What to do with CSKA Moscow?

[Excape Goat]

What to do with CSKA Moscow?

Link (http://sports.yahoo.com/sow/news;_ylc=X3oDMTBpYnF0a2UxBF9TAzk1ODYzNTkwBHNlYwN0bQ--?slug=reu-uefacskakeeper&prov=reuters&type=lgns)

1) If Inter Milan got a small punishment, then CSKA Moscow should not get a huge punishment. Or else it would seem unfair. Furthermore, the people are going to say that UEFA is favoring Italian clubs. Parma is an Italian club too. CSKA Moscow is not a rich club liked Inter milan. So the rich clubs got away with it, but the poor clubs could not. There will be conspiracies on and on.

2) However, this incident in Moscow was the second one in European games and was only about a month away from the Inter Milan-AC Milan CL match. If UEFA does not send a big message, the problem will become bigger.

I think UEFA is in a no-win situation.

[lanman]

I'm surprised this hasn't been mentioned earlier after the fuss over Inter. To be honest I think that the game should be awarded to Parma as they were forced into subsituting their keeper. CSKA should also be hit with a punishment similar to Inter, but perhaps a game or two less as they did not force the abandonment of hte game.

[AFCA]

UEFA should be fair, which is a lot more important than what message they might send.

So, whatever happens.... CSKA should play the final. Any other outcome is unacceptable.

However, I don't really understand the unprovoked pelting of opposition players with flares and stuff. If there's one way to shoot your club and yourself in the foot without gaining anything from it... this is it.

EDIT: forgot about Parma's keeper being subbed... then again... did he need to be subbed?

I still feel CSKA should play the final. Don't punish the entire club and it's following for a silly action by one, probably 16 year old dumbass.

[laudrup]

I'm sorry for an CSKA fans, but if Inter lost their game 3-0, so should CSKA. No matter how much they clobbered Parma. If Inter Milan had been beating Milan 10-0 at the time of the incicent, they still would've lost the game. CSKA can get a lighter sentence (maybe 1-2 home games with no crowd) because, unlike Inter, they don't have a history of precedents. But anything the crowd does that affects players to the point of having to make substitutions potentially affects the end result. Plus, flares are FORBIDDEN in soccer stadiums,even if they are pretty.

Then again, I think CSKA is indirectly Abramovich's (that's where he got Jarosik from, right? And he's signed young south americans - Carvalho, Ferreyra - to see if they're good enough for Chelsea in a coupla years), so I am sure that he, in his infinite 'wisdom' can 'find' a way around this.

[Excape Goat]

EDIT: forgot about Parma's keeper being subbed... then again... did he need to be subbed?



He was shaken if not injuried. If I am coaching Parma, I would not want a shaken keeper on the field. Goalkeeping is also a mind game. Frey is a better keeper anyway. The team is affected by the incident.

But if I am running UEFA, I would still let CSKA Moscow in the final. I would not allow conspiracy theories.

[afgrijselijkheid]

I'm surprised this hasn't been mentioned earlier after the fuss over Inter.

To be honest I think that the game should be awarded to Parma as they were forced into subsituting their keeper.


1- inter has had repeated problems, to my knowledge CSKA has not

2- nonsense

if they award the final to parma, this will just be further proof that the so-called big clubs and leagues get preferential treatment

[afgrijselijkheid]

If Inter Milan had been beating Milan 10-0 at the time of the incicent, they still would've lost the game.

Then again, I think CSKA is indirectly Abramovich's (that's where he got Jarosik from, right? And he's signed young south americans - Carvalho, Ferreyra - to see if they're good enough for Chelsea in a coupla years), so I am sure that he, in his infinite 'wisdom' can 'find' a way around this.


1- you're kidding right? this is your argument?

2- oh good grief...

[lanman]

I'm sorry for an CSKA fans, but if Inter lost their game 3-0, so should CSKA.

The Inter game was abadoned and they had no option but to award the game to Milan. This game was actually played to a conclusion.


He was shaken if not injuried. If I am coaching Parma, I would not want a shaken keeper on the field. Goalkeeping is also a mind game. Frey is a better keeper anyway. The team is affected by the incident.

He suffered a minor concussion, resulting in dizziness.


2- nonsense

if they award the final to parma, this will just be further proof that the so-called big clubs and leagues get preferential treatment.

The game was affected by the use of the substitution. Were Parma to have had an extra sub available into the second half it could have meant the game ended differently.
This isn't a case of preferential treatment for clubs from the larger associations, but about hitting offending teams whatever association they represent.


I still feel CSKA should play the final. Don't punish the entire club and it's following for a silly action by one, probably 16 year old dumbass.

Under UEFA rules, clubs are responsible for the conduct of their fans within the stadium. Given what had happened at the San Siro the fact that CSKA allowed flares into the ground means they should accept total responsibility for this incident.

[laudrup]

1- you're kidding right? this is your argument?

2- oh good grief...

Yes this is my argument

1) The result of the game before or after some ************** hits a player with a flare should not be taken into account if the club is found guilty. And, as someone pointed out, the clubs ARE responsible for stadium security, it's not just some brainless 16 year old, as some people justify.

2) Abramovich can probably find more leverage against a ruling than most other clubs in Europe.

If you feel than any of these statements are false, please enlighten me.

And for preferential treatment, CSKA nowadays has more money (parma is broke), a better team (Parma is this close to relegation) and better players. Now, if it's history you're talking...

[sardus_pater]

UEFA should be fair, which is a lot more important than what message they might send.

So, whatever happens.... CSKA should play the final. Any other outcome is unacceptable.

However, I don't really understand the unprovoked pelting of opposition players with flares and stuff. If there's one way to shoot your club and yourself in the foot without gaining anything from it... this is it.

EDIT: forgot about Parma's keeper being subbed... then again... did he need to be subbed?

I still feel CSKA should play the final. Don't punish the entire club and it's following for a silly action by one, probably 16 year old dumbass.

Agree. And the Inter - Milan incidents were reiterated, the game was suspended.

[gaijin]

Don't worry - CSKA can't get a stadium ban - they don't have a ********ing stadium.

lol. :D

They have to use ours....

I would suggest playing it behind closed doors, but then that would just be like a regular home match for them. lol.

[glennaldo_sf]

I wouldn't be too surprised if UEFA were to award the tie to Parma. And this thing about UEFA "favoring" Italian clubs is pretty silly - didn't they hand both Inter Milan and even more severly, Roma fines, stadium bans, plus 3-0 defeats for their subsequent results? I say CSKA should be dealt with in a similar manner. A simple solution to this would be .... just BAN FLARES from football matches! But not too many people seem to be interested in this - it's only been what, twice in one month :rolleyes:. Seriously though, I think that if teams are going to allow their supporters to bring flares into stadiums than the teams should be held accountable for what happens in their own stadiums. Don't allow your fans (or opposing fans for that matter) to brig them into the your stadium or else face the consequences.

[gaijin]

I wouldn't be too surprised if UEFA were to award the tie to Parma. And this thing about UEFA "favoring" Italian clubs is pretty silly - didn't they hand both Inter Milan and even more severly, Roma fines, stadium bans, plus 3-0 defeats for their subsequent results? I say CSKA should be dealt with in a similar manner. A simple solution to this would be .... just BAN FLARES from football matches! But not too many people seem to be interested in this - it's only been what, twice in one month :rolleyes:. Seriously though, I think that if teams are going to allow their supporters to bring flares into stadiums than the teams should be held accountable for what happens in their own stadiums. Don't allow your fans (or opposing fans for that matter) to brig them into the your stadium or else face the consequences.

Nah, wouldn't happen.

Not this close to the final. Both the Inter and Roma games were abandoned. It is the ref's perogative to see if the game is potentially dangerous and if the incident warranted a match abandoment.

Clearly in this case, it wasn't.

Russian stadiums would allow you to bring in a tactical assault rifle if need be, but they won't fit through the turnstiles. :rolleyes:

I've got nothing wrong with fans lighting flares, as long as they do it safely. Nothing better watching the Loko fans behind the goal, light up as a goal goes in. :)

The thing is, this wasn't CSKA's stadium - they don't have one, so they used ours. So technically either we are accountable for providing a crap sporting arena, or it is the idiotic Konye fans who threw s***t.

I have to go with the stupid Konye fans on this one...they are accountable. We are forced to let this scum into our ground, because they are so pathetic they can't build one (even with their ill gotten Abramovich cash)

If it was up to me, I would make em play in the only place fit to house such fans and club - a ********ing sewer. So they can stay where they came from.

[laudrup]

just BAN FLARES

They already are banned.

That's why I think CSKA should be heavily punished. Not because a player got hit, hell, some people throw their cell phones at players and you can't ban cell phones from stadiums, but because a player got hit by a flare that CSKA should have made sure that was NOT there in the first place.

[KopThat!]

Nothing. Just a slap on the wrist and a warning for it to not happen again.....or else.

[GoodDead]

I'm surprised this hasn't been mentioned earlier after the fuss over Inter. To be honest I think that the game should be awarded to Parma as they were forced into subsituting their keeper. CSKA should also be hit with a punishment similar to Inter, but perhaps a game or two less as they did not force the abandonment of hte game.

Parma were already losing 1-0 (cause of the flair) it's not like they scored to make it seem like the goalie was that critical to the game.

Either way 1 flair hitting the goalie is more fluke then intent to injure. What happened to Dida seemed more like intent to cause harm as 100 flairs came down

[AFCA]

The Inter game was abadoned and they had no option but to award the game to Milan. This game was actually played to a conclusion.




He suffered a minor concussion, resulting in dizziness.




The game was affected by the use of the substitution. Were Parma to have had an extra sub available into the second half it could have meant the game ended differently.
This isn't a case of preferential treatment for clubs from the larger associations, but about hitting offending teams whatever association they represent.




Under UEFA rules, clubs are responsible for the conduct of their fans within the stadium. Given what had happened at the San Siro the fact that CSKA allowed flares into the ground means they should accept total responsibility for this incident.


All this nonsense about 'allowing flares into the stadium'.... the fact that they are there doesn't mean anybody 'allowed' them in. There is no way you can totally ban them from being brought in.

[Excape Goat]

Parma were already losing 1-0 (cause of the flair) it's not like they scored to make it seem like the goalie was that critical to the game.

Either way 1 flair hitting the goalie is more fluke then intent to injure. What happened to Dida seemed more like intent to cause harm as 100 flairs came down

CSKA Moscow and Parma went goalless in the 1st leg. CSKA Moscow was only leading 1-0 when Bucci was hit by flares. At that point. Parma only need a single away goal to go through. That incident gave CSKA Moscow an psychological advantage over Parma. Anyone in here can honestly say that they are not afraid of being hit by flares. The Parma players must be thinking about the incident throughout the game. The scoreline might be different if the incident did not happen.

Inter-AC Milan: AC Milan won the first leg 2-0. They were leading 1-0 on the 2nd leg(or 3-0 by aggregate) when the incident happened. Inter Milan needs to score 4 goals in 15 minutes to beat AC Milan. If nothing happened for the rest of the match, it is unlikely that Inter Milan can overturn the scoreline.

I agreed with you that the Inter Milan fans intended to harm Dida and the CSLA Moscow one was probably more "fluke". However, that one "fluke" probably changed the outcome of the game. CSKA Moscow should not be given the advantage.

[Forza Moskva]

It's Parma's own fault for not winning or even scoring at home, get over it. What's done is done.

[Forza Moskva]

PS - the result is a fine and a 2 match stadium ban, or so it says on UEFA.com, the protest was rejected.