US Olympic Basketball Team Part II [R]

[soccernutter]

US v Greece tomorrow

[X X I]

WTF.

[X X I]

Ah... where are we supposed to taunt when it comes to Olympic sports other than soccer?

[soccernutter]

Ah... where are we supposed to taunt when it comes to Olympic sports other than soccer?

Sure. Take it to rivalries.

[Alex_1]

Rivalries is a unique beast. But it probably won't be duplicated elsewhere. There are too many off topic threads in there anyway.

My take:

IT does not matter who is or is not here. That has nothing to do with with playing better defense, taking care of the basketball or hitting jump shots.

For all the players named that did not come to Athens, only Ray Allen is a consistent outside shooter.

Teams are daring the US to do the fundamental act of shooting the basketball and they cannot do it. Unless the US plays better pressue defense they will not be able to get out out on the break nd they'll be reduced ot Half court basketball against a zone defense.

This team is good enough to win this, but they need to understand that this is team basketball as opposed to what's played in the NBA.

Pretty much to the point. I like the last sentence. It's really at the heart of the USA's problems. Some of these guys have hardly learned of the team concept. You have the younger guys there that have 1 year of college ball, tops. Otherwise they're used to doing whatever they want in High School. Larry Brown's a great coach though - if anyone can pull it off, it'd be him. Philadelphia wasn't the most talented team when they reached the finals and lost to the Lakers. But he had them playing a team game... albeit centered around Iverson.

Today's just so different. I remember watching that old movie "Blue Chips" about the college game. There's just nothing like that experience. Running onto the court with your teammates, thousands of alumni cheering for you. High School is one thing, but the college experience is something that has been underrated. You're plays, and how you rely on your teammates. Don't get me wrong, I have my issues with the NCAA. But for a player's development, it's extremely important and now it's becoming evident in the NBA.

Anyway, hopefully the USA will beat Greece tomorrow and restore some of their confidence and build up to a great finish. The lineup will without question be different. But hopefully they'll play with intensity and desire. Hell, I think they won't have a choice - it's going to be rowdy in that colliseum.






On a side note - anyone else notice how empty some of the stands have been in the Olympics in general?

[SoccerScout]

I'm a loser without anything better to do than to insult moderators.

[Alberto]

Great post by brother House. That's what stinks about todays NBA. Man I miss Bird and Magic, Stockton and Jordan. These were consumate team players and fundamentally complete players. I love bounce passes like Magic and Bird made. What vision. Damn I miss those guys.

[Alex_1]

Great post by brother House. That's what stinks about todays NBA. Man I miss Bird and Magic, Stockton and Jordan. These were consumate team players and fundamentally complete players. I love bounce passes like Magic and Bird made. What vision. Damn I miss those guys.

That's just it. Fundamentals. I mean for God's sake, it pisses me off that kids aren't really taught them these days. It's so much different than 10-15 years ago even. Shooting jump shots, spot shots. I mean, just standard, basic drills for a work-out. You have a rebounder, and you sit in one spot. He throws you a ball, you shoot. Do 20 of them at each spot. Not three's, just routine jumpers. Free-throws? You take at least 100 during a practice session. Bounce passes. Go down the line, pass the ball to a teammate. Have a coach drill it into your head to use a bounce instead of an air no-look every darn time. Dribbling? How about suicides with a ball at full speed? Cones?

I too miss seeing guys like Magic or Bird or Jordan play. The game came so simple to them... but never underestimate them because they knew the game and worked freakin' hard to get to that level of performance. They were blessed with talent but worked so hard to hone it and refine it. I'm not saying that players today don't work at all. Its just not on their level. Flash is great, but seeing a play executed with a stroke of brilliance...

[microbrew]

I don't buy into the college arguement at all. Everyone but two players played collegiate ball. The system's flaws begin before college basketball and doesn't end there either.

Case Study- 2004 Olympic US Power Forwards:
Compare Carlos Boozer vs. Amare Stoudamare; I wouldn't have taken either to Greece, much less Emeka Okafor.

The NBA's best players have the complete skills, but the drop off after the top players is pretty steep. In particular: outside shooting, point guards and big men (especially centers).

Personally, I'm going to stop complaining, stop analyzing and just watch the damn games. It's like the NCAA tournament, where the big schools get beat by the small ones.

Also, answer the challenge: Olympic Challenge - pick your own damn 12 man squad (http://www.bigsoccer.com/forum/showthread.php?t=128412)

[soccernutter]

Whats with the merging of all the basketball threads. You moderators suck the life out of these boards. Let the freaking forum breath for a change!!!

These 1000 post threads suck!

Start a thread on something other than basketball. :rolleyes:

PM going your way

[SwissGCZ]

I'm not so sure about shortening the season, though they could definitely shorten the playoffs a little bit my eliminating some teams. But I think they would be willing to adopt the FIBA rules if they made the game more entertaining. After all the NBA is all about entertainment.

But before that happens, the marketing of the game would have to change dramatically and that probably involves a bit of a cultural change.

Basketball in this country has become LeBron/Kobe/Showtime/Street Ball and is not at all about Team. Nike has helped develop this image because they sell their shoes to kids who buy into it and the NBA has embraced it because glitz sells. This hasn't been an overnight development by any means. It began in the early 80's with Magic/Bird then took off big time with Jordan.

Unfortunately, the game I grew up loving, is closer now to the international game than the horrible product the NBA puts out. And now we've got a couple of generations of fans who think today's NBA is the greatest thing going.

The only way I see this changing is if the US continues to get its ass kicked (i.e. finishes last) at a high profile event like the Olympics -- or if a team with 3 or 4 or maybe even 5 foreigners in its starting lineup wins an NBA title.

Both of these scenarios could well occur within the next decade so maybe that's how long it will take for things to change.

I agree with you 100%.

[Alberto]

Tea Men Tom a great post. Sadly, the point made in your post will be lost on most who will blame the ref's or not having Kobe or whomever else declined or could not play because of prior obligation and that's delusional.

[Tea Men Tom]

Tea Men Tom a great post. Sadly, the point made in your post will be lost on most who will blame the ref's or not having Kobe or whomever else declined or could not play because of prior obligation and that's delusional.

You know that all being said, all of a sudden, this becomes a very interesting tournament to me. We know the US team is very flawed, but at the same time they have some great athletes who have talent, and a very good (though exasperated, judging from his comments today) coach.

It'll be interesting to see if they can pull this off. They've got to generate a transition game in order to win and that starts with a smothering defense -- which they're capable of playing, but the question is are they WILLING to play it?

Also because everyone else except them can shoot 3's, they're going to have to generate a ton of transition points.

In the game against Greece they'll be heading into a snake pit, but a situation like this can also pull a team together. Plus I've got a feeling the Greeks won't play a lot of defense. I would look for the US to bounce back, but it should be an intriguing game to watch.

I'm betting Iverson and Duncan come up big.

[SoccerScout]

Predictions for the GREECE GAME?

I say USA 97 x 83 Greece.

[Alberto]

We'll find out starting at 3:15 pm today on I believe USA network.

[Alex_1]

Tea Men Tom a great post. Sadly, the point made in your post will be lost on most who will blame the ref's or not having Kobe or whomever else declined or could not play because of prior obligation and that's delusional.

What does that cheap shot have to do with anything? :rolleyes: So some people have a different opinion than yours. Big ********in' deal... get over it already.

You know that all being said, all of a sudden, this becomes a very interesting tournament to me. We know the US team is very flawed, but at the same time they have some great athletes who have talent, and a very good (though exasperated, judging from his comments today) coach.

It'll be interesting to see if they can pull this off. They've got to generate a transition game in order to win and that starts with a smothering defense -- which they're capable of playing, but the question is are they WILLING to play it?

Also because everyone else except them can shoot 3's, they're going to have to generate a ton of transition points.

I'm betting Iverson and Duncan come up big.

Snipped a bit of it. The transition game is huge - it's an area where the USA misses having a true poing guard like Bibby and Kidd. For the missed threes, you have a big man grab the board and throw the outlet to the wings, and a PG that isn't afraid to hit the middle of the court. It seems like Marbury should be great at doing this, but so far he hasn't. The thing is, I wonder how the gameplan could change if the USA starts pushing the ball more (something they didn't do the last time out, and were forcd into playing half-court sets) effectively. They have a few options, but we'll have to see.

I hope they play better. I believe they weill - hard to play worse than they already have. They'll be far more intense and they've had 48 hours to get angry over the result.

[Alberto]

What does that cheap shot have to do with anything? :rolleyes: So some people have a different opinion than yours. Big ********in' deal... get over it already.



Snipped a bit of it. The transition game is huge - it's an area where the USA misses having a true poing guard like Bibby and Kidd. For the missed threes, you have a big man grab the board and throw the outlet to the wings, and a PG that isn't afraid to hit the middle of the court. It seems like Marbury should be great at doing this, but so far he hasn't. The thing is, I wonder how the gameplan could change if the USA starts pushing the ball more (something they didn't do the last time out, and were forcd into playing half-court sets) effectively. They have a few options, but we'll have to see.

I hope they play better. I believe they weill - hard to play worse than they already have. They'll be far more intense and they've had 48 hours to get angry over the result.

It wasn't directed at you and you need to be less defensive. It was directed specifically at writers that had their articles linked on this thread.

[CyphaPSU]

This team needs to start playing for the name on their chest, not the ones on their backs.

I just read Dick Vitale's idea of what should be done to reform our approach to putting together Olympic and National teams for basketball.

He suggests we take the NBA champion and send them--and add three or so alternate guys to make up for any foreigners who may have been on the NBA championship squad.

I actually kind of like that idea. This way you have an actual team playing, not an NBA All-Star squad of guys who are all used to being #1 on their respective teams.

Read Dickie V's article (http://espn.go.com/dickvitale/vcolumn040817TeamUSA-future.html).

[CyphaPSU]

This team needs to start playing for the name on their chest, not the ones on their backs.

Just to add on to that comment:

Maybe Larry Brown should have considered removing the player's names from the back of their jerseys. So many other countries do not put the individual players' names on the jerseys.

I know USA Basketball and NBA marketing would have fits if Brown did this, but it's not like we don't know who the players already are and I think doing something like that would send a real statement of solidarity to the team--that it's ALL about the name they wear on the FRONT of their jerseys. You play together as one unit because you have been chosen to represent the United States of America to your best ability.

[SoccerScout]

V's idea was used by Brazil in the 1984 Olympics in Soccer. Brazil in 84 was strugling putting an Olympic Soccer team together and in the middle of last minute confusion CBF decided to send a club side to the LA games.

The Club chosen was my club Internacional which at the time had a good team but wasnt the current Brazilian Champ. Some slots were filled with other players from other teams (like Gilmar filling in for Uruguayan Rubem Paz). Brazil/Inter as we called it took the Silver medal falling to France in the final in front of 100K fans. The Silver wasnt all that bad for a club side.

Brazil is still looking for the Gold.

PS: I like the idea. I think that it would be considered an extra AWARD for the Champs to go to the Olympics instead of being invited. Remember people crave what they cant get. Earning the ride to the Games would make it more attractive than an "expected" invatation.