Bunkering

[JoeW]

I coach a boy's rec team. I've lost a couple of players to travel soccer, two others to redistricting and the new ones assigned to my team are very raw.

But I"m looking to be extremely defensive-oriented this season. Let me be more specific--I think we're going to bunker every game. Play compact, refuse to go forward in numbers, wait for the opposition to push forward so we can counter or at least play 2v2/2v3 with quick pushes down the field. I'm appalled at the idea b/c I've always coached teams where we push forward, we attack and give all players as many touches as they can. But I just don't have the talent on this side. Furthermore, most of the players don't have the quickness or individual defensive ability to make stops with a lot of space--they require numbers and tight space to help them be effective as defenders.

I'm not looking to get "results" here--I'm really trying to reduce the pain and suffering--keep the scores down and use the few skilled players we have to counter while allowing lots of defensive help for very limited ability defenders.

What advice can you give me about playing a defensively-oriented scheme?

[Elroy]

What advice can you give me about playing a defensively-oriented scheme?Have your forwards and mids challenge from behind the ball. If you don't pressure the ball, even the best bunker will fail.

[NHRef]

I think you are taking the wrong approach to a rec team. Teach the kids soccer skills and ball movement and control, forget about the score. You will get a few types of kids on a rec team:

- raw talent you need to move forward and grow so they are ready for more advanced travel/club teams.

- little talent but want to play for fun

- kids trying the game out.

The goal of a rec program is to 1) Keep kids interested and wanting to play the game 2) Kids that have the talent, get them ready for the next level 3) Teach the skills of the game to all 4) BIGGEST HAVE FUN.

Especially at a younger age, the kids need to learn the basics. Teach them ball control skills individuallly then as a team, then basic strategy. Do not pigeon hole the kids into a position, they all play everywhere, including keeper.

[uniteo]

just my opinion, but I think it'd be a lot more painful to be reigned in and lose than to be able to play and attack and lose by more.

[DUTCHVIZ]

Hi Joe, You are in a difficult position. Hopefully some of your opponents are in the same position with losing some talent.

I assume that you are playing 11v11.

One problem you might have is how to get the ball out of the back. If the players are as rough as you imply then it might help to keep your best player in a position to deliver the long ball. Starting the counter is a bigger problem then finishing it.

This link might have some ideas. http://www.bettersoccermorefun.com/dwtext/countera.htm

Good luck.

[blech]

although you don't indicate your age group, i'll join the chorus who question these tactics for a rec league team. perhaps if there are playoffs at the end of the season, you might adopt a system like this for those game(s). but for the entire season? i think it has the priorities wrong. keep in mind also that these kids are not stupid - they will understand why you are doing it (and why they've been relegated to a defense-only position) and take away an equally negative perception about their abilities.

personally, i'd be inclined to let the kids play more, even if it results in losses being by a greater margin. what would be better - little jonny spends the entire season standing with a group of other players 8-12 yards in front of the goal occasionally making a nice tackle, or he improves his skills and learns to trap and make an accurate 15 yard pass (some of the time)? sorry about the rant, but if he doesn't improve his skills this year because he plays in a system that says just to bunker, what's next year's coach going to do and how is the cycle ever going to be broken (other than the unfortunate response of he eventually quits because it's no fun "not playing" the game)?

while it's good to be proactive in trying to protect your players, i'd also shift some of the responsibility to the opposing coach - hopefully s/he has some compassion, understands that you have kids on your team, and can figure out ways to keep the score down!!! i've been on both sides of blowouts, and know when i am on the winning side that i take affirmative steps once it is clear that a game is going to get out of control to prevent my team from running up the score. if your league doesn't already encourage this type of etiquette/responsible coaching, it may be worth raising it with your commissioner (as well as with opposing coaches pre-game, especially once you get a few games into the season and they can see that you're not just crying wolf).

and, it may depend on their age, but in my experience, the coach and parents are often more upset about a loss than the players (once they get a soda, snack, ice cream, etc. after the game). so, difficult as it may be at times, don't lose sight of who this is for, and just recognize that the applause and commendations that you need to dole out after each game to pick up their spirits may be for "smaller" steps and achievements than your teams and players have experienced in the past.


that said, if your intent on going this route, some of the key things to stress to your defenders and midfielders will be:
- having more players behind the ball than the other side
- staying central first and foremost with your defense
- keeping pressure on your opponent in the midfield

if you truly bunker and just drop guys back into the box, you'll get hammered. the more you can do to disrupt your opponent in the midfield (without sacrificing your marking in the center), the better.

you'll obviously also want to work in practice on countering as well, hopefully having one or two fast and talented players, who will take advantage of the few opportunities that they get.

whichever way you go, GOOD LUCK!

[Cou5]

I coach a boy's rec team. I've lost a couple of players to travel soccer, two others to redistricting and the new ones assigned to my team are very raw.

But I"m looking to be extremely defensive-oriented this season. Let me be more specific--I think we're going to bunker every game. Play compact, refuse to go forward in numbers, wait for the opposition to push forward so we can counter or at least play 2v2/2v3 with quick pushes down the field. I'm appalled at the idea b/c I've always coached teams where we push forward, we attack and give all players as many touches as they can. But I just don't have the talent on this side. Furthermore, most of the players don't have the quickness or individual defensive ability to make stops with a lot of space--they require numbers and tight space to help them be effective as defenders.

I'm not looking to get "results" here--I'm really trying to reduce the pain and suffering--keep the scores down and use the few skilled players we have to counter while allowing lots of defensive help for very limited ability defenders.

What advice can you give me about playing a defensively-oriented scheme?

It's rec soccer for God's sake! The focus for these kids are to have fun and learn. Quit putting the emphasis on wins and losses. Take your time and teach these kids. (I'm not saying you aren't but the focus has to be on the kids and their enjoyment and development)

[Elroy]

I think that some of you are overeacting. The word " bunker " was used, and that is unfortunate, but I don't think that any coach wouldn't let his team go forward if given the opportunity. There is nothing wrong with teaching and playing good defense - especially if that is where your strength is. It is no fun to lose especially if it's big. You can teach anything you want, but your opponents will help determine your style and emphasis on a match by match basis.

I don't think that this guy is trying to hurt his kids and I don't think that the sky is falling either.

[blech]

I think that some of you are overeacting. The word " bunker " was used, and that is unfortunate, but I don't think that any coach wouldn't let his team go forward if given the opportunity. There is nothing wrong with teaching and playing good defense - especially if that is where your strength is. It is no fun to lose especially if it's big. You can teach anything you want, but your opponents will help determine your style and emphasis on a match by match basis.

I don't think that this guy is trying to hurt his kids and I don't think that the sky is falling either.

i assume this is directed at least in part at me. and i think it's a fair point, and as i noted there are a lot of things we don't know about the situation, starting with what age these kids are, to exactly what the coach had/has in mind. that said, i'll say it this way:

i do think there is something wrong with teaching and playing good defense if it becomes the emphasis and you are sacrificing the players development of their offensive skills.

at least to some basic level, it's easier to coach defense. and it's part of the game and should be done ... to some degree. but if you don't develop the skills now, it will never happen. and, as i noted, if these players are already behind others in the league, it's hard to see how/when the cycle every gets broken.

[JoeW]

I appreciate the comments and advice--even the critical ones. Just to add a little context...
--no, I'm not focusing on getting a win or a tie here.
--I agree that development of the players is important. More important than than wins or losses. But if the losses are too extreme, the kids give up. My second season coaching youth soccer, I had a rec team lose 23-1. We gave up a goal nearly every 2 minutes in that match. Almost half of that roster gave up playing soccer after that season.
--This is a U14 league. But b/c of luck of the draw, I missing all of my better players from last season and they've been replaced with 6 new kids, 4 of whom have never every played soccer--not even playground ball. At our first practice, we tried to end on a fun note by doing a finishing activity (who doesn't love putting a ball in the net?) and asked the kids to think of the last goal they scored and what they did to get that score. I got blank looks. It turns out that of all 14 kids on the roster, only 4 of them have ever scored goals in any kind of rec soccer game at ANY level (and only 2 of those players have scored any goals above the U8 level--one kid scored once and my son--a defender--has scored 3 times).
--I've always coached teams that go forward, play everyone on the roster equally, and give kids chances to play a range of different positions in games. I can honestly say that until this season, I've never (not even in the closing minutes of a close match) told my team to focus on defending, delaying play or even tried to man-mark a player out of the game to deny that attacker the ball. I've always figured that even in matches where my team was outmatched, that rec soccer is about skill building and exercise and that weaker teams can get lucky breaks.

I've coached a wide range of rec sides--two that went undefeated, one that was winless and a lot in between. But I've never coached a team that appears to have such a huge talent gap with the teams we'll face. Furthermore, b/c this is U14, I don't have any illusions that I can play 2 or 3 complete beginners at the same time and without them being exposed significantly. Nor can I put the beginners in limited roles to build their confidence (like I might do if it was U8 or U9 ball). In short, I totally agree with the philosophy of it being rec soccer, not looking for results, focusing on skill building, growing the players. But in my experience, this is a rare situation--one I've never encountered before. And I'm grasping at straws here to try and keep the losses from being morale crushers.

[BTFOOM]

I appreciate the comments and advice--even the critical ones. Just to add a little context...
--no, I'm not focusing on getting a win or a tie here.
--I agree that development of the players is important. More important than than wins or losses. But if the losses are too extreme, the kids give up. My second season coaching youth soccer, I had a rec team lose 23-1. We gave up a goal nearly every 2 minutes in that match. Almost half of that roster gave up playing soccer after that season.

In my opinion, this type of thing is criminal. That coach should be banned pending some type of discussion as to why that is bad for BOTH teams.


--This is a U14 league. But b/c of luck of the draw, I missing all of my better players from last season and they've been replaced with 6 new kids, 4 of whom have never every played soccer--not even playground ball. At our first practice, we tried to end on a fun note by doing a finishing activity (who doesn't love putting a ball in the net?) and asked the kids to think of the last goal they scored and what they did to get that score. I got blank looks. It turns out that of all 14 kids on the roster, only 4 of them have ever scored goals in any kind of rec soccer game at ANY level (and only 2 of those players have scored any goals above the U8 level--one kid scored once and my son--a defender--has scored 3 times).
--I've always coached teams that go forward, play everyone on the roster equally, and give kids chances to play a range of different positions in games. I can honestly say that until this season, I've never (not even in the closing minutes of a close match) told my team to focus on defending, delaying play or even tried to man-mark a player out of the game to deny that attacker the ball. I've always figured that even in matches where my team was outmatched, that rec soccer is about skill building and exercise and that weaker teams can get lucky breaks.

I've coached a wide range of rec sides--two that went undefeated, one that was winless and a lot in between. But I've never coached a team that appears to have such a huge talent gap with the teams we'll face. Furthermore, b/c this is U14, I don't have any illusions that I can play 2 or 3 complete beginners at the same time and without them being exposed significantly. Nor can I put the beginners in limited roles to build their confidence (like I might do if it was U8 or U9 ball). In short, I totally agree with the philosophy of it being rec soccer, not looking for results, focusing on skill building, growing the players. But in my experience, this is a rare situation--one I've never encountered before. And I'm grasping at straws here to try and keep the losses from being morale crushers.

I can sympathize with your plight. My suggestion: during the game, have the kids try certain skills/ideas. For example, try to string three passes, beat one player from the other team, etc. Talk to the kids and be honest with them. They are 13 and old enough to be able to see what you are up against. Explain that you want to focus on getting better each week and don't worry about the score. If this is a true rec league, talk to the other coaches (or the commissioner if you aren't comfortable talking to them) and tell them just what you have told us here. Any good rec coach would work with their players to keep the games competetive and fun. Lastly, try to have something fun associated with practice or games each week. I'm always amazed how far slurpees/ice cream/hot dogs etc go with 13 year old boys.

Good luck.

[BC_Ref]

In my opinion, this type of thing is criminal. That coach should be banned pending some type of discussion as to why that is bad for BOTH teams.



I agree that any score this high is unjust. As a ref, I'll suggest that a coach try to throttle back his players if I'm dealing with a youth game below the top division. Only had to do it twice - one coach was just too wrapped up in actually winning (they were weak team that rarely won themselves) to realize what he was doing, and the other had already started to do this just in a very subtle manner (very well done - the other team couldn't easily spot the change). Unfortunately, if the team piling up the goals doesn't back off, all a ref can do is clamp down on the game to avoid retailiation and write-up a report.