Steven C and Eric W agree that USA soccer can improve

[Keep parents away]

I absolutely love World Soccer Weekly on Sirius Radio. The two hosts Steven Cohen and Nick Geber are funny and knowledgeable. All week they have discussed American soccer with writers, general managers, and MLS coaches yet the discussions are not always positive, they discuss warts and all. I have been so spell bound that I have switched my radio from my usual right wing talk radio to World Soccer Weekly. The MLS and the USSF should embrace these two innovators with open arms since they are making American futbol compelling and fun.

One subject discussed on World Soccer Weekly on a daily basis is the fact that soccer in the United States is a very white, suburban sport. Though some futbol junkies on Big Soccer have refuted that statement by writing that the National Team is never all white and in fact the team on Wednesday was made up with 6 whites, 3 African Americans, a Latino, and a native Hawaiian. The team was a melting pot like the Dutch, English, or French national teams.

However, the fact is Steven is right. White parents pay white coaches large fees to teach suburbanite kids to play soccer. Some leagues do not even allow winners or losers. The killer instinct and skill to be a great footballer is not taught by a coach on perfectly manicured fields. It is learned on dusty fields and black tops where no parents/coaches are around to organize the game. It is when kids play to keep the field like all basketball courts across the country. If you lose the game to 3, you might as well go home because there are three teams waiting to take your place. These are the games where kids perfect moves, develop imagination and where fights are always on the cusp of happening. Where there is no Mom or Dad to organize the game.

Eric Wynaldo once wrote that if Maradonna had grown up in Phoenix some ODP coach would have ruined him by forcing him to use his right foot.

Wynaldo, one of the great American soccer players, gets it. In an interview he said, “… I do not believe in the ODP system…I don’t believe in picking the players who can afford this game at the club level. I have gone a different route (he has a club in California). I have a fully funded program…I got 5 scouts and told them to find the best 20 players they could find. I don’t care what their names are. I don’t care what their ethnic backgrounds are…we’ve had games where we have scrimmaged the assemblance of its Under-15 national team and we beat them 5 nothing and that ruffled some feathers.”

Wynaldo was then asked whether it was totally fair looking at how well the USA has done in the under 17 and under -20 world cups.

He answered by saying, “ … but I want to push the envelope… to make it better…even with all the talent coming out of our club systems I still think it is tainted. There are kids out there who don’t have the money to play in the club system and at the age of 14 or 15 make bad choices… They are so many of them … that if they were nurtured and kept involved with the game, they would make a difference. I’ll say with out hesitation that in my area I have met two 15 year olds who are…the best soccer players I have ever seen at that age and no one knows who they are…Look in Oxnard … the best game in town is the Hispanic men’s league and you see all these ex-players from Atlas, Chivas, and Guadalajara and they are playing with these 14 and 15 year old kids who are playing in this men’s league and they are the best players on the field. And if you don’t find them and tell them there is something out there … they are going to be working and getting drunk at the age of 25 instead of playing for Real Madrid.”

Whether Eric Wynaldo is exaggerating or not, it seems likely that he is not far from the truth. The United States Hispanic population is roughly the same size as Colombia, Argentina, or Spain. There probably are players in the dusty soccer fields of Texas and California that are being ignored by our current system. I can imagine that Bruce Arena and Don Garber would not mind having three 15 year old Freddy Adus playing in the MLS instead of one.

The soccer community needs to take notice that there is a need for a different approach to cultivating talent in the United States. Whether it is the MLS developing young talent at after school locations or some entrepreneur developing academies for the kids being left out of the current system who may or may not be able to afford to pay to play. If the United States wants to become the next Brazil in world futbal, it may take some people like Steven Cohen, Nick Geber, and Eric Wynaldo shouting from the bully pulpit to change the status quo. I just hope the powers that be open their ears.

[Joel Kennedy]

i have sirius but haven't found the show...when is it on? thnx

[Keep parents away]

11:00AM to 1:00 on channel 122 Mon-Friday

[Casper]

I'd prefer if MLS were good enough that a 15 year-old Freddy Adu couldn't make a team, but that's not necessarily happening.

In my life outside the ODP system (being of English descent, playing for US National Youth Teams was not of interest to me), I was on club teams that beat national teams at least four times. I admire Wynalda's (please note the spelling, by the way) commitment to developing talent, and I believe he will help develop players if he keeps it up. I also agree that ODP is less than ideal. However, ODP also does a lot to help identify lots of good players. Developing options that don't cost so much to the player and/or their parents would be a positive development, but if the player or their family isn't paying for it, someone has to.

To me, that's where we're really hitting the wall. Running an academy with 50 or 100 players takes a budget. Even if you make it free to a poor Mexican-American teenager, that kid and his family have to figure out how to get him to practice constantly, which can be a financial burden all its own.

So, inadequate training of players with limited financial resources persists. Simply thinking about it a different way doesn't bring the financial resources to bear to make it happen. In Wynalda's case with his own efforts, he can make things happen because he works hard and he's Eric Freakin' Wynalda. I've coached at a lot of camps where other famous players use their star power to make some good training things happen. But even someone committed to the cause who's a local hero (Tab Ramos is a great example) can only do so much for the kid who can't afford paid clinics. If Tab were ridculously wealthy, maybe he could grant a scholarship to every kid in north Jersey shows promise and isn't a wealthy suburbanite, but running something like this is expensive in the real world.

[Pmoliu]

The killer instinct and skill to be a great footballer is not taught by a coach on perfectly manicured fields. It is learned on dusty fields and black tops where no parents/coaches are around to organize the game. It is when kids play to keep the field like all basketball courts across the country. If you lose the game to 3, you might as well go home because there are three teams waiting to take your place. These are the games where kids perfect moves, develop imagination and where fights are always on the cusp of happening. Where there is no Mom or Dad to organize the game.


Do the fields have to be dusty?

For the record, I agree that the game is best learned by playing, but let's dispel the romantic notions of how you learn the game. We can't all grow up playing soccer with oranges in the streets in Trinidad.

Paul

[DutchFootballRulez]

Myself being mostly ignorant to the ODP system. Wonder, why Public School Football isn't A.) An option B.) Considered as the option.

Obviously, money is still the same issue. Which is why I wonder about the ODP system. Yes it finds very good players, but does it justify those that are excluded like Philipiakos?

[Ronaldo's Idol]

I'd prefer if MLS were good enough that a 15 year-old Freddy Adu couldn't make a team, but that's not necessarily happening.

In my life outside the ODP system (being of English descent, playing for US National Youth Teams was not of interest to me), I was on club teams that beat national teams at least four times. I admire Wynalda's (please note the spelling, by the way) commitment to developing talent, and I believe he will help develop players if he keeps it up. I also agree that ODP is less than ideal. However, ODP also does a lot to help identify lots of good players. Developing options that don't cost so much to the player and/or their parents would be a positive development, but if the player or their family isn't paying for it, someone has to.

To me, that's where we're really hitting the wall. Running an academy with 50 or 100 players takes a budget. Even if you make it free to a poor Mexican-American teenager, that kid and his family have to figure out how to get him to practice constantly, which can be a financial burden all its own.

So, inadequate training of players with limited financial resources persists. Simply thinking about it a different way doesn't bring the financial resources to bear to make it happen. In Wynalda's case with his own efforts, he can make things happen because he works hard and he's Eric Freakin' Wynalda. I've coached at a lot of camps where other famous players use their star power to make some good training things happen. But even someone committed to the cause who's a local hero (Tab Ramos is a great example) can only do so much for the kid who can't afford paid clinics. If Tab were ridculously wealthy, maybe he could grant a scholarship to every kid in north Jersey shows promise and isn't a wealthy suburbanite, but running something like this is expensive in the real world.



Great post.

I myself have gone through the ODP system and played in a regional camp (Region 1) so I know the system. It is a system that will miss players who don't, or can't, make the effort to expose themselves to it. That is, if you don't sign up and pay the fee, you won't get recognized, at least in New York State, where ODP is run via tryouts rather than scouts coming to club games. Even in the case where there are scouts, like in California, you still need to be on a good club team, and that just isn't so easy if you are poor and isolated.


I think the answer, a financially reasonable one, is for USSoccer to send out scouts to all the corners of the US, maybe amateur scouts getting paid just a little, to go check out the local leagues or even high level pickup games. The infrastructure is there, especially if they go through the US Youth Soccer system, which has lots of people from the top down and is divided and subdivided by state associations.

Send a scout to Oxnard, see how good these 15 year old kids really are, and if they are up to par, invite them into a camp, all expense paid, where they tryout for a week for the state ODP team (or drop the ODP name and just call it the state select team). Or, so make travel easier and cheaper, subdivide each state into multiple districts (which already exist) and just offer "scholarships" to the most promising players with financial need, and let the rich suburbian players pay for it by hiking fees a little bit.

Currently ODP does offer financial aid to players of need, but it is a somewhat lengthy process to actually get the money, and most players who are poor have no idea what ODP is or that it can be free.

The US has the infrastructure needed to mine the areas Wynalda is talking about, it just needs the initiative to go out and physically root out the diamonds in the rough. They are out there, you just need to identify them by the time they are 14 or 15 and get them into a structured, coached learning environment one way or another.

I think this is currently happening on some level, but is not nationwide. Just think about Eddie Johnson. A great example of a player who's talent was identified despite not having money for ODP.

[Ronaldo's Idol]

Myself being mostly ignorant to the ODP system. Wonder, why Public School Football isn't A.) An option B.) Considered as the option.

Obviously, money is still the same issue. Which is why I wonder about the ODP system. Yes it finds very good players, but does it justify those that are excluded like Philipiakos?


Philapakos wasn't excluded, he made the regional team, just wasn't picked for the National Team. He just didn't show well enough and wasn't picked, but he was not overlooked by ODP. Making the regional team means you've been identified as a top 80-100 player for your age, in the nation.

[DoctorD]

Searching out and identifying these types of players is a great idea. The NFL, NBA and MLB should do the same type of thing to identify budding athletes in their sports as well.

[Casper]

Searching out and identifying these types of players is a great idea. The NFL, NBA and MLB should do the same type of thing to identify budding athletes in their sports as well.
The real point is that they don't have to, because college basketball and football make so much money that there's a built in scouting system, and a program like Wynalda's would just be a little thing he does for bucks on the side.

[pweakland]

I have been so spell bound that I have switched my radio from my usual right wing talk radio to World Soccer Weekly.

if only we could get rush limbaugh to talk about soccer more...

[dude8]

here in az, the perception is that you are only good if you play for sereno soccer-in that sereno gets the exposure.
sereno also costs a lot of money-so if you are good and poor, you aren't going to play for sereno.
i agree, it is too bad that money should be an issue, but where is it not?


in my utopian soccer academy-
everything is free-we are sposored by adidas/nike/puma-the fields are spotless and relined daily-and we have hoards of cheering, peaceful parents politely clapping and cheering on their kids(now i went too far)-and the coaches let the players develop some instinct for the game on their own.

the current system is imperfect, sure, but how is eric suggesting we fix it?

[Keep parents away]

Do the fields have to be dusty?

For the record, I agree that the game is best learned by playing, but let's dispel the romantic notions of how you learn the game. We can't all grow up playing soccer with oranges in the streets in Trinidad.

Paul

The point is kids need to play soccer with out the guidance of coaches and not many middle class white soccer players are playing pick up futbol games in cul-de-sacs. They need to play more than two times a week when Mom drops them off at the local field. However, we do have 40 million hispanics who grew up with the game whose cousins, friends, and parents watch and play the games. We already have these people in the country. Eric Wynalda isn't saying that we need to grow these players. He's saying that in Southern California there are two players better than Freddy Adu. And no one knows of them. He is saying that we just need to nourish their development.

[Dave Marino-Nachison]

Philapakos wasn't excluded, he made the regional team, just wasn't picked for the National Team. He just didn't show well enough and wasn't picked, but he was not overlooked by ODP. Making the regional team means you've been identified as a top 80-100 player for your age, in the nation.

Thank you. I wish more people would get this distinction when they say "so-and-so was excluded." Philipakos made it further than an awful lot of players and regional team selection is no small achievement. At some point it's down to a coach's tastes when it comes to player selection.

It's also worth noting that in PP's case, if I recall correctly, he had a disappointing stint at St. John's before moving to American U. The coaches who might have seen him as an early college student probably wouldn't have seen him at his best as a result.

However, this is mostly OT and I'll drop it for now.

[Keep parents away]

[QUOTE=Dave Marino-Nachison]Thank you. I wish more people would get this distinction when they say "so-and-so was excluded." Philipakos made it further than an awful lot of players and regional team selection is no small achievement. At some point it's down to a coach's tastes when it comes to player selection.

Where did Clint Dempsey, Pat Noonan ,Cooper and Spector fit in the regional and national teams? They should all become solid pros here or in Europe.

[DrBobC]

I agree with steve and eric. I live in an extremely ethnically diverse area of chicago. We see kids from the caribbean, mexico, central america, africa, asia and eastern europe in the parks playing who have no organized training. They are able to play without parents or coahes squashing their creativity or telling them that competition is not important. Some of these kids are amazing and need to be discovered.

[drace768]

Where did Clint Dempsey, Pat Noonan ,Cooper and Spector fit in the regional and national teams? They should all become solid pros here or in Europe.
I agree with you, but your examples are not very good, Dempsey was on the U-20 team and I think U-17, Spector was enrolled an Bradenton and part of U-17's, and Cooper was on a Regional ODP team.

[DoctorD]

The real point is that they don't have to, because college basketball and football make so much money that there's a built in scouting system, and a program like Wynalda's would just be a little thing he does for bucks on the side.

So are we talking identification or development here? I am suggesting that the "Big three" set up academies for 10-15 year-olds just like we are suggesting soccer academies. This would get rid of the farce that is college football or basketball and train these young men to be professional athletes.

[Brad May]

Myself being mostly ignorant to the ODP system. Wonder, why Public School Football isn't A.) An option B.) Considered as the option.
Only because football competes with baseball, basketball, American football, volleyball, wrestling, swimmig, etc. as a school sport and is prioritized lower than all of those other by the schools. The school year is divided up into "seasons" for ech of the sports, and for example in my son's middle school (grades 6-8) the football season is only about 8 weeks including preseason training. The same problem exist with NCAA collegiate sports.

And because football isn't the most prestigious sport, middle and high school kids want to participate in the other sports as well, so even if the football season were longer the sport would lose kids to other sports if the seasons overlapped.

In most areas, the only way to really develop is in a competitive club where you are playing 9 months a year here in California, for example.

The previous posters really do an injustice to youth leagues. These are not "nobody wins" — those are recreational leagues! Recreational leagues are not the same as "comp" or "select" leagues.

The idea that coaches stifle creativity is hogwash also. Bad coaches stifle creativity, good coaches foster it and develop kids' skills faster than them picking it randomly in street games. All these white coaches teaching white kids does pretty well in the U-17 championships!

The biggest (not the only) problem I see with the ODP is it develops a small number of players. Not all players develop at the same rate, and players that will be excellent adult players often get dropped from the ODP selection process. What is enough talent for a national youth team is not enough to feed a domestic league.

MLS will really improve when it has a fully functional reserve league, with ties to youth clubs acting as feeders, and maybe the clubs will even have their own youth academies. Then there will be enough numbers of kids involved to keep the "late bloomers" in a professional development environment until they can realize their adult potential.

[Keep parents away]

The idea that coaches stifle creativity is hogwash also. Bad coaches stifle creativity, good coaches foster it and develop kids' skills faster than them picking it randomly in street games. All these white coaches teaching white kids does pretty well in the U-17 championships!

Ican agree with much you said but coming in 4th in the world cup is not good enough and Eric Wynalda thinks it can become much better by just working with left out kids in the country today.

By the way I find it interesting that we have very few players on our national team who can beat people on the dribble. Maybe American coaches do stifle creativity.