milan vs Man U [R]

[rossoneri_22]

Except for Scholes and Fortunes missed sitters in the first leg, Giggs hitting the post today and oh, if it hadn't been for Carroll's mistake it would have only been 1-0 over the two legs.

Funny definition of dominance that is... :rolleyes:

2-0 is the definition of dominance.
No shots on target in the 2nd leg is the definition of dominance.

Just admit that Milan were the better team over the two legs and fully deserved their place in the quarter finals.

[Prenn]

2-0 is the definition of dominance.
No shots on target in the 2nd leg is the definition of dominance.

Just admit that Milan were the better team over the two legs and fully deserved their place in the quarter finals.

Oh Milan were better over the two legs but were far from dominant. A misplaced shot here and a goalkeeping error there and it's United going though. Dominance is Lyon Vs Werder Bremen. Not beating Manchester United over two legs by the smallest of margins.

[gumbacicc]

While I would not say that Milan dominated, they definitely controlled both legs and are clearly a better side than United.

[angulo]

While I would not say that Milan dominated, they definitely controlled both legs and are clearly a better side than United.

yes milan WAs better, and their superb players are better!

[sinner78]

Roy carrolls gift from the first game was the difference .
ManYoo had to throw bodies forward in the 2nd half and gamble to get the tie level .This was when milan had more space to counter attack and they bagged a breakaway goal.
If the first game had been 0-0 I could have seen this tie going all the way to penalties.

[gumbacicc]

but it was not 0-0. milan managed a goal and win both home and away. they had the best of play over both legs. nothing to even talk about here. no debate at all. i think most united fans would agree.

[ManUTX]

Unfortunately, it did seem as if Milan dominated the second half. I did not get to watch the game but listened to it on internet radio, the only real mention of Ruud and Rooney in the second half came near the end of the game. It seemed that Milan took control in the second half......I hate to say it, but Milan threaded us all match.

[paulocesar]

I am just glad that we don't have to hear about Juve and 1999 any more! Sheessh...its as if there was going to be a time warp or something!?!

[cotilita]

Milan did simply great: won, won and won fairly!!! What else can be asked!!! It's extremely nice to see them advance to the next phase.
Go MILAN!!!!
(And by the way: Maldini rocks!! Let's wait and see what happens to what's his name Ronaldo when he hits Paolo's age.)
;)

[BocaFan]

So you're claiming Man U didn't look more likely to score after Rooney and Ruud paired up?

Geez, was that the first United game you ever watched? United usually look more likely to score in the last 20 minutes of a game, when they're desperate to score. And also CP being down to 10 man just may have been a factor too. :cool:


And yet you would have been happier putting Saha on the pitch ahead of Ruud? The same Saha who has managed a whole ten minutes on the pitch in the last month? Yeah - I bet he'd have been REAL sharp ?
Nope, I never said that. I just said that they miss a healthy Saha. And you responded by saying that he wouldn't have played anyway even if he was healthy. A statement which, in hindsight, looks rather proposterous. :p

nothing new there, mind you...


Ah yes - your master plan of repeating the exact same formation which led to Rooney being completely marked out of the game and completely stifling Man U's attacking play .
Well, looks like SAF's master plan didn't produce a better result. Big surprise there...

[BocaFan]

Oops - so you think that a manager swapping teams has nothing to do with football? How very observant of you

Or had you forgotten that Redknapp moving was the aspect which has stoked the intensity of the rivalry?

But a manager switching teams is nothing new. It's the non-football issues that stokes this rivalry (combined of course with the geographic closeness of the two teams).


No - it's the intensity of the rivalry from the perspective of the fans. Pompey - Saints fans currently have more hatred for each other than Arsenal - Man U fans.
Maybe, maybe not. But Arsenal x Man uNited have the south-coast derby beat based on sheer # of fans. That's the tie-breaker here.


Yup - currently Chelsea are Man U's biggest rival in the EPL.

Dead wrong.


Or had you forgotten this comment.....

http://www.bigsoccer.com/forum/showpost.php?p=4235517&postcount=161


Well, I'm not disputing that United fans hate scousers. But Arsenal x United is a bigger rivalry currently based on the # of times these teams have gotten in each other's way in their persuits of recent trophies.

Why do you continually equate "biggest rival" with "biggest rival for the EPL title"?? You don't see me (desperately) trying to equal Man Utd's biggest rival with Man Utd's biggest rival for the FA Cup, do you?


Want to check back to where I made the comment about the 23 years?

I think you'll find it was in response to your inference that I was a glory hunter and that this thread was equally relevant to you (despite the fact you support neither Man U nor AC).

So what? I'm a football fan. I like CL. So this thread is relevant to me.


Considering that I've been following the club for 23 years and have seen the current team develop from their first games I think that actually does make me more informed than you to make a judgement on who the best player this season is -
See that's where you're wrong. The first 22 years don't matter in debating the best player this season. In fact, it might only add a bias.


By the way - who won Player of the Month for February? If Ronaldo was Man U's best player then surely he'd have won that award ahead of any other Man U player
So what? It's just someone's opinion. Mine is that CR was player of the month for February.


Oh I see - it's now gone from being the leader on the field to orchestrating attacks. How does that narrow definition relate to being the leader on the field. Does he not have to influence and drive the defensive aspects as well as the attacking ones (you know, in the way that Keane does).
Okay, I should have said "orchestrating play".


Probably because you inferred I was a glory hunter who had only just started following the club....

Not really. I was giving an example like "say a guy became a United fan yesterday... why would he have more right to be in this thread than me?"


Hmm - Improbable yes, Impossible no. Maybe you should run back to Oscar and borrow that dictionary again - you obviously need it

Wow, that's desperate. I mean, you still think Chelsea can lose 12 points and United drop zero?


Turkey is a daunting place to play due to the psychotic nature of their fans - or would you say that they are friendly towards visiting teams...

No, but then again I can't think of too many fans who are friendly to away teams.

But anyway the issue was wins and losses in Turkey. You said it: *sarcastically* "Turkey is such an easy country to play in and get an away win."
Amazingly, if you weren't being sarcastic you would have finally been right about something.


By the way - you never smashed jack $hit - I never responded to it because I got fed up with you lies and complete inability to give a straight answer or admit when you are wrong
Admit I was wrong? Not a chance. I argued that SAF thought he could get a win in Turkey even by resting several players. And I backed my claim up with stats showing how much Turkish teams suck at home in CL. What could be more straightforward than that?

[SugarKane]

Back in December when Utd palyed their last game of the group against the Turkish oufit Fenerbache, Ferguson rolled out a seriously weak team in a whacky 4-4-1-1 formation fronted by David Bellion. They lost 3-0.

Soon as I saw that team sheet I knew it was a major blunder.
Finishing second in the group leaves you with a tough draw in the next round ... Milan in this case, instead of maybe the likes of Bremen.

This is not the first time that Ferguson's lack of respect for the opposition has back-fired in the subsequent match. Or does he think he and his team can handle any team they get drawn against?

Surely surviving for another round (at least) would be more sensible?

[Prawn Sandwich]

Back in December when Utd palyed their last game of the group against the Turkish oufit Fenerbache, Ferguson rolled out a seriously weak team in a whacky 4-4-1-1 formation fronted by David Bellion. They lost 3-0.

Soon as I saw that team sheet I knew it was a major blunder.
Finishing second in the group leaves you with a tough draw in the next round ... Milan in this case, instead of maybe the likes of Bremen.

This is not the first time that Ferguson's lack of respect for the opposition has back-fired in the subsequent match. Or does he think he and his team can handle any team they get drawn against?

Surely surviving for another round (at least) would be more sensible?
You do realise that Man U were as likely to draw a big team if they won the group or came second don't you?

Have a look at the group tables

[Prawn Sandwich]

Geez, was that the first United game you ever watched? United usually look more likely to score in the last 20 minutes of a game, when they're desperate to score. And also CP being down to 10 man just may have been a factor too.

And that discounts the impact of the substitution how exactly?

Nope, I never said that. I just said that they miss a healthy Saha. And you responded by saying that he wouldn't have played anyway even if he was healthy. A statement which, in hindsight, looks rather proposterous.

nothing new there, mind you...

So with his ten minutes playing time in the last month you still think he'd have started ahead of Ruud? :rolleyes:

What's preposterous is that you actually think this supports your inane theory :p

Well, looks like SAF's master plan didn't produce a better result. Big surprise there...

And your's would have done? :rolleyes:

[SugarKane]

You do realise that Man U were as likely to draw a big team if they won the group or came second don't you?

Have a look at the group tables


I have, hence my commnets. Statistically there is a greater chance of drawing a team that is not on its "best form".

I still maintain that Ferguson's arrogance has cost them dear on more than a few occasions.

[Prawn Sandwich]

But a manager switching teams is nothing new. It's the non-football issues that stokes this rivalry (combined of course with the geographic closeness of the two teams).

So the manager swapping had no impact on the intensity of the rival at all?

Why do you resort to idiotic claims like this to try and support an indefensible statement?

Maybe, maybe not. But Arsenal x Man uNited have the south-coast derby beat based on sheer # of fans. That's the tie-breaker here.

Ohhh - if you say it's the tie-breaker then it must be true :rolleyes:

Just give up - you've bounced from one insane justification to another...

Dead wrong.

I know you are - glad to see you admitting it at last

Well, I'm not disputing that United fans hate scousers. But Arsenal x United is a bigger rivalry currently based on the # of times these teams have gotten in each other's way in their persuits of recent trophies.

Why do you continually equate "biggest rival" with "biggest rival for the EPL title"?? You don't see me (desperately) trying to equal Man Utd's biggest rival with Man Utd's biggest rival for the FA Cup, do you?

Christ - how thick are you that you can't understand this. A football rivalry is something that is built from decades of competition. Something that Arsenal and Man U do not have yet (as I said - give it another 15-20 years and you might find Man U fans rating the rivalry on a par with Liverpool and Man City).

The only other form of rivalry is that of your competitors for success at the current time. And, at this moment in time, Chelsea are more of a rival in this regard than Arsenal.

So what? I'm a football fan. I like CL. So this thread is relevant to me.

Equally relevant to fans of the actual clubs involved? You're talking out of your arse again...

See that's where you're wrong. The first 22 years don't matter in debating the best player this season. In fact, it might only add a bias.

You're accusing me of bias? LOL - this being the same you who was biased enough to claim that Ronaldo playing well for only 8 weeks was enough to qualify him as the best player this season? The same you who was biased enough to claim that Ronaldo's 15 minutes of stepovers on his debut was more than Rooney has achieved over the last 6 months?

Yeah - I must be the biased one :rolleyes:

So what? It's just someone's opinion. Mine is that CR was player of the month for February.

And it's an opinion which is deemed ignorant by the ex-professionals and pundits who selected the award winner. All of whom have more knowledge of football in their little toes that you will ever have

Okay, I should have said "orchestrating play".

ROTFLMAO - of course you should....

Tell me, how exactly does Ronaldo orchestrate the defensive play in the team?

Not really. I was giving an example like "say a guy became a United fan yesterday... why would he have more right to be in this thread than me?"

Of course that's what you were doing :rolleyes:

Wow, that's desperate. I mean, you still think Chelsea can lose 12 points and United drop zero?

Which part of the word "improbable" don't you understand?

Mind you, not sure why I ask seeing as you don't appear to understand the difference between improbable and impossible.....

No, but then again I can't think of too many fans who are friendly to away teams.

But anyway the issue was wins and losses in Turkey. You said it: *sarcastically* "Turkey is such an easy country to play in and get an away win."
Amazingly, if you weren't being sarcastic you would have finally been right about something.

Tell you what - you sit there and play with your stats if it helps make you think you were right. I'll just get by on the footage I've seen of how travelling teams are treated from the minute they get to the airport to the moment they get bombarded with missiles on the pitch....

Admit I was wrong? Not a chance. I argued that SAF thought he could get a win in Turkey even by resting several players. And I backed my claim up with stats showing how much Turkish teams suck at home in CL. What could be more straightforward than that?

Did you misunderstand my comment on purpose or was this an intentional effort to divert away from the multiple ignorant and incorrect claims you have made on this thread (you know - "Man U goes as Ronaldo goes", Ronaldo is a better leader than Roy Keane, Ronaldo is the best player this season, Ronaldo's debut was better than anything Rooney has done in a United shirt.... continue ad infinitum)

[Prawn Sandwich]

I have, hence my commnets. Statistically there is a greater chance of drawing a team that is not on its "best form".

I still maintain that Ferguson's arrogance has cost them dear on more than a few occasions.
So you think that a tie against Barca, Real and Bayern would have been easier?

What difference does it make who you draw anyway - if you are going to win it you have to beat the best of the rest. What difference does one more round make if you don't have a good enough team to win the tournament?

[SugarKane]

So you think that a tie against Barca, Real and Bayern would have been easier?

What difference does it make who you draw anyway - if you are going to win it you have to beat the best of the rest. What difference does one more round make if you don't have a good enough team to win the tournament?

No, I think the possibility of a draw bewtween Liverpool, Bayern, PSV, Bremen and Porto would be a probability worth thinking about.

One more round yields financial benefits, enhances the ranking points of the nation and increases the reputation of the club. All worthwhile.

[BocaFan]

No, I think the possibility of a draw bewtween Liverpool, Bayern, PSV, Bremen and Porto would be a probability worth thinking about.

One more round yields financial benefits, enhances the ranking points of the nation and increases the reputation of the club. All worthwhile.

Don't even bother arguing with him on this topic. He'll be on his death bed and still be claiming that second-place teams are as good as first-place teams in general. And then use Real Madrid of 2004-05 to back up the claim (clueless to the fact that Madrid have been very ordinary in Champions League this season. And he's also clueless to the fact that a one or two exceptions doesn't make #2 as good as #1). :p

[BocaFan]

And that discounts the impact of the substitution how exactly?
Because when the opposition are reduced to 10-men and United are more desperate to score to save their season, then you can expect them to get lots of chances. Whether RVN was on the pitch or not.


So with his ten minutes playing time in the last month you still think he'd have started ahead of Ruud?
Nope, I said IF he was healthy. Healthy implies fit. But he's not that's why I say use Rooney only.


What's preposterous is that you actually think this supports your inane theory
The theory you call "inane" got United closer to a win than the formation in the second-leg. I mean, if not for Carroll's blunder United get a better result with the former formation.