Blockbuster trade revisited

[lufty]

I am just wondering how everyone here thinks the trade with the Metros has panned out in the long haul? I know we were all pissed to begin with but lets face it folks, We all hated big mama... and when I watch him on TV when he fakes a fall, hes the worst actor out there... and Williams, he never really has done anything for us. Teddy is missed but he deserves better then what this organization had given him for the first 6 seasons.

On the other hand, we received two Impact players and another that well... we really did not gain anything from, except another headache like the one we had with Big MAMA look-a-boo-boo-day.


Kamler and Hernandez have fit onto this team like a glove. So.... If the Glove fits you must aquit. Thank you Todd for a fine trade. You showed us what we were missing, and you will be missed as well. Good luck with your future endevors, you deserve to be treated better then you have. Thank you-

[Jim Dow]

I think we should wait until all the playing is done for the year but I tend to agree that it was at the least a reasonable trade, if not a good one. Certainly Hernandez has been excellent and Kamler at least as good as Teddy. I'm not sure what to think of Serna v. MaMagol. The issue has been complicated by the emergence of Wolde as a setup partner for TnT, something Diallo couldn't do and Serna didn't play long enough to find out. I still think Diego/Taylor was a super partnership on the pitch.

But "the trade" certainly looks like it made sense from our current distance. Let's see how we all feel at 10:00 PM Saturday.


JIM DOW

[Mike Marshall]

Williams, he never really has done anything for us.
Revisionist history. He was BY FAR our best player at the tail end of the 2001 season, and FC was far too impatient with him at the beginning of this season.

[soren_k]

No doubt Williams has a lot of talent, but if we had Williams instead of Hernandez in the midfield I think we'd have given up more than 3 goals in our last 5 games or whatever it is. Of course we'd probably have scored a few more as well, but the fact is Nicol's system is working, and Williams didn't fit into it.

When you are the worst defensive club in the league, there isn't much room for one way players.

Diallo hurt us more than he helped us, imo, and I was glad to see him go. Serna may not have contributed anything but at least we haven't had to put him on the pitch as we would have with Diallo.

[soccertim]

What role do people envision Hernandez playing in the future? I don't see him as an attacking mid, but how about a D-mid? We have plenty of players who can be one of two D-mids in a 3-5-2 or 4-4-2 without an attacking mid (Hernandez, Cullen, Rooney, Cloutier, Joey...). Could any of them (including Hernandez) hold the fort as a solo D-mid if we were to try and play an attacking mid? If the system we're playing now is the only way to play him, it's not the best of trades.

I'll also agree with Mike Marshall. AW played well for us last year and played pretty well when he was given the chance earlier this year. Part of his resurgence in NY was due to Diallo's waking up, but much of what I've seen from him on tv is what I'd hoped to see from him for the Revs this year.

[Gregor]

kamler for chrono = a wash

serna for diallo = depends on what we get for or out of serna

hernandez for williams = who knows, a close call, but it's easier to destroy than create and, ostensibly, AW has the makings to be among the best creators in the league

[Rodan]

If the system we're playing now is the only way to play him, it's not the best of trades.

Hernandez is not a true D-mid or attacking mid - he's a holding mid. Good holding mids are also notoriously difficult to find. To be honest, as much as people rhapsodize about having AW's attacking skills in the middle, not many teams can afford to play a central midfielder with that kind of dedication to offense. Not only do I think the current Rev's system can work, I think it's the more predominant system in soccer at this time.

AW played great at the end of 2001 - but the team sucked. AW is playing great for the Metros right now, but the team sucks (as of now). If AW were playing for the Revs during the last few months, there's every reason to beleive that the team would still suck. The problem is not with AW per see, but what the team needs.

BTW, I would say Kamler for Chrono is far more than a wash. Chrono has been an absolute albatross in New York.

I don't think we'll be able to judge with certainty about this trade until next year - but I think we can confidently say it wasn't the "disaster" people were claiming at first.

[Jon Martin]

I suppose this thread was inevitable following the recent run of success the Boys have had.

Since I have done as much or more whining than anyone about the trade, I feel obligated to say that Hernandez has worked out better than I could have hoped - I'm glad we have him, and I hope he likes being a Rev and stays.

This is not, however, to say that Williams wouldn't be a good fit for the Revs even now. I would love to see him starting with Hernandez. Far from being a problem on the Metros, he has been one of their few consistent performers since the first day he wore the red and black.

I fell terrible for Chrono. We knew from years back that he wasn't a marking back, but a wing mid. How OZ could have overlooked this is beyond me. He is a better left mid than either Griffiths (at least this year) or Kamler (any year), and it's a shame that he is being judged on his performance as a defender.

WRT Diallo and Serna, they are both so high-maintainance and selfish, I doubt either one is worth having at the prices they command, and perhaps at any price. I can imagine what TS had in mind when he traded for Serna, but I doubt many BS readers would lose any sleep if he found a job elsewhere.

Bottom line: the teams' fortunes notwithstanding, I still feel the Metros got the better deal, but fortunately for us, OZ was too dense to capitalize on it. I doubt Lufty woud agree, but I would still trade the (presumed) Serna allocation for AW.

[Popero]

What's particularly funny is the poll on the Metros board about the Worst Trade In Metro History. Some people actually voted for this one.

[rkupp]

Originally posted by Jon Martin
I doubt Lufty woud agree, but I would still trade the (presumed) Serna allocation for AW.
Wouldn't that be perfection?

A back 4 of Llamosa, Kante, Franchino, Pierce with Hernandez in front of them would free AW to serve up balls from the offensive end (instead of having to come back in his own end constantly). With AW and Ralston creating opportunities for the front-runners, I'd put that as the league's best lineup.

But, it ain't gonna happen.

[Rickster]

Originally posted by Jon Martin
I fell terrible for Chrono. We knew from years back that he wasn't a marking back, but a wing mid. How OZ could have overlooked this is beyond me. He is a better left mid than either Griffiths (at least this year) or Kamler (any year), and it's a shame that he is being judged on his performance as a defender.

I'm not sure I buy this. In recent times, Chrono has been an average player at best, regardless of position, especially given his fragility.

[George Griffin]

I had thought about starting a thread like this but had decided to wait till after Saturdays match.

Losing Serna for the season has made this a difficult trade to evaluate but I think the Revs have gotten the best of the deal even with his absense. Hernandez will become an Alverez for the Revs and Kamler has given us a good last year of his career. If Serna decides he wants to be part of the Rev team and SN gets his attention and cooperation, the Revs will be way ahead in the Trade. I think Big Baby will be gone next year. He's a real cancer on an already sick team.

BTW, the reason Teddy is at left back is to give space to Brad Davis who may blossom into one of the best left wingers in the league.

[soccertim]

Originally posted by Rickster


I'm not sure I buy this. In recent times, Chrono has been an average player at best, regardless of position, especially given his fragility.

I can remember Chrono filling in at defender late in the 2000 or 2001 season (around the time Sommer broke his finger) and he was awful, as bad as Heaps was in that game against KC last year. If NY were looking for a defender, Downing wouldn't be much worse than Chrono. On the other hand, when Teddy is healthy, he's a better wide mid than Kamler, who's had his moments, but isn't very fast or skilled.

[glennmcdonald]

As a defender, Chrono is a midfielder. And vice versa.

[George Griffin]

Originally posted by glennmcdonald
As a defender, Chrono is a midfielder. And vice versa.

Teddy will always be one of my favorate all time Rev players but he's not been healthy for the past two years and he's often been more of a liability than an asset. I'm sorry that he's doing as poorly as he is in NY but better there than in Foxboro.

[Jon Martin]

Originally posted by George Griffin
BTW, the reason Teddy is at left back is to give space to Brad Davis who may blossom into one of the best left wingers in the league.
I suppose my point is that they didn't move Chrono when Davis arrived, they traded for Chrono to play left back. Chrono has done so badly that one wonders if Davis wouldn't have done better there. Now that they have miraculously acquired Akwari, it's academic.

WRT Chrono's health, please note that he has been healthier since the trade than Kamler.

[socdoc]

I think watching Rooney play has made Hernandez look better than he is to some of you. Granted he does slow the pace effectively at times and can hit through balls somewhere near another player. But watch both his work rate in midfield and, even more concerningly, his effort after he has been beaten or fails in a tackle. It looks to me like he quits, at least momentarily. He often recovers a comfortable pace when greater effort is needed. There is no way he would succeed as a sole D-mid (I think the Metros tried it) and for the Revs to play with the better teams in the league either he or Cullen will need to be upgraded. Personally I think Cullen is more responsible for the midfields better play of late than Hernandez although I concur that he is the best option me have at this time.

[Bruce S]

I was afraid that I felt suicidal every time I saw Big Mama play. I LOATHED his act, from start to finish. Even when things looked bad, I never regretted the trade that got that sack of garbage out. Twellman's emergence has a lot ot do with moving Mama. I seriously doubt TnT would have developed as well with Mama complaining and whining next to him for the whole season.

[Bruce S]

I like Kamler. I am a bit surprised how well he has played. Williams may be a good player but he just never played that well for us. I am not as big a Hermnandez fan as many here. Excellent free-kicks but not that good in the run of play. Well, better than Rooney, but still not that good -average player at best.

[rkupp]

Originally posted by George Griffin
Hernandez will become an Alverez for the Revs and Kamler has given us a good last year of his career.
Why do you think it's his last year? I can't imagine that the Revs wouldn't want him back, and it sure looks like he's enjoying himself.