PK Or Not?

[GreatZar]

Semi-final of a tournament match. Lots of parents and spectators (including the ref tent). Not that any of this should matter...

Near the 3/4 mark of the match, the team behind by a goal is attacking from a corner kick and with a short pass nears the outside corner of the 18 opposite side of pitch from your AR. You've setup behind the endline for the corner and are cheating inside the endline for a better view inside the 18. Your head/eyes are pointing diagonally across the penalty box and the ball is struck towards the goal. A defender with shoulders/head/eyes/body facing 90 degrees to your right and the approaching ball rejects the shot. You do not see the ball touch the defender (a few players to either side of the view between you and defender), but you see the defender's left hand raised head-height and slap back at the instant the ball would presumably pass by the defender (actually, the foolish defender has both hands raised, but this is the hand farthest away from you hidden from view initially until the hand retracts and the ball changes direction 180 degrees). My whistle blows and hand points to the mark. Instantly, as if every defensive player is reading from a script, 7-8 defenders (including keeper) scream at me that the defender headed the ball. The attackers are not disputing these claims (that you can see/hear) to yield some credence to your call.

What would you have done?

By the way, I ended up moving to my AR to ask what he saw. Guess what...he didn't see and can't confirm/deny the ball touched head or hand. We continued with the penalty and the attackers scored (and eventually won 2-1). But because I went to consult, the coach starts riding my a$$ BIG TIME during the walk back for the kick off (somehow, I became deaf and the cards stayed in my pocket).

Because the ref tent watched, I have the luck of knowing if I made the right call (I'll reply in a bit with that data).

What would you have done? Would you have consulted your AR if you called the penalty?

[Crowdie]

Nasty situation. You can't call what you didn't see and when it comes to calling a handball you definitely can't call what you didn't see. You were right to consult your AR although I would recommend making eye contact with the AR and asking if he/she saw the handball (a quick point to your arm should do the trick) before blowing for the penalty. Once you have blown for the penalty you make your situation worse.

From your description that the incident happened inside the penalty area on the side opposite to the AR you should expect that the AR saw nothing. Remember that the AR will only signal for incidents in his/her area. The far side of the penalty area is definitely the CR's area.

Would I have called it - no (although that is only from your description).

Lastly, don't take ******** from coaches. If a coach is riding your arse then feel free to stop the game and have a word with the coach. All the power is in your hands - the coach has no power at all in this situation. It sounds strange but coaches respect referees who are firm and don't allow themselves to get walked over. That said don't take offence at every small comment coming from a coach as coaches are only human and sometimes their mouths show the frustration before their brains.

[GreatZar]

As I was walking back to the center for the kick off, that's all I was thinking. I called at PK in a semi with strong circumstantial evidence. Was this coach giving me what I deserved? I had one of the biggest knots in my belly as a result of reffing in a long time.

Interesting that you wouldn't call what you don't directly see. Assuming penalty was the correct call, I imagine the attacking team's coach would be equally irate at a no call.

Is this something you'd talk about for a pre-game quiet signal system between you and your ARs? Point at your eye while looking at an AR to get a free hand on belly for good/make-the call and free hand on ear for bad/don't-make call (or some other wierd signalling system between CR/ARs). But even with a system you and the ARs agree to, you may delay the call so long that you cause a problem with the late PK whistle.

[GreatZar]

You were right to consult your AR although I would recommend making eye contact with the AR and asking if he/she saw the handball (a quick point to your arm should do the trick) before blowing for the penalty. So in this case, the AR would shrug his shoulders to signify he can't say hands or not. That's pretty ugly for both you and the AR. I've centered with young kid ARs that do this for throw-ins (God help them if they're on the parent's touch -- the youth matches have merciless parents).

[Crowdie]

Interesting that you wouldn't call what you don't directly see. Assuming penalty was the correct call, I imagine the attacking team's coach would be equally irate at a no call.

Any inspector worth his or her salt will ask you immediately after the game to describe what happened that resulted in you awarding a penalty. Would are you meant to say? You didn't see any offence but yet you awarded a free kick - in this case a penalty?

Is this something you'd talk about for a pre-game quiet signal system between you and your ARs? Point at your eye while looking at an AR to get a free hand on belly for good/make-the call and free hand on ear for bad/don't-make call (or some other wierd signalling system between CR/ARs). But even with a system you and the ARs agree to, you may delay the call so long that you cause a problem with the late PK whistle.

It depends on your ARs. If your ARs have the experience and ability then talk to them about communication. The ARs should be trying to keep eye contact with you whenever possible so your signals can be very quick and discrete.

The key is to get the call right. Late is better than wrong.

[Crowdie]

So in this case, the AR would shrug his shoulders to signify he can't say hands or not. That's pretty ugly for both you and the AR. I've centered with young kid ARs that do this for throw-ins (God help them if they're on the parent's touch -- the youth matches have merciless parents).

If you are running the game with inexperienced ARs then you are not going to get much eye contact, if any, so signals are not an option. When I run games with inexperienced ARs all the ARs are really giving me is the ball in and out - they just don't realise it - with inexperienced ARs you have to take almost total responsibility for offsides and fouls. I know the CR is meant to take responsibility for fouls and offsides all the time but if you have a very senior AR on your line and he/she has a better view then you then you are generally going to go with their call.

[Caesar]

1. I can't call something I didn't see. The AR can't call something they didn't see. Period. No exceptions. If you don't see it, you don't call it.

2. Once I've made a call, I'm sticking with it. I'm not going to go and check with the AR - if I wasn't sure, then I shouldn't have made the call in the first place. The only thing it's going to accomplish is make me look bad. If the AR isn't making a call (either by flag or some more subtle signal) then the onus is on me and me only.

Sorry. I'm really happy that you got the call right, but what ultimately happened is that you got lucky making an educated guess. You can't do that - you need to know that you're making the right call before you make it. I'd highly recommend you don't try doing that again, because odds are it's going to bite you on the ass.

[Statesman]

The referee is a salesman. The product you sell is the decisions you make. If you don't believe whole-heartedly in the product, you aren't going to make the sale. If you doubt the product, there's no sense in trying to sell it.

[Ref Flunkie]

The referee is a salesman. The product you sell is the decisions you make. If you don't believe whole-heartedly in the product, you aren't going to make the sale. If you doubt the product, there's no sense in trying to sell it.


Ahhh words to live by. I also live by the "if I don't see it, I don't call it" rule, especially as important as something as a PK. The attacking coach can't give you that much grief if you say "I was screened and didn't see it, nor did my AR". What does he expect, x-ray vision. As was stated, you did make it worse by consulting your AR directly (again, eye contact and a little nod or shake of the head by the AR would do wonders), and once you blow the whistle, you should probably just go all the way with it, say (to the players) that you clearly saw the handling of the ball, and are awarding a PK. Any waiver in your "selling" will fuel the fire even more.

[billf]

I think the mistake here is that you called something you weren't 100% sure about and that you betrayed yourself when you let all of the participants know you weren't 100% sure. Part of being a referee I think is developing a strong poker face. Like Stateman wrote, you need to sell the call. You already blew the whistle, so unless you are 100% sure you made a mistake, you need to at least make the players believe that you are 100% sure you made the proper call. The higher you go as a referee, the easier it will become for the participants to jump on the slightest hint of uncertainty or weakness. This happened to me a few times where I first started working men's amateur matches and it took a lot of practice to start to hide some of my self doubt.

[GreatZar]

Well, as you've all assumed, I got the call correct.

That's kinda beside the point. You are all correct that I made the situation worse by checking with my AR after the call. And because he didn't see it, it made me question my call more. But I was 99% certain of the call otherwise I would never have blown the whistle. It was simply my bad mistake to listen to the pleas from the players (all on the same page), the opponents quiet demeanor (probably very happy w/the call not wanting to rock the boat), the screaming parents/spectators (who cares usually), the defending team coach, and start to have a little voice in my head say "you didn't actually see the ball hit the hand". I never normally do any of these things.

Possibly because I got the call correct (some of you say lucky, but I'll reiterate that I was 99% certain when I blew the whistle), the remaining 1/4 of the match saw no ill effects of players/coaches/spectators abuse.

At the conclusion of the match, my far AR (at midfield during the play), the ref tent, and several independent spectators waiting for the next match confirmed the call was correct. While an assessor didn't see the match, the various refs that saw my performance (extras/4ths with nothing to do who found the match very exciting/compelling to watch for entertainment value) all applauded me for my performance.

I was hoping to see some elder refs make some suggestions that I hadn't thought of to make this situation better if it ever happens again. To that end, I loved hearing Caesar say "Once I've made a call, I'm sticking with it. I'm not going to go and check with the AR". I also liked the advice from Statesman about selling all calls and being a salesman. If this wasn't a semifinal in a tournament, I would have never consulted the AR (and I know some of you will give me hell for the inconsistency in this statement).

As an aside, I'm curious if any of you have ever centered and called a PK as a result of your ARs waving flag (separate issue, but asked to reinforce how alone you are in the 18 at both ends)?

[Ref Flunkie]

As an aside, I'm curious if any of you have ever centered and called a PK as a result of your ARs waving flag (separate issue, but asked to reinforce how alone you are in the 18 at both ends)?

Most of the time I instruct/am instructed to let the center have first crack at a PK. If he feels he needs help he will make eye contact with the AR, which is the general signal for "I need help". What happens next depends on the pregame instruction. Some centers will let the AR flag it, but the problem with that is the center can't very well ignore the flag, so he forced into calling something. This can be delt with in a number of ways. Another option, again assuming this was discussed in the pregame, is a nod from the the AR if he thinks a penalty should be called, or a shake of the head/hand if he thinks there was no foul. The nice thing about this method of communication is none of the players/coaches really know it's going on. The procedures for ARs calling fouls (PKs or otherwise) should be discussed in the pregame. If the AR is inexperienced, the center will usually tell them to call nothing in the penalty area to prevent any screw ups. If they have worked together before and trust each other, they may allow then to flag anything they think the center does not see. It all depends on the game and situation.

[GreatZar]

In every match I've centered (mostly youth, but some Over30 Men stuff as well), I've instructed both ARs (unless I have a 9 badge) to feel free to flag a PK they see that I don't see. Hundreds of matches now and I've never had an AR wave flag and run to the corner.

Watched several hundred pro matches over the years on TV and have never seen it.

[whitehound]

Well, as you've all assumed, I got the call correct.

That's kinda beside the point. You are all correct that I made the situation worse by checking with my AR after the call. And because he didn't see it, it made me question my call more. But I was 99% certain of the call otherwise I would never have blown the whistle. It was simply my bad mistake to listen to the pleas from the players (all on the same page), the opponents quiet demeanor (probably very happy w/the call not wanting to rock the boat), the screaming parents/spectators (who cares usually), the defending team coach, and start to have a little voice in my head say "you didn't actually see the ball hit the hand". I never normally do any of these things.

Possibly because I got the call correct (some of you say lucky, but I'll reiterate that I was 99% certain when I blew the whistle), the remaining 1/4 of the match saw no ill effects of players/coaches/spectators abuse.

At the conclusion of the match, my far AR (at midfield during the play), the ref tent, and several independent spectators waiting for the next match confirmed the call was correct. While an assessor didn't see the match, the various refs that saw my performance (extras/4ths with nothing to do who found the match very exciting/compelling to watch for entertainment value) all applauded me for my performance.

I was hoping to see some elder refs make some suggestions that I hadn't thought of to make this situation better if it ever happens again. To that end, I loved hearing Caesar say "Once I've made a call, I'm sticking with it. I'm not going to go and check with the AR". I also liked the advice from Statesman about selling all calls and being a salesman. If this wasn't a semifinal in a tournament, I would have never consulted the AR (and I know some of you will give me hell for the inconsistency in this statement).

As an aside, I'm curious if any of you have ever centered and called a PK as a result of your ARs waving flag (separate issue, but asked to reinforce how alone you are in the 18 at both ends)?Yes I have.....might have had a word with AR after the game though.....and by the way, you just got lucky, you dont call what you THINK you should have seen but what you see. Next time it may get you in trouble. This is a case of circumstances teaching you a bad habit. THE QUESTION you should be asking yourself is:why wasnt I in the proper position to see the play and make a proper call.

[Chubbywubby]

As an aside, I'm curious if any of you have ever centered and called a PK as a result of your ARs waving flag (separate issue, but asked to reinforce how alone you are in the 18 at both ends)?
In a men's match last year, the ball was crossed from deep in my corner to an attacker near the 18 on the AR's side, who was immediately chopped down. Due to my wide position and intervening players, I couldn't see whether the foul occurred just inside or just outside the PA. As I'm blowing the whistle, I see my AR start to raise his flag, then drop it and hold it between his legs -- so I pointed to the penalty spot without hesitation.

While we didn't specifically discuss this scenario in the pregame, this signal is a common mechanic that we both knew. It allows the AR to provide his opinion about where a foul occurred without it looking like he's calling the PK.

[whitehound]

Yes I have.....might have had a word with AR after the game though.....and by the way, you just got lucky, you dont call what you THINK you should have seen but what you see. Next time it may get you in trouble. This is a case of circumstances teaching you a bad habit. THE QUESTION you should be asking yourself is:why wasnt I in the proper position to see the play and make a proper call.
I take the part about ARs calling PKs back.....Assistant referee today in a reletively high level mens match with a Natl reff in the middle....three PKs called......One by the Reff and one by each of us ARs........I see something new every weekend.

[ref47]

in my pregame, i instruct the ar's to call any foul that they see; if, they are sure i was not looking at it and that i did not have a good view; if, they had the view because they could tell i was screened; if, after seeing how i was calling fouls, they believe i would have called the foul and not considered it trifling; and, if, they have applied or not applied advantage as necessary. and the pa is not sacred and reserved for the cr.

[whitehound]

in my pregame, i instruct the ar's to call any foul that they see; if, they are sure i was not looking at it and that i did not have a good view; if, they had the view because they could tell i was screened; if, after seeing how i was calling fouls, they believe i would have called the foul and not considered it trifling; and, if, they have applied or not applied advantage as necessary. and the pa is not sacred and reserved for the cr.
I think alot of the "penalty area is sacred" thing comes from working with ARs that are less experienced. You cant always trust the people you are assigned with.

[Crowdie]

I see my AR start to raise his flag, then drop it and hold it between his legs -- so I pointed to the penalty spot without hesitation.

People still using the flag between the legs trick? It is too obvious for seasoned coaches to pick up. When a player goes down in the area that the AR has been advised to control the AR should look straight away to the CR to:

* See if the CR is going to call anything
* Be ready for any communication from the CR

If the CR throws the ball back into your court and you believe that it is a penalty then you:

* Raise the flag in your right hand (assuming a standard diagonal) to indicate a free kick to the attacking team
* Lower the flag on your right hand side to indicate the direction of the free kick (although I have seen FIFA ARs miss this step so do what you feel comfortable with)
* Run down the touch line to the corner flag and then across the goal line to your penalty position (this obviously indicates a penalty)

Have the courage to call what you believe is right.

[Gary V]

People still using the flag between the legs trick?
USSF has two AR procedures for PK's.

If the AR calls the foul (flag up with wiggle) and the center stops play, then the AR moves quickly to the goal line for the ensuing PK.

If the center calls the foul, the AR positions the flag between his legs to let the center know the foul occurred in the PA. Then when the center points to the spot, he moves to the goal line.