No way Seattle should get a team

[lfcli30]

You guys can't even get 30,000 to support our National team! Your attendance showing at the Gold Cup is not good. How the hell are you going to get 15k for a club match?

[Rocket]

I doubt US/Cuba would draw much higher in any other American city at the ticket prices they're charging.

Only a hardcore USMNT fan is going to pay $40+/ticket to watch the USA "B" team play in a meaningless tournament

[lfcli30]

I'm talking about the Canadian game today.

[Rocket]

Same comment applies.

Would you attend today's game if you had to pay $80+ to get a good seat and enjoy a beer or two at the game?

[P1brit]

You guys can't even get 30,000 to support our National team! Your attendance showing at the Gold Cup is not good. How the hell are you going to get 15k for a club match?

Thats a good croud for a national team game, the US doesn't sell out soldier field when they play England or fair much better when they play anywhere else. Cuba suck I wouldn't pay to see anyone play them.

[pupusa3000]

With the teams the Nats are playing against along with the prices they have to pay, it is a no-brainer why the Seattle crowds are the way they are. I think yuo have to play a BIG game there to really see what is happening. Now while it is attendance that attracts and not atmosphere, there was NO atmosphere at the game. Maybe a little towards the end, but it was pretty dull (the nats play as of late has to take credit too, but still ). What is the atmosphere like at a Sounders game? I have only seen pictures but I would imagine that it is like today's game except with less people.

[GMan Eric]

The Gold Cup attendances everywhere are usually pretty poor, unless US is playing Mexico.

As for the atmosphere, those few of us who were trying to provide some were kicked out of our section by Qworst suck-urity -- even though the fans seated in the row behind us on the railing thought we were great and telling the cops and suck-urity to get lost.

[pugetsoundmls]

A few numbers.

1. 9,137
2. 19,793
3. 9,088

Given these numbers, these cities don't deserve MLS teams. Let's see where they were played.

1. vs. Grenada, 6/13/04, Crew Stadium
2. vs. Panama, 10/13/04, RFK Stadium
3. vs. Jamaica, 11/17/04, Crew Stadium

Whoops. Those were in MLS cities. The above were earlier round WCQs in Columbus and DC. I don't hear anyone saying Columbus and DC don't deserve MLS clubs. I'm not going to look any further back for more of what some would consider so so attendance figures.

You guys can't even get 30,000 to support our National team!

For fun, match the crowd, location and event

1. 43,651
2. 38,534
3. 17,819
4. 15,831




1. vs. Russia, 1/29/04, Kingdome (friendly)
2. vs. Honduras, 3/2/02, Safeco Field (friendly)
3. vs. Venezuela (late replacement for Japan), 3/29/03, Qwest Field (friendly)
4. vs. Cuba, 7/7/05, Qwest Field (Gold Cup)

As you can see, the Nats don't grace us with their presence as much as we'd like. And none of the above are for a game that really counts, ie WCQs. We can give reasons like weather, cost, promotion, talent level on the field and so on that may influence a crowd, but they would apply to all cities anyway. I don't think the above numbers are too bad for a non MLS city. Others may disagree.

How the hell are you going to get 15k for a club match?

1. 18,324

I assume you mean for a top level club. That's the avg. attendance for the 10 yrs the Sounders were last in D1, the NASL. That number is roughly 6,000 above the league avg. over those ten years. When we were in D3 as FC Seattle and now again as the Sounders in the USL D1 (A-League), the numbers aren't as great.

If prognosticators are going to focus on one, or a few, attendance numbers, and suggest that indicates MLS attendance patterns, it's folly. We all know that. If you even want to try, then I suggest using every attendance measure in a candidate city's portfolio: current club, past clubs, US or foreign Nats/club friendlies and anything else I can't think of. We all know that when it comes time for MLS expansion, all that matters is if just one person in these crowds has the wealth to buy and sustain a franchise in the league.

But don't fear, Seattle is not an MLS expansion candidate city.

sources:
http://www.ussoccer.com/teams/national_teams.sps
http://www.kenn.com/sports/

[sounderfan]

A few numbers.

1. 9,137
2. 19,793
3. 9,088

Given these numbers, these cities don't deserve MLS teams. Let's see where they were played.

1. vs. Grenada, 6/13/04, Crew Stadium
2. vs. Panama, 10/13/04, RFK Stadium
3. vs. Jamaica, 11/17/04, Crew Stadium

Whoops. Those were in MLS cities. The above were earlier round WCQs in Columbus and DC. I don't hear anyone saying Columbus and DC don't deserve MLS clubs. I'm not going to look any further back for more of what some would consider so so attendance figures.



For fun, match the crowd, location and event

1. 43,651
2. 38,534
3. 17,819
4. 15,831




1. vs. Russia, 1/29/04, Kingdome (friendly)
2. vs. Honduras, 3/2/02, Safeco Field (friendly)
3. vs. Venezuela (late replacement for Japan), 3/29/03, Qwest Field (friendly)
4. vs. Cuba, 7/7/05, Qwest Field (Gold Cup)

As you can see, the Nats don't grace us with their presence as much as we'd like. And none of the above are for a game that really counts, ie WCQs. We can give reasons like weather, cost, promotion, talent level on the field and so on that may influence a crowd, but they would apply to all cities anyway. I don't think the above numbers are too bad for a non MLS city. Others may disagree.



1. 18,324

I assume you mean for a top level club. That's the avg. attendance for the 10 yrs the Sounders were last in D1, the NASL. That number is roughly 6,000 above the league avg. over those ten years. When we were in D3 as FC Seattle and now again as the Sounders in the USL D1 (A-League), the numbers aren't as great.

If prognosticators are going to focus on one, or a few, attendance numbers, and suggest that indicates MLS attendance patterns, it's folly. We all know that. If you even want to try, then I suggest using every attendance measure in a candidate city's portfolio: current club, past clubs, US or foreign Nats/club friendlies and anything else I can't think of. We all know that when it comes time for MLS expansion, all that matters is if just one person in these crowds has the wealth to buy and sustain a franchise in the league.

But don't fear, Seattle is not an MLS expansion candidate city.

sources:
http://www.ussoccer.com/teams/national_teams.sps
http://www.kenn.com/sports/


Thanks for the great post.

Now hopefully we can all move on and support the club we've got.
http://www.SeattleSounders.net
(Until and even IF something "higher" comes along).

Until then, might I suggest everyone focus on PORTLAND as the likely MLS candidate from the Northwest? Why should Seattle be the only ones to suffer? ;)

[Freddy Garcia Lives]

As it looks more and more like I'm moving in 10 months to Seattle, I hope for good sucess. But crappy, overpriced, slightly better than friendly games against the same competition doesn't get me going either. I couldn't make the WCQ games in Columbus until this Mexico game coming up. But it was hard to rally luke warm fans to go see Jamaica in what was little more than a friendly in October last year. And Grenada (is that a country?) 'nough said. As much as I want Seattle to have a team, I love what has happened in SLC. I was there this last weekend. Front and center sports page stories three days in a row, sports talk radio, and good gate reciepts. IF Portland can do that, lets get them in first and hope we whoop there a.. well you know, every friendly and hopefully US Open Cup chance we get.

Anyone with any good info on Monroe let me know (think that is where I'm headed).

[suppitty]

The problem I saw, more than anything, was how dead the atmosphere was at Qwest even with a good number of people in the stands for the Canada game. After seeing the lack of atmosphere with a good-sized crowd, I think it is necessary that Seattle have an SSS, even if they do play rent-free at Qwest.

[John L]

Correcto-Mundo

15K is rather dim - This was Canada on a Saturday afternoon -

Right now the only things Seattle has in its favor is (temporarily) rent-free Qwest until a SSS can be built (which appears NOT to be a given)

And a well-supported USL team

hmmmm

Rochester is way ahead of Seattle here

[sounderfan]

Correcto-Mundo

15K is rather dim - This was Canada on a Saturday afternoon -

Right now the only things Seattle has in its favor is (temporarily) rent-free Qwest until a SSS can be built (which appears NOT to be a given)

And a well-supported USL team

hmmmm

Rochester is way ahead of Seattle here

EXACTLY!

Seattle OUT of the mix, NOW!
I hereby withdraw our fair city from EVER having to be mentioned by Don Garber EVER again!

It's Portland's turn to get their name dropped for the next decade!

[GMan Eric]

The problem I saw, more than anything, was how dead the atmosphere was at Qwest even with a good number of people in the stands for the Canada game. After seeing the lack of atmosphere with a good-sized crowd, I think it is necessary that Seattle have an SSS, even if they do play rent-free at Qwest.

The main problem atmosphere-wise is that anyone who stands and sings is harassed to death and/or kicked out by the suck-urity at Qwest.

There was a group of ECS and Timbers Army (together? really!) who got kicked out of our section midway through the second half... and I darn near got the business end of a cop's stick for the offense of asking him 1) who's complaining and 2) what language or behavior is "offensive" enough to get moved?

Plus I was getting harassed as hell by the same suck-urity for having a drum in there (which after a few minutes apparently passed inspection as I came in the gate to begin with) -- which I just ignored and kept beating the living s**t out of it ;)

And all this with a row of guys sitting on the railing behind us telling the cops and suck-urity to get lost and leave us alone.

We generally don't have a problem with the security who are regulars at Sounders games, but these asswipes clearly don't have a clue or really want to ensure there's no more big international matches at Qwest. I for one wouldn't mind never seeing another USA game here.

[GMan Eric]

Anyone with any good info on Monroe let me know (think that is where I'm headed).

I live pretty close to Monroe so PM me if you need info.

[Billibong]

Can you guys help me out? I heard that there is a company in Portland making a run at team for 2008 or something. Has anyone heard of this?

[j66j66]

Can you guys help me out? I heard that there is a company in Portland making a run at team for 2008 or something. Has anyone heard of this?

various fly-by-night investing groups have blown through town saying they would bring MLS to portland one way or another, but they all end up being a lot more light than heat when it comes down to brass tacks (are there any other cliches i can work in here?). The last group was One Wolf Soccer, who wanted to back a team associated with a mexican club (IIRC, fuzzy on the details) not named the Timbers, which were the main two deal-breakers for me personally, never mind the lack of local presence or solutions for dealing with baseball.

Talk Timbers thread (http://www.soccercityusa.com/cgi-bin/yabb/YaBB.pl?num=1111639772) on one wolf. no news on any MLS movements has happened since march, really. Portland's situation remains the same: no investor, no solution for the shared stadium situation.

[uclacarlos]

So should NE have its franchise revoked given last night's pathetic attendance vs. a decent national team?

[sounderfan]

So should NE have its franchise revoked given last night's pathetic attendance vs. a decent national team?

Move the Revolution to Seattle, NOW! ;)

[RHMCW]

Move the Revolution to Seattle, NOW! ;)


I see the wink, but I would hate to see any MLS team move.

1) MLS has to appear stable, whether it is or is not. Teams moving around may give the impression that the league is in trouble. In the NFL a team moving is a sign that there is a higher bidder somewhere. In MLS it is a sign of a desperation move.

2) It would set bad precedent. Not that I am holding my breath for the league to be so big and so wealthy that they can blackmail communities. However, if the league does get to that point, I want a solid history of teams staying loyal to their localities.

3) It is unlikely that a city that has lost a team would fight to gain a new one. It is nice to see that Houston and Clevland regained teams after losing them. I just do not see it happening in MLS.