Discussed to death I am sure, but...

[JAReyes9]

man anyone else tired of Cygan. Im not going to blame him for the loss cause I think thats harsh to do to any ONE player unless he does a massive screw up. But man he was brutal. How many times did he have all day to make a pass, but would then get too ambitous and lose the ball. A lot of attacks start from the back and he seems incapable of starting anys. Plus defensively he isn't exactly a stalwart, he looks very shaky a lot of the time.
I don't think Cygan is pure garbage or anything, just as the color-commentator (Paul something I think) said "not good enough for Arsenal."

Also, he didn't cost us or anything, but Jens Lehmann scares me. I am always afraid of him making a blunder or doing something stupid earning him a caution. I thought for sure he was getting booked that game after the start he had. I would give Almunia a start or two and see how he does. Worst case, you come back to Jens.

One thing I will say positive about Jens is, hes usually great in the air, and I know at the end of Seamens career we missed that.

[rgrayson]

All i have to say is- he is a LOT better than most guys who are backups in the league. Still havnt lost and things definatly could be worse than they are ;) Just hang it out till Sol comes back. :D

[Crestofthestars]

Get used to it. When Campbell retires in a few years he's your main defender.

[yossarian]

Get used to it. When Campbell retires in a few years he's your main defender.

Toure
Senderos
Hoyte
yes, Cygan, who is actually several months older than Campbell will be our "main" defender... :rolleyes:
Do you ever know what you're talking about?

[Crestofthestars]

Toure
Senderos
Hoyte
yes, Cygan, who is actually several months older than Campbell will be our "main" defender... :rolleyes:
Do you ever know what you're talking about?
Toure is the definition of mediocre.
Senderos and Hoyte? Woah watch out Milan! Some no-name youth prospects to replace Sol Campbell? I don't see it.

I wouldn't be surprised if Cygan clings to your team past his sell by date like Keown before him, once he gets a sniff of a first team opening. Sol will probably retire with grace in the next year or two.

[rgrayson]

Toure is the definition of mediocre.
Senderos and Hoyte? Woah watch out Milan! Some no-name youth prospects to replace Sol Campbell? I don't see it.

Everyone is at one time a no namer ;)

[yossarian]

Toure is the definition of mediocre.
Senderos and Hoyte? Woah watch out Milan! Some no-name youth prospects to replace Sol Campbell? I don't see it.

I wouldn't be surprised if Cygan clings to your team past his sell by date like Keown before him, once he gets a sniff of a first team opening. Sol will probably retire with grace in the next year or two.

You're quite the prognosticator aren't you? What stocks should I invest in?

The point is, you said that Cygan would be Arsenal's main defender. I demonstrated your ignorance. Why don't you mosey back over to the United forum where they like you only slightly more than we do.

[Crestofthestars]

The point is, you said that Cygan would be Arsenal's main defender. I demonstrated your ignorance.
Yes you "demonstrated my ignorance" by pointing out Cygan is marginally older than Campbell. Flawless victory.

Apart from the fact you apparently missed the bit where I suggested that Cygan will be keener to hold onto his contract.
Cantona retired at 31. I could see Campbell going at 31-32. He's already losing what was always limited pace. In any case I reckon you'll see Cygan in your starting eleven until he's well into his mid 30's.
With money being frittered into the new stadium and gambles like Jose Reyes there won't be the funds to replace an integral part of your team like Campbell. Cygan is hardly going to avoid as many last pay checks as possible is he.



Why don't you mosey back over to the United forum where they like you only slightly more than we do.
I'm outraged by your suggestions that I am anything but a popular figure on the internet. Why do you resort to this trolling?

[bergkamp10]

Toure is the definition of mediocre.
Senderos and Hoyte? Woah watch out Milan! Some no-name youth prospects to replace Sol Campbell? I don't see it.

I wouldn't be surprised if Cygan clings to your team past his sell by date like Keown before him, once he gets a sniff of a first team opening. Sol will probably retire with grace in the next year or two.

First, Kolo Toure is an awesome player. He was instrumental in anchoring the defence in Arsenal's undefeated season. He has also demonstrated his versatility time and time again.

Second, Senderos and Hoyte are youngsters with bright futures at Arsenal.

"Watch out Milan," you say? Damn right they had better. Wenger has a proven track record of turning so called "no names" into stars. Take Freddie Ljungberg for example.....

[Rick B]

I'm outraged by your suggestions that I am anything but a popular figure on the internet. Why do you resort to this trolling?

I tell you what, as one of the Mods on this forum - I am beginning to think that you are posting to inflame. Therefore you should think about two things.

a) The Terms of Service specifically state you must not inflame and therefore please desist.

b) Before you start crying, my opinion counts for a lot more than yours when it comes to deciding what is worth a crad and/or forum ban.

[yossarian]

....inane rambling...inane rambling......

Again, you demonstrate your ignorance. Do you even watch football? Campbell has never been the fastest CB in the world and relies much more on positioning, strength in the air and good tackling than he does pace. He always has.

You also seem to think you know an awful lot about Cygan's mind set. Did you know he came close to leaving Arsenal this summer? Oh that's right, you must since you're privy to his retirement plans?

Also, I think you need to ask your parents what trolling means because you don't seem to grasp the concept.

[Gunners11]

Im not going to blame him for the loss

We haven't lost in the EPL May 2003. If your still blaming him for the Leeds loss, well I think we have bigger problems then that.

[Crestofthestars]

Again, you demonstrate your ignorance. Do you even watch football? Campbell has never been the fastest CB in the world and relies much more on positioning, strength in the air and good tackling than he does pace. He always has.

You also seem to think you know an awful lot about Cygan's mind set. Did you know he came close to leaving Arsenal this summer? Oh that's right, you must since you're privy to his retirement plans?

Also, I think you need to ask your parents what trolling means because you don't seem to grasp the concept.

Posting to inflame would be posting something like "lol manure, rio is a druggie" or perhaps "lol spector looks looks like a puss.y!!" Please refer to the types of things Arsenal fans constantly post on the United board.
These posts are nonsense and don't in any way discuss merits or put forward an intelligent point of view.
Yet does Motterman go around threatening to ban people posting comments such as the above? No. Infact he doesn't even edit the posts.

In comparison the moderators on the Arsenal board are like Nazi's, power tripping on their crumb of authority in the world. Do you sit infront of a mirror flexing your anemic muscles as you type?

Here is a post I made that was edited yesterday:

Most of what you've written is half truths, exaggeration and downright lying - and you know it.

United made their money through Fergie's success. We only started spending out of proportion since 2000...and the years since haven't even been our best years.
Before then Fergie's record in bargains and developing youth talent makes a mockery of Wenger who has a Vivas, Luzhny, Boa Morte, Grimandi, Jeffers, Wiltord, Cygan or Stepanovs for every Henry. You're right that we've had more talent under Fergie than Wenger has though. Because SAF went out and bought it!

Wenger took over a top side when he joined the club. Ferguson built his up from the ground and has won more trophies in every competition.

United's record is laughable? pathetic, obvious trolling. Manchester United have the second best win/draw/loss record in the Champions League since it's foundation...second only to Real Madrid
Numerous quater finals, semi-finals and a win. Compare to Arsenal.

Living on past glories? No, making a point about the foundation of our previous success. That is one of the topics we were discussing after all genius. We have, ya know, won the exact same trophies as you in the last 2 seasons after all.
You say "blind luck" which is more ridiculous winding up. When Fergie sold Ince, Kanchelskis etc to bring through the youth talent he was labbeled as out of his mind. Famous football pundit Alan Hansen said the phrase which would come back to bite him on the ass and become his unwanted catch-phrase for ever after "you never win anything with kids." But Fergie had the balls to gut a Championship winning side and then carefully nurture a new generation. He had also in previous years re-structured the whole club including the youth system.

Since then we've had Brown (shame he's always injured), O'Shea (best youth player of the year when he first emerged, I won't deny his career hit a real slump in his second season) and Fletcher (who may or may not make it).
It's a pretty dumb question though. Why would youth players be coming through in a period when we had the most cast-iron set in stone team in the league where Giggs,Scholes,Keane,Beckham picked themselves and the Irwin/Gary/Stam setup at the back?
You may have noticed that recently we've been blooding the likes of Fletcher, Spector, Eagles, Richardson to see who might make it and also signing lots of future prospects. This is because the curent team is aging once again and there are places up for grabs for young players coming through.

The fact is that Wenger has been unable to forge a team with the mental strength or talent to be even moderately successful in Europe.

With Campbell 30, Pires 31, Vieira 29 and Henry 27 how many seasons do you have left to get it right?

I think this year could be make or break for Arsenals European ambitions and quite frankly I'm not even vaguely convinced it will be any different than ever


This was a relevent argument with a factual basis, as all my posts are.
Just because you don't like the opinion it doesn't make it "trolling."

[yossarian]

.....blah blah blah......
This was a relevent argument with a factual basis, as all my posts are.
Just because you don't like the opinion it doesn't make it "trolling."

Factual....like your comments about the United treble season?
I'm having a laugh.

[Crestofthestars]

Again, you demonstrate your ignorance. Do you even watch football? Campbell has never been the fastest CB in the world and relies much more on positioning, strength in the air and good tackling than he does pace. He always has.

You also seem to think you know an awful lot about Cygan's mind set. Did you know he came close to leaving Arsenal this summer? Oh that's right, you must since you're privy to his retirement plans?

Also, I think you need to ask your parents what trolling means because you don't seem to grasp the concept.
So did Blanc but by the time he joined United he was struggling, particularly with the Premiership being so fast paced. To suggest that a defender can survive in top flight football without at least some pace is ridiculous and ignorant. Sol has never built his game around his moderate speed, but as even that begins to desert him his game will suffer. Sol is a proud guy and I think he will retire when he feels he is no longer at the top of his game.
I don't see you out right buying a replacement for him either. You got lucky snapping up Sol for nothing. In the transfer market a player of his calibre would cost you £20m...money you don't have.

In my opinion, Cygan will be the heart of your defence in a few years time.

[bigp]

Senderos and Toure will be the main defenders in the future. Senderos was being courted by the likes of Real Madrid, Bayern Munich and your dirty Manure team but chose Arsenal. He could even be the future captain. So you have no idea what you're talking about.

[nicephoras]

No no, he makes good points. In 10 years, when at the age of 32, John Terry retires (having already captained Chelsea to numerous CL and EPL victories), we will be stuck with the aging slow Roberth Huth as our top CB. How do we know this? Becuase Huth has never been as good as Terry, and is more likely to hang on for the duration of his contract. So yes, in 2014, Chelsea will have to worry about their central defense. :(

Of course, they'd never buy another defender, becuase....well......that's just not a possibility in CrestofStar's world. Say, when did the Bosman ruling get overturned? You seem to have the inside track.

[JAReyes9]

We haven't lost in the EPL May 2003. If your still blaming him for the Leeds loss, well I think we have bigger problems then that.

Woops my bad. I am not one of those doom and gloom fans, where its off the bandwagon with a loss and back on after a win, but this game certainly felt like a loss to me. Noticed how no one else said anything either, it must have felt like one to most :p

As for "Woah watch out Milan! Some no-name youth prospects to replace Sol Campbell?"

Why can't Arsene pull another rabbit out of the hat? Im not saying it should be expected, but given his track record, its not even close to impossible.

To suggest that we won't raise a single defender through the youth system, or that Arsene won't try to find another through the transfer system is ridiculous. So for a several years were just not signing any defenders? Right. :confused:

You can get some solid cover in the back for lot less than Reyes-esque money too. Just cause we can't afford to shell out 20M everyyear (at least during the stadium construction), doesn't mean we can't pick up a solid defender for say 7M.

Last time I checked took two people to sign a contract. You obviously don't like Arsenal, but even you can admit that Wenger is not an idiot. He's not going to keep renewing the contract of a player simply because hes old and "wants to hang on to it." He will re-sign players if they add an element to the team, not cause their old and want money.

[Przybylinski]

I don't see them relying on Cygan at all. If Campbell were to leave they would work hard to aquire a strong central defender to take his place. By that time Hoyte and Sendros may be up to the task. I still think Arsene would buy someone.

[jpatel1508]

Senderos is gonna be starting by this time next season. He's gonna shift Toure to right back and claim the center back posistion as his own. We paid a whopping 2.5 million pounds for him as an 18 year old 1 and a half seasons ago. We will see him captain our side in the Carling Cup (or if not captain, then commanding). He's a big big presence. At 6ft 4in. ...fast and born to be world class...we'll have our future captain once Viera retires.