LA Times makes MLS beat writers cover road games by watching TV at home

[joebloe888]

Let's see if any of you newspaper guys (i.e. Beau Dure) out there will chime in with your outrage.

The ever-shrinking sports department at the Los Angeles Times, run by the notorious Bill Dwyer, chose to keep its two MLS beat reporters, Grahame Jones (Galaxy) and Paul Gutierrez (Chivas USA), at home and made them cover MLS road games this past Saturday by watching TV.

http://www.latimes.com/sports/soccer/la-sp-galaxy7aug07,1,1998442.story?coll=la-headlines-sports-soccer

http://www.latimes.com/sports/soccer/la-sp-chivas7aug07,1,7508059.story?coll=la-headlines-sports-soccer

If you MLS fans in LA haven't switched over to La Opinion yet, then why haven't you?

The LA Times sports section, if it hasn't been the butt of jokes already, has become one.

(Never mind the disgraceful way the LA Times sports section was left in the dust by other media outlets on the D.Lowe-C.Hughes scandal by sitting on the story for weeks and not publish anything until 4 days after the story broke.)

[monster]

Let's see if any of you newspaper guys (i.e. Beau Dure) out there will chime in with your outrage.

The ever-shrinking sports department at the Los Angeles Times, run by the notorious Bill Dwyer, chose to keep its two MLS beat reporters, Grahame Jones (Galaxy) and Paul Gutierrez (Chivas USA), at home and made them cover MLS road games this past Saturday by watching TV.

http://www.latimes.com/sports/soccer/la-sp-galaxy7aug07,1,1998442.story?coll=la-headlines-sports-soccer

http://www.latimes.com/sports/soccer/la-sp-chivas7aug07,1,7508059.story?coll=la-headlines-sports-soccer

If you MLS fans in LA haven't switched over to La Opinion yet, then why haven't you?

The LA Times sports section, if it hasn't been the butt of jokes already, has become one.

(Never mind the disgraceful way the LA Times sports section was left in the dust by other media outlets on the D.Lowe-C.Hughes scandal by sitting on the story for weeks and not publish anything until 4 days after the story broke.)
This wasn't the first time. I saw it in another Jones story recently and, you know what?

I don't mind. I know I should. I know I should be incensed by the lack of investment in road coverage, but the alternative is eight inches from the AP with no color at all. These guys cover the team so they can do a much more thorough job than an AP first lede, especially if they work with the teams to get quotes fed to them from the teams.

The KC Star did the same thing, kinda sorta.

http://www.kansascity.com/mld/kansascity/sports/12322046.htm - Gansler was interviewed by phone

In a normal world, I wish everyone were like the Washington Post and provided away coverage or at least arranged for a stringer to do it. But this is better than canned AP copy with no quotes and no insight into the away team.

[JayRockers!]

Doing phoners and reporting by TV is no substitute for actually being at the game, just ask Mitch Albom. The credibility of the reporter can (and shortly will) be called into question if they are not in the stadium, or locker room, or press area, to confirm a quote or provide accurate details that a watcher from home cannot see. Even those of us at home sometimes see things announcers miss because they are watching a different monitor or getting replays while action is continuing (Stone/Wynalda this past weekend during the melee comes to mind). The team should refuse to work with a reporter or paper who cannot physically be there for an interview or press session. I would rather see an AP sniped report that actually had a reporter physically present at an event. At any rate, I guess all of us who watch games on TV and come to Big Soccer to post results are now just as important to the news cycle as your average LA Times writer. And wasn't the LA Times the paper that was trying a post-it-from-home style of online journalism that quickly spiraled out of control?

Thx,

Jay!

[geordienation]

Let's see if any of you newspaper guys (i.e. Beau Dure) out there will chime in with your outrage.

The ever-shrinking sports department at the Los Angeles Times, run by the notorious Bill Dwyer, chose to keep its two MLS beat reporters, Grahame Jones (Galaxy) and Paul Gutierrez (Chivas USA), at home and made them cover MLS road games this past Saturday by watching TV.

http://www.latimes.com/sports/soccer/la-sp-galaxy7aug07,1,1998442.story?coll=la-headlines-sports-soccer

http://www.latimes.com/sports/soccer/la-sp-chivas7aug07,1,7508059.story?coll=la-headlines-sports-soccer

If you MLS fans in LA haven't switched over to La Opinion yet, then why haven't you?

The LA Times sports section, if it hasn't been the butt of jokes already, has become one.

(Never mind the disgraceful way the LA Times sports section was left in the dust by other media outlets on the D.Lowe-C.Hughes scandal by sitting on the story for weeks and not publish anything until 4 days after the story broke.)


Well, for one thing, a lot of fans don't speak spanish, so maybe La Opinion isn't an option.

Dwyer has been locked in an internal struggle over space and manpower in his section. For years, the Times Sports section had unlimited space and people to fill it. Now, not so much. Part of that is the fiscal realities of today, part of it is Dwyer's response to upper management (thumbing his nose, essentially, and cutting a lot of coverage to prove a point).

The fact of the matter is that most papers don't do road coverage of MLS games. It's not cost effective for what you get out of it. The Post does it because they have a huge base of fans there and they've covered soccer historically.

Quite frankly, though, if I'm Dwyer, I don't spend any money on the road for Chivas. When they win something (and when they prove they have a fanbase), then they'll get ink.

[aleaguer]

Doing phoners and reporting by TV is no substitute for actually being at the game, just ask Mitch Albom. The credibility of the reporter can (and shortly will) be called into question if they are not in the stadium, or locker room, or press area, to confirm a quote or provide accurate details that a watcher from home cannot see.

I think you're giving fans way too much credit for their insight. I think there are things going on behind the scenes in media at all levels that the average fan has no clue about as far as how details and quotes make it from where the events occur to the person at home.

To be honest, it seemed like people in the media made a hell of a lot more fuss about the Albom situation than fans did. To most fans, I don't think it made a hell of a lot of difference.

The team should refuse to work with a reporter or paper who cannot physically be there for an interview or press session.

Unrealistic. Find me the team at our level that can actually afford to do this, please.

I would rather see an AP sniped report that actually had a reporter physically present at an event.

I'd rather read a report from someone who had to work harder to actually do the job, whose work I am familiar with, and who is "on the beat" and thus has a vested interest in doing a good job. But that's just me. I guess we cancel each other out, then.

There have been MLS teams that have broadcast games on radio without actually being there (not to mention Fox Soccer Channel poaching a local broadcast and doing it from the studio) - does the audience really care? Did people really feel they were losing a lot listening to Dutch Reagan's recreations of Cubs games or the Mutual Game of the Day when they were all ticker-tape recreations? Maybe. But I don't think they think quite that deeply. They followed the game.

[Andy_B]

Is the original poster Oliver?

Andy

[aleaguer]

Didn't say "Mutant League Soccer," so I don't think so.

[Lanky134]

In a normal world, I wish everyone were like the Washington Post and provided away coverage or at least arranged for a stringer to do it.

There have been United games in the past on the West Coast, usually late in the season, where there was no coverage in the Post.

[monster]

There have been United games in the past on the West Coast, usually late in the season, where there was no coverage in the Post.
I should have said this season, where they have picked things up.

[JayRockers!]

All good points. I think I was trying to make a broader point that newspapers would be better served to have their people at an event to insure the accuracy in journalism that you don't really expect from the internet.

There have been MLS teams that have broadcast games on radio without actually being there (not to mention Fox Soccer Channel poaching a local broadcast and doing it from the studio) - does the audience really care?I think that someone watching a game in a studio, for broadcast either on TV or radio doesn't impart the level of journalism that the print edition of the local newspaper the next day should. If I'm watching a game on FSC and they are commentating on it, I don't expect them to be held to the same level of accuracy than the MLS Wrap show where the post-game reporting isn't backed up by a person on site or a press-kit style feed of post game interviews. Plenty of times Max Bretos says something during a game that I don't think has been corroborated, and I take it with a grain of salt. But if he did it during the "reporting" show, especially on a team he doesn't cover, I'd expect there to be video or him to identify sources.

Thx,

Jay!

[monster]

All good points. I think I was trying to make a broader point that newspapers would be better served to have their people at an event to insure the accuracy in journalism that you don't really expect from the internet.

I too think they are better served, but until AP starts really staffing games, this is something I can accept. I don't like it a ton, but I can accept it. At least they are honest about it.

[Sandon Mibut]

Quite frankly, though,Geordie is actually Screamin' A. Smith. Who knew?

[geordienation]

Geordie is actually Screamin' A. Smith. Who knew?


The Knicks . . . are tear-A-bul

Isiah Thomas . . . is tear-A-bul

How-EV-uh . . .

[Sandon Mibut]

You know who could be key to the Lakers? Slava Medvedenko, that's who! (This one is on a platter for ya)

[JayRockers!]

I too think they are better served, but until AP starts really staffing games, this is something I can accept. I don't like it a ton, but I can accept it. At least they are honest about it.
I don't pretend to know how the AP works, but I would assume that (for instance) the national paper network would pick up the local reporter's game report and tailor it as a general report, or they have the local reporter write up a general report as well. Or does the AP have to send a stringer to the game for them to have a report?

Thx,

Jay!

[monster]

I don't pretend to know how the AP works, but I would assume that (for instance) the national paper network would pick up the local reporter's game report and tailor it as a general report, or they have the local reporter write up a general report as well. Or does the AP have to send a stringer to the game for them to have a report?

Thx,

Jay!
For something like this - and it's been a while so others can correct me - they take the team's press release and/or the local newspaper report and write it up to go on the wire. Because of time constraints, the only really useable copy is probably from the press release.

I seriously doubt they pay for a stringer, but I could be wrong. I do know that when Iinterviewed for a desk job with a bureau, I was told I would have to rewrite sports press releases that the sports staffer did not get to.

[California Jack]

I've written to Dwyre about the lack of coverage of soccer but gotten no response. I try to send a comment about a story whenever it appears on the front page, to sort of give the impression that readers are really interested in soccer, but somehow its not catching on. The Gold Cup coverage actually wasn't that bad. But what is the LAT supposed to do? Its the English-language newspaper in a town where you could only watch the Gold Cup in Spanish. The LAT could plausibly say, we're not making the decision that English-speaking Angelenos (or Americans, for that matter) aren't interested in the Gold Cup; we're drawing this conclusion from the fact that corporate America wasn't going to sponsor it on English-language TV.

Its frustrating, but at least we have BS and other internet outlets, as well as FSC, Gol, Setanta (well I don't have Setanta), but the point is we are better off than we were 5-10 years ago, and most fans of a particular sport or most movie buffs, or most political junkies, aren't really relying on fishwrap as their primary source of news in the internet age.

I prefer to see the soccer glass as half full and filling.

But yeah, I admit, its a drag when you're offline and all you've got is dead tree, and there's half a column on soccer and six pages on college hoops.

[Beau Dure]

In a normal world, I wish everyone were like the Washington Post and provided away coverage or at least arranged for a stringer to do it. But this is better than canned AP copy with no quotes and no insight into the away team.

Does the Post always have Goff or a stringer? I haven't checked after West Coast games this year.

I have noticed a lot of teams' coaches on the phone with the paper back home after a game. Not ideal, but it seems to work.

I blogged the Super Bowl from my desk (see http://www.usatoday.com/sports/football/super/watch/blog.htm). For what I was doing, there was no point in my being there -- I needed to see the ads, replays and TV coverage, all of which were fair game for comments.

The world of quotes, though, is getting murky. Teams and federations often release quotes from players and coaches. Whenever a news organization has had a couple of people at an event, they would frequently trade quotes. In this day and age, that might not happen. Consider that a reporter was fired not too long ago for repeating quotes that had been printed elsewhere, even though the sources told him to use them. (At least one source was rather perplexed, saying he has often been misquoted and seen his complaints go unanswered, yet a reporter was fired for using quotes that he had verified as accurate!)

But I digress.

Anyway, this is the reality. We don't bat an eyelash when Univision's announcers make virtual leaps of 1,000 miles or so to do two games in a day, and we aren't puzzled when Tommy Smyth appears in the ESPNews studios 10 minutes after calling a game from Eindhoven. As high-definition becomes more widespread and allows viewers to see off-the-ball action along with clear replays, I'd expect this to happen more often.

As they say on South Park, it beats dealing with the airlines.

[Beau Dure]

For something like this - and it's been a while so others can correct me - they take the team's press release and/or the local newspaper report and write it up to go on the wire. Because of time constraints, the only really useable copy is probably from the press release.

I seriously doubt they pay for a stringer, but I could be wrong. I do know that when Iinterviewed for a desk job with a bureau, I was told I would have to rewrite sports press releases that the sports staffer did not get to.

Here in Washington, AP's Joseph White is at a lot of the games. Not sure how it works elsewhere, but what you describe is often true in many sports.

[monster]

Does the Post always have Goff or a stringer? I haven't checked after West Coast games this year.

I think this year it has been Steve, but I could be wrong. It hasn't always in the past though.