England's talent pool runs dry

[Grah]

in 2002 this was said
August 23 2002
With star imports flooding the Premier League there are fears that a new wave of Beckhams and Owens will not surface, writes Robert Millward in London.
It's the English Premier League but the English players are disappearing fast.
When the 20 clubs kicked off the new season last weekend, just 88 English players ran out onto the field alongside 132 from 42 other nations. With the disparity growing by the season, players' union officials fear it might be even more difficult for the national team to discover another David Beckham, Michael Owen or Steven Gerrard.
http://www.smh.com.au/articles/2002/08/23/1029114167696.html?oneclick=true



IS THIS STILL TRUE?

I haven't compiled the stats for this weekend but how many English players are actually in the EPL?

ANd out of them who can really be picked for England?

[jpatel1508]

It's not like they produced many anyways. Has Beckham, Owen, and Gerrard ever combined to win anything for England yet? They world class players, but they don't have the edge or the ability to ever be considered in the class of the truly greats that have lead their nation to victory.

If only Sven allows more young players to come through. He needs to spot talent in the reserves and lower divisions too.
Don't expect anything from Milner and Rooney. Although they have started playing at a young age, they don't have that killer creativity instinct that could lift England to glory. Rooney doesn't have all the tools and Milner is too slow. England have no artistic talent and we will probably never see them ever playing short passes.

However, the future is kinda looking bright. In four years, guys like David Bentley, Ryan Smith, Justin Hoyte, Jon Stead, and probably a few more from the lower divisions will hopefully make the breakthrough.

[billyireland]

It's not like they produced many anyways. Has Beckham, Owen, and Gerrard ever combined to win anything for England yet? They world class players, but they don't have the edge or the ability to ever be considered in the class of the truly greats that have lead their nation to victory.

If only Sven allows more young players to come through. He needs to spot talent in the reserves and lower divisions too.
Don't expect anything from Milner and Rooney. Although they have started playing at a young age, they don't have that killer creativity instinct that could lift England to glory. Rooney doesn't have all the tools and Milner is too slow. England have no artistic talent and we will probably never see them ever playing short passes.

However, the future is kinda looking bright. In four years, guys like David Bentley, Ryan Smith, Justin Hoyte, Jon Stead, and probably a few more from the lower divisions will hopefully make the breakthrough.
Rooney not good enough to bring England anything? They got the the Euro 2004 quarter finals, some might say, on his back. If the entire team had performed like he did at Euro's they would have probably come out winners.

[sinner78]

Don't expect anything from Milner and Rooney. Although they have started playing at a young age, they don't have that killer creativity instinct that could lift England to glory. Rooney doesn't have all the tools and Milner is too slow. England have no artistic talent and we will probably never see them ever playing short passes.

.

dear oh dear.
Just when you think its safe to post on the premiership forum again another retard shows up .
Rooney is a gem .Great scorer and creator .

[sendorange]

Milner too slow :D :D Oh that's classic! Quick enough to shine on the wing despite preferring playing in the centre. Quicker than Beckham, Ljunberg and other top wide players. Quick enough at 18 years old to be a first team player at a top 5 team already and the youngest Premiership goalscorer.

Yeah if only Sven lets younger players through and picks some lower division players. Not aging Premiership veterans like Wright-Phillips, Jenas, King, Johnson, Defoe, Smith and those 30 somethings Owen, Gerrard, Cole, Lampard and Terry.

Good grief.

[nicephoras]

This is invitably a stupid discussion. The England players that are pushed out of the Premiership are never ones that could play for England (with very rare exceptions). And if they are, they're quickly bought by Premiership teams. (See: West Ham.)
So the decrease in English talent is really just a decrease in talent that would never see the national team anyway. Foolish argument.

[jpatel1508]

Milner doesn't do anything special even though he's playing regularly. Sure he's only 18, but he doesn't have enough pace or strength. He's always losing the ball when he tries to take players on. He could get better as he is only 18, but just because he's 18 doesn't make him a hit for England. The type of players England need more of are guys that are strong and can dribble fast...ex. Gerrard and Dyer (should get more of an opportunity). They also need more technique in their strikers. All of the strikers are poachers. When Owen came out and burst into the scene in WC 98, I thought things had changed. Owen played so freely and could really take on players with the ball. The goal vs. Argentine was classic. But since he was named European player of the year 3 seasons ago and his injuires, he's never been the same exciting player.
Also, just because Rooney was the best attacking player for the last WC for England, how do you know he's gonna keep up his form. The injury he sustained could make all the hype on Rooney go down.
Age doesn't always mean everything. Some players breakthrough later 21 or 22 and they're better.

[michaec]

What a ridiculous point on Rooney. Anyone can be off form. He was the best player England had in the European Championships and if when he comes back he plays at the same level he will be first choice for England. If he plays crap, he won't be, same as any other player. Now certain players may get more leeway because of their past performance and experience, I mean, you would expect Beckham or Owen to be given a few games to find their form if they haven't been playing at their best due to their experience and proven international quality. The same couldn't be said of someone like Joe Cole (it's just an example Chelsea fans!) who has been in and out of the side and hasn't proved himself at that level.

[Colm]

I wouldn't say Englands Talent pool is running out, its the same as any other top League, theres lots of forgien players in the leagues and youngsters find it hard to get into the first teams...England does have a lot of good young players around...just look at Tottenham and Aston Villa and see the young English players they have playing in the first team :)

[Mobile]

It's not like they produced many anyways. Has Beckham, Owen, and Gerrard ever combined to win anything for England yet? They world class players, but they don't have the edge or the ability to ever be considered in the class of the truly greats that have lead their nation to victory.

If only Sven allows more young players to come through. He needs to spot talent in the reserves and lower divisions too.
Don't expect anything from Milner and Rooney. Although they have started playing at a young age, they don't have that killer creativity instinct that could lift England to glory. Rooney doesn't have all the tools and Milner is too slow. England have no artistic talent and we will probably never see them ever playing short passes.

However, the future is kinda looking bright. In four years, guys like David Bentley, Ryan Smith, Justin Hoyte, Jon Stead, and probably a few more from the lower divisions will hopefully make the breakthrough.

What are you talking about you complete dickhead?

[Prenn]

Milner doesn't do anything special even though he's playing regularly. Sure he's only 18, but he doesn't have enough pace or strength. He's always losing the ball when he tries to take players on. He could get better as he is only 18, but just because he's 18 doesn't make him a hit for England. The type of players England need more of are guys that are strong and can dribble fast...ex. Gerrard and Dyer (should get more of an opportunity). They also need more technique in their strikers. All of the strikers are poachers. When Owen came out and burst into the scene in WC 98, I thought things had changed. Owen played so freely and could really take on players with the ball. The goal vs. Argentine was classic. But since he was named European player of the year 3 seasons ago and his injuires, he's never been the same exciting player.
Also, just because Rooney was the best attacking player for the last WC for England, how do you know he's gonna keep up his form. The injury he sustained could make all the hype on Rooney go down.
Age doesn't always mean everything. Some players breakthrough later 21 or 22 and they're better.

uh huh.

[Freddy Garcia Lives]

Also, just because Rooney was the best attacking player for the last WC for England, how do you know he's gonna keep up his form.

WC?
Did any of you see Rooney logging many minutes in Japan? Could of sworn he was a 16 yr old then and not even on national team. But I do remember him having a heck of a Euro tourney. He is a very creative player that moves the ball around very well. Rooney defies what most people like to rip on England for, creative short passes. His ability to come back for the ball, move it around, and to get himself into position to recieve a pass is what sets him apart. Doesn't hurt that he is a pretty good finisher also.

I think that there is a bit of give and take on English players in the premiere. I think having so many players from abroad does hurt the chances of some young English talent from getting the chance to develop properly on the 1st team (thus becoming the type of player that could fit into the national team pool, some don't blosom as players untill they are in their twenties). On the other hand I think it does push the players that are on the first teams to be better. Better compition means better development.

I think it would help to have more players playing in other leagues to have a more balanced football experiance as far as styles go. Many players from across Europe play in three or four leagues as they develop (i.e. A player may start in the Netherlands, move to Series A, and then onto the Premiere). I think this makes them better suited for the international game. So I wish more English players would try their luck in other leagues (no matter what it did to McManaman).

[Matt Clark]

Milner doesn't do anything special even though he's playing regularly.

******** me ... this sort of lobotomised nonsense is supposed to keep us amused during the off-season. What possible excuse could you have for excreting this utter, utter, ********tard "opinion" on here now? The season's kicked off! We no longer have need of retards to pass the long summer days!!

Milner has 34 senior appearances to his name. In total. Ever. In his life. In the history of James Milner. And six of those were on loan at Swindon when he was about 3 years old.

You utter spastic.

Sure he's only 18, but he doesn't have enough pace or strength. He's always losing the ball when he tries to take players on.

I'm going to do you the by no means deserved service of assuming that you are just some teenage troll who feels that life with your name next to this sort of drivel may not be perfect, but it's still preferable to the aching silence of the rest of your life.

Now ******** off. If you could ******** off in a "die in a horrific traffic accident" sort of a way, that would be an added bonus for all those of us who have wasted precious seconds and several kilojoules of energy moving our eyes along the drivel you had the temerity to post here, amongst the adults.

Seriously. I hope you die. Today. That's how risible your contribution here is. Regulars will tell you that I am possibly the person blessed with the sunniest demeanour on the whole of Bigsoccer and even I hope that you watch parts of your internal organs get covered in roadside gravel before the day is out. Just imagine what is going through the minds of other, less amiable folk around here. It doesn't bear thinking about, to be honest. It's almost too terrible to contemplate. In fact, it might be worth considering sparing yourself the awful torment of suffering the whole range of opprobrium that may yet rain down upon you by just jumping off the nearest bridge. We would all be immensely cheered by the idea that your spine has recently arrowed up through the fleshy, walnut-sized mess of your "Brain" and your pelvis looks like a particularly sticky example of a retirement-home crazy paving patio.

[royalstilton]

If only Sven allows more young players to come through. He needs to spot talent in the reserves and lower divisions too.
---
Watch out, Matt. This kid is on first names with the gaffer. He might be able to get your mod status yanked.

Ok. I've done my duty.

But look. Don't you think that SGE is in the business of scouting talent? The guy goes to every match imaginable himself and I'm betting that he sends his thugs out to the Essex 6th form championships to see if there are any 12 year olds who can play on the right as any proper NT manager would.

I know he's Skandahoovian or something but they practically invented socialism so I bet that if pushed Ericksson can manage to comb the countryside for the lads that will keep the home side near the top of the world stage. If not, it's back to Skandahoovia, for sure.

[Matt Clark]

I don't care if he's on first names with God's chauffeur. There's no excuse for being a cretin.

[billyireland]

Erm, jpatel... take a guess how many international caps James "playing reguarly" Milner has?

[Motterman]

I don't care if he's on first names with God's chauffeur. There's no excuse for being a cretin.
I think he's Danny Murphy.

[18214]

******** me ... this sort of lobotomised nonsense is supposed to keep us amused during the off-season. What possible excuse could you have for excreting this utter, utter, ********tard "opinion" on here now? The season's kicked off! We no longer have need of retards to pass the long summer days!!

Milner has 34 senior appearances to his name. In total. Ever. In his life. In the history of James Milner. And six of those were on loan at Swindon when he was about 3 years old.

You utter spastic.



I'm going to do you the by no means deserved service of assuming that you are just some teenage troll who feels that life with your name next to this sort of drivel may not be perfect, but it's still preferable to the aching silence of the rest of your life.

Now ******** off. If you could ******** off in a "die in a horrific traffic accident" sort of a way, that would be an added bonus for all those of us who have wasted precious seconds and several kilojoules of energy moving our eyes along the drivel you had the temerity to post here, amongst the adults.

Seriously. I hope you die. Today. That's how risible your contribution here is. Regulars will tell you that I am possibly the person blessed with the sunniest demeanour on the whole of Bigsoccer and even I hope that you watch parts of your internal organs get covered in roadside gravel before the day is out. Just imagine what is going through the minds of other, less amiable folk around here. It doesn't bear thinking about, to be honest. It's almost too terrible to contemplate. In fact, it might be worth considering sparing yourself the awful torment of suffering the whole range of opprobrium that may yet rain down upon you by just jumping off the nearest bridge. We would all be immensely cheered by the idea that your spine has recently arrowed up through the fleshy, walnut-sized mess of your "Brain" and your pelvis looks like a particularly sticky example of a retirement-home crazy paving patio.



DECAF!!!!!!

[billyireland]

Regulars will tell you that I am possibly the person blessed with the sunniest demeanour on the whole of Bigsoccer...Oh God... give me a second... I've got to get my breath back... that's just too much.

Seriously though Matt, such intense flaming is really uncalled for. I mean, if you were not a mod you would stand a good chance of being carded, or at least warned, but c'est la vie. Such idiocy should be met with constructive criticism... or light sarcasm. But that was going a little over the edge, imho.

[sendorange]

Matt's post was brilliant.