed Fahr-Gals highlights, and raved over Mapp's blistering runs.

Of course, it didn't help that on the 2nd one Cobi managed to track
Mapp all the way through the LA defense insuring 3 or 4 potential
dis-possessors were shielded from tackling Mapp by their own guy....

-bs

[Bruce S]

spectacular goal.Absolutely fantastic.

[Khan]

During last night's azteca/deporTV hour-long wake over the columbus result,
they showed Fahr-Gals highlights, and raved over Mapp's blistering runs.

Of course, it didn't help that on the 2nd one Cobi managed to track
Mapp all the way through the LA defense insuring 3 or 4 potential
dis-possessors were shielded from tackling Mapp by their own guy....

Yeah, those "blistering runs" are easy to come by when he's walking for the other 88 minutes in a match. Mapp still has to master the idea of actually TRYING to do something without the ball at his feet. Its now four years into his professional career, and he still hasn't figure it out.

[chad]

...to not get called in for Guatemala? If you can, watch him destroy LA over and over and over again, putting the nail in the coffin in stoppage time yesterday. Vid's up and available on MLSNet.com, and Justin was clearly the best player on the field.

For that matter, Ricardo Clark and crew once again destroyed their latest opponent, making it 9 games in a row since they last lost a league game. Again, Clark was all over the field, destroying FCD attacks and initiating those of San Jose, partnered with Danny O'rourke to shut down and shut out Dallas.

If there are two kids who I'd like to see before Germany, here they are.
Mapp has the unfortunate problem of being left-footed. No matter how good he is, he will not displace Beasley, Lewis, or Convey. He's a next cycle guy, probably. It's a shame in some ways, because he would make an excellent late-game offensive wing sub, with his control, passing, and speed. He's going to be better than Convey in the long run. We're just too set on the left for this cycle.

Clark seems merely to have the dual misfortunes of not being named Armas and not having played for DCU. That he did not get called into this camp is bewildering.

Ursula and geordienation, please note, I am not calling for Arena to be fired. ;)

[Bruce S]

Yeah, those "blistering runs" are easy to come by when he's walking for the other 88 minutes in a match. Mapp still has to master the idea of actually TRYING to do something without the ball at his feet. Its now four years into his professional career, and he still hasn't figure it out.
still-the boy has talent.

[kebzach]

If there are two kids who I'd like to see before Germany, here they are.

Is it official that Mapp won't be called in for Guatemala? My understanding was that they could be recalled after the Mexico game, if Bruce wanted to do so.

[Karl K]

Q. How badly did Mapp have to suck in camp?

A. Enough.

Imagine this....Bruce to Justin Mapp in camp:

"Hey kid." as Mapp tries to dribble through 4 guys for the 6th time and gets dispossessed for the 6th time, "this isn't a tired under-strength LA Galaxy in stoppage time. This is the US Men's Senior National team."

[Heathens '87]

I don't think it's a matter of "sucking" or not, but a matter of playing time. Mapp was brought into camp to get a taste of training with the team, not to play with the USMNT. He could be brought in without missing any time (playing time) with his club, as he could be returned prior to their next game.

That he's not back in camp now only indicates that he wasn't going to play on Wednesday, and there'll be little training prior to Guatemala to help his improve as a player. Bruce feels it's more important for the younger guys to play....and if he can't provide time, he'd rather them be with their club.

The surprise was that he was even brought into camp, which would indicate the regard Arena has for him. That's he not in the playing group, even with the Europeans returned to their club, shouldn't be a surprise, nor should it be taken as an indicator of his future with the USMNT......

[chad]

That's he not in the playing group, even with the Europeans returned to their club, shouldn't be a surprise, nor should it be taken as an indicator of his future with the USMNT......
Do you really think he has a chance in this cycle?

[Karl K]

I don't think it's a matter of "sucking" or not, but a matter of playing time. Mapp was brought into camp to get a taste of training with the team, not to play with the USMNT. He could be brought in without missing any time (playing time) with his club, as he could be returned prior to their next game.

That he's not back in camp now only indicates that he wasn't going to play on Wednesday, and there'll be little training prior to Guatemala to help his improve as a player. Bruce feels it's more important for the younger guys to play....and if he can't provide time, he'd rather them be with their club.

The surprise was that he was even brought into camp, which would indicate the regard Arena has for him. That's he not in the playing group, even with the Europeans returned to their club, shouldn't be a surprise, nor should it be taken as an indicator of his future with the USMNT......

What are you doing here??

You're making too much sense.

[Khan]

...to not get called in for Guatemala? If you can, watch him destroy LA over and over and over again, putting the nail in the coffin in stoppage time yesterday. Vid's up and available on MLSNet.com, and Justin was clearly the best player on the field.

The highlights are cute, but come out to Soldier Field and watch your buddy "Justin" walk and point whenever he doesn't have the ball at his feet.

I agree with you to a point: on TV [where the viewer doesn't get a sense of a player's value to the team off the ball] Mapp looks fine. In fact, I'd even suggest that when motivated, [and well-rested from having walked 98% of the match] Mapp is one of the finest players in MLS on the ball. However, in the real world, even the Zidanes of the world spend the most time [maybe 98% of a match] OFF the ball, and not in active possession.

So, to answer your quesion, "Justin" still hasn't figured it out. He doesn't belong on the team, and who would he replace:

Beasley? [Dream on. Imagine the "blistering runs" Beasley could take IF ONLY he mastered Mapp's walking-for-88-minutes technique...]
Lewis? [Again, dream on; He's shown he can play both LM and LB.]
Who?

There are limited roster spots for Germany, and Mapp is neither better than, nor as acomplished as, nor as versatile as those ahead of him in the team. Add in Arena's man-crush, Bobby Convey, and Mapp is no better than 4th on the "depth chart" at left wing!

[Nutmeg]

Q. How badly did Mapp have to suck in camp?

A. Enough.

Imagine this....Bruce to Justin Mapp in camp:

"Hey kid." as Mapp tries to dribble through 4 guys for the 6th time and gets dispossessed for the 6th time, "this isn't a tired under-strength LA Galaxy in stoppage time. This is the US Men's Senior National team."

Runs, Karl. Plural. Thanks. Maybe you could enlighten us on Mapp's performance with some of your game-tracking, you know, after you watch the game.

[Nutmeg]

The highlights are cute, but come out to Soldier Field and watch your buddy "Justin" walk and point whenever he doesn't have the ball at his feet.

Your long-standing despise of Mapp is duly noted. Again. Thanks.

[Nutmeg]

I don't think it's a matter of "sucking" or not, but a matter of playing time. Mapp was brought into camp to get a taste of training with the team, not to play with the USMNT. He could be brought in without missing any time (playing time) with his club, as he could be returned prior to their next game.

That he's not back in camp now only indicates that he wasn't going to play on Wednesday, and there'll be little training prior to Guatemala to help his improve as a player. Bruce feels it's more important for the younger guys to play....and if he can't provide time, he'd rather them be with their club.

The surprise was that he was even brought into camp, which would indicate the regard Arena has for him. That's he not in the playing group, even with the Europeans returned to their club, shouldn't be a surprise, nor should it be taken as an indicator of his future with the USMNT......

Nice post, as usual. I'm not saying the kid is getting screwed. I'm actually defering to Arena's judgment here, thinking that Justin must not have impressed enough in camp. Good enough. But there must be something Bruce wants to see from him that he's not seeing. Justin is one of the few players we have who has proven he can also play right mid pretty effectively.

My guess would be defensive workrate, and possibly movement off the ball.

[Heathens '87]

Do you really think he has a chance in this cycle?


For WC06...?! Highly unlikely without injury as we're too deep in the midfield. Mapp should be pleased to have gotten the invite, and he may still get some playing time with the USMNT in the remaining qualifiers, especially if Convey is kept with Reading.

I just don't think it's fair to say Mapp isn't back with the team for Guatemala is an indication that Arena thinks he "sucks," when the invitation to camp was a bit of a surprise in the first place. That was much more of an indication of his status than not taking this trip.......

[Khan]

still-the boy has talent.

Agreed. But this is what is so MADDENING about Mapp. One can see the mere flashes of what MIGHT BE in his game. One goes to bigsoccer, and reads DCU fans gushing about the latest "highlights" they saw on TV or on MLSnet.

And then I see him at Soldier Field walk around as if someone his age could actually get tired in matches!! Particularly when it doesn't appear that he even bothers to put in any effort into the game when the ball isn't at his feet!! [Hell, if the ball isn't passed directly to his feet, sometimes he won't even try to recieve the pass...]

Until he figures out that a player spends more time off the ball than on it, he'll never be more than a mediocre [and incomplete] "PLAYER." But again, that is a different thing than being a quality "TALENT."

[Knave]

It could also be as simple as Bruce not wanting Mapp's first qualifier to be an away game against Guatemala. Perhaps it's not the right time. Perhaps he thinks another platoon of players would be better. Perhaps against a different opponent Mapp would make the roster without a problem.

But to conjecture - without much information - about how badly he must have sucked in camp strikes me as a little presumptive and maybe even a little unfair.

Not saying he didn't suck in camp, just saying we don't really know.

And chad makes a very good point about our depth on the left. Mapp has a tough task ahead of him if he wants to make this team.

[Heathens '87]

But there must be something Bruce wants to see from him that he's not seeing. Justin is one of the few players we have who has proven he can also play right mid pretty effectively.

My guess would be defensive workrate, and possibly movement off the ball.


I'd agree.....and Bruce is the type of coach who doesn't leave players guessing about what they need to work on. That you get a chance to hear that directly from Bruce in a USMNT camp is a solid indicator that you're on the radar for the national team.

The ball is in Mapp's court.....focus on the complete game is a usual Arena plea to younger players.

[Khan]

Your long-standing despise of Mapp is duly noted. Again. Thanks.

Yes, and your long-standing man-crush on "Justin" is duly noted. Again.

J/K

In actuality, there's no "despise" of Mapp the person, as you would suggest. Many in Chicago "despise" is apparent inability to take his ponderous talent, and become a player. To actually, you know, TRY for a complete 90 minutes, rather than disappear for 88, and make a handful of nice runs for the other 2 minutes. His team suffers from playing 10 v 11 whenever he does his walking-and-pointing bit.