IMO - A new ranking system is needed

[mcruic]

I think (along with countless others) that FIFA still needs to have a better ranking system. They have already tinkered with it, but it has major flaws. It does not reflect current playing strengths and we have to wait a month before the next one. Why isn't it updated after every game. I have a ranking system base on the ELO system, which also includes non-FIFA countries (240 countries altogether) which I believe is much better than the FIFA system as you can actually look at it and see which teams are better than others. I believe the following are a few puzzling aspects of FIFA's system.

1) - Why is Brazil always top? Sure, they won the World Cup - but that was 2 years ago. Their form since then has hardly been memorable. (Defeats to Paraguay, Portugal, Cameroon, Mexico (twice) - draws with Chile, Peru, Paraguay, Uruguay, Turkey, Ireland, Mexico & China)

2) - Why are Mexico and USA both in the top 10?

3) - Why is Turkey 5th equal after losing out to Latvia in the Euro 2004 qualifiers? (I presume that these last 2 are legacies of the World Cup also)

4) - Why is Australia ranked so lowly? They have proven in the Confederations Cup and in friendly matches that they can compete with Top 20 nations. Before the recent World Cup Qualifiers, they were ranked about 80th. Victories over giants such as Tahiti, Vanuatu, Fiji and New Zealand, not to mention a draw with the powerful Solomon Islands were obviously enough to propel them over 30 places up the rankings.

5) - Teams who are active gain points. This seems OK, but then in the recent OFC qualifiers, why did all the OFC nations improve their ranking? Surely it would make sense that some of them would lose points? This gives an unfair advantage to teams who play more games.

6) - There are numerous other puzzles
- Why is Thailand ranked above Chile?
- Why is Sri Lanka ranked above Kazakhstan?
- Why is Tonga ranked above New Caledonia (even though New Caledonia beat Tonga 8-0 recently in a World Cup Qualifier).

7) - FIFA should try to make the sytem as representative as possible, because so much now depends on it (seedings for qualification groups, finals tournaments for example). It is no longer just a trivial ranking - it has a bearing on the outcome of future tournaments.

FIFA - WORLD
1 Brazil
2 France
3 Spain
4 Mexico
5= Argentina
5= Netherlands
5= Turkey
8 Germany
9 USA
10 Italy
11 Czech Republic
12 Cameroon
13 England
14 Ireland
15 Denmark
16 Nigeria
17 Belgium
18 Sweden
19 Iran
20=Croatia
20=South Korea

MY - WORLD
1 Czech Republic
2 France
3 Brazil
4 Spain
5 Argentina
6 England
7 Italy
8 Netherlands
9 Greece
10 Mexico
11 Sweden
12 Portugal
13 Turkey
14 Ireland
15 Denmark
16 Romania
17 Germany
18 USA
19 Croatia
20 Belgium

[Premium Hamatachi redded]

still a garbage ranking... usa on 18th? they should be in top 30. italy? greece? mexico? what are those weaklings doing there? where's japan? what a load of crap

[mcruic]

still a garbage ranking... usa on 18th? they should be in top 30. italy? greece? mexico? what are those weaklings doing there? where's japan? what a load of crap

Japan is in 24th, where they should be. This is still the highest-placed Asian nation. Greece are in the Semi-Finals of Euro 2004 and recently beat France. USA & Mexico both reached the quarter-finals of the World Cup 2002.

Since the World Cup, Japan has lost to Senegal, Argentina (twice), South Korea, France, Colombia & Hungary. They hsave had a few good results (beating the Czech Republic was outstanding) but a few good results does not merit inclusion in the Top 20. Still, they are a top quality team.

[ZeekLTK]

I think the only thing that needs to be changed is the rule that teams cannot get negative points. Brazil is still #1 because they got so many d*mn points from the last 2 World Cups that no one else can catch them. If they win or draw a match, they just add to that total but if they lose then they don't go down any. Like you said, Oceania just had qualifying and EVERY team moved up. That's because they all gained points for wins/draws and didn't lose any for games they lost. The only teams who didn't move up were American Samoa and Cook Islands... because they lost all of their games. FIFA just needs to make it so that teams lose points when they lose games and I think the rankings would be much better.

[cajun___soccer]

I can't believe you think that Czech can beat Brazil that's terrible. I might give it to France because they beat em in 98 but that was a long time ago things have changed. I don't like how you have Spain 4th I think Germany, a huge powerhouse in Europe, can rape Spain, Portugal, Sweden, Romania, and Ireland. You get the picture. Your rankings suck, just because a team has proven themselves at a small little tourny doesn't mean they should be ranked 1st, when was the last time the Czech even made the world cup. Yet alone advace threw. I also think the US should be ranked higher. Here are my rankings.

1. Brazil
2. France
3. Argentina
4. England
5. Italy
6. Turkey
7. Netherlands
8. Mexico
9. US
10. Sweden
11. Portugal
12. Czech
13. Denmark
14. Ireland
15. Greece
16. Belgium???
17. Croatia
18. South Korea
19. Russia
20. Poland

[Tigerpunk]

Japan is in 24th, where they should be. This is still the highest-placed Asian nation. Greece are in the Semi-Finals of Euro 2004 and recently beat France. USA & Mexico both reached the quarter-finals of the World Cup 2002.

Since the World Cup, Japan has lost to Senegal, Argentina (twice), South Korea, France, Colombia & Hungary. They hsave had a few good results (beating the Czech Republic was outstanding) but a few good results does not merit inclusion in the Top 20. Still, they are a top quality team.

I know this is a petty point but Mexico clearly did NOT reach the quarterfinals in 2002.

[jhawkinva]

I don't think anybody but Brazil should be first, but the Czechs at 12? They are porbably the second best team in the world right now, with France third.

Mcruic, the problem with yours is that recent results count too much. How are you going to have Greece as the 8th best team in the world, regardless of how well they do in Euro?

I do agree though that Turkey at 5 is garbage considering they haven't done much since WC02.

[Ilovecolombia redded]

Japan is in 18th place but colombia beat japan so why isnt colombia on the top 20?

France was beat by greece so why isnt it in the top 20?


Colombia beat uruguay and peru teams brazil tied to why isnt colombia in the top 20?

[eldiablito]

MY - WORLD
1 Czech Republic
2 France
3 Brazil
4 Spain
5 Argentina
6 England
7 Italy
8 Netherlands
9 Greece
10 Mexico
11 Sweden
12 Portugal
13 Turkey
14 Ireland
15 Denmark
16 Romania
17 Germany
18 USA
19 Croatia
20 Belgium

Everytime I read these threads I laugh because it's really splitting hairs. I think when you see next months FIFA rankings--they are going to look suprisingly similar to what you have just posted (with a couple African or Asian teams taking the place of Romania and Belgium).

[Casper]

Everytime I read these threads I laugh because it's really splitting hairs. I think when you see next months FIFA rankings--they are going to look suprisingly similar to what you have just posted (with a couple African or Asian teams taking the place of Romania and Belgium).
Complaining about the FIFA rankings over-rating a single World Cup performance, and then turning right around and massively over-rating a single European Cup performance is downright hilarious. Greece is clearly at least #8 and the Czechs are #1 if we go exclusively by the results of the last three weeks. But don't you want to consider the possibility that results over the last several years should matter? How can you complain about the World Cup champion being ranked #1? I would think that the World Cup champion should always be considered strongly for the #1 slot, just as the European champion should be considered pretty high up.

As for the Oceania anomalies - that doesn't seem like a huge problem. Any time you try to come up with an arbitrary system, there will be bizarre anomalies if every team does not play exactly the same schedule. Heavily weighting recent results of meaningful matches means teams will spike when they are most active.

ELO systems have major issues as well, particularly with respect to assigning far too much importance to single matches. You can try to justify the Czechs as #1 IF they win the Euro, but if they don't, how can you say they're clearly better than Portugal/Greece/Netherlands?

The ranking remains trivial to seeding. FIFA winds up using magic tricks to justify seeding for the World Cup, so the rankings remain just an indicator and a talking point. The only teams whose rankings are majorly off-kilter either a) have some excellent recent results that you're not giving much credit to (US and Mexico), or b) don't play many matches (Australia).

[TheGoose]

2) - Why are Mexico and USA both in the top 10?


Because they can compete with and defeat any of the other top ten teams on any given day. What baffles me is how Mexico can be so far ahead of the US in the Fifa and your rankings, when, since 2000, the US has won 6, lost 1, and drawn 1 against Mexico.

[Tellah]

still a garbage ranking... usa on 18th? they should be in top 30. italy? greece? mexico? what are those weaklings doing there? where's japan? what a load of crap


Where's JAPAN??? Come on, just because you have cartoons that depict Japan as the best team in the world doesn't mean that they're REALLY that good.

[Premium Hamatachi redded]

Because they can compete with and defeat any of the other top ten teams on any given day. What baffles me is how Mexico can be so far ahead of the US in the Fifa and your rankings, when, since 2000, the US has won 6, lost 1, and drawn 1 against Mexico.

what a load of crap. they both suck and should never be in top 20 even top 30.

[Premium Hamatachi redded]

I know this is a petty point but Mexico clearly did NOT reach the quarterfinals in 2002.

and usa beat their concacaf fellow mexico to go to quarter final while they kept begging 24/7 when they almost got eliminated in the first round after losing to the weak poland 1-3. since then what have they done to get them in the top 20 spot? all i remember is their sick performance in the confede cup. their claim often makes me vomit

[Premium Hamatachi redded]

Where's JAPAN??? Come on, just because you have cartoons that depict Japan as the best team in the world doesn't mean that they're REALLY that good.

shut up idiot

[LEPE]

shut up idiot
.....................................................................................

Don't worry, One day your ..father,Fughorn-Leghorn,will
initiate you in the complicated and 'unbiased' world of
football and then you will see why US is rated higher than Japan and other countries!
Until then, keep you little chiken beak..closed!!

[LEPE]

I can't believe you think that Czech can beat Brazil that's terrible. I might give it to France because they beat em in 98 but that was a long time ago things have changed. I don't like how you have Spain 4th I think Germany, a huge powerhouse in Europe, can rape Spain, Portugal, Sweden, Romania, and Ireland. You get the picture. Your rankings suck, just because a team has proven themselves at a small little tourny doesn't mean they should be ranked 1st, when was the last time the Czech even made the world cup. Yet alone advace threw. I also think the US should be ranked higher. Here are my rankings.

1. Brazil
2. France
3. Argentina
4. England
5. Italy
6. Turkey
7. Netherlands
8. Mexico
9. US
10. Sweden
11. Portugal
12. Czech
13. Denmark
14. Ireland
15. Greece
16. Belgium???
17. Croatia
18. South Korea
19. Russia
20. Poland
...................................................................................

Germany can rape Romania anytime they want??

Well,that shows how much you know about footbal and why nobody should take your list seriously!!
For you information, it was quite the ..reverse!! A second string romanian team 'violated'(rape is an ugly word) Germany so bad that they never recovered even at the Euros! 5-1!! si that the rape you're talking about??
Stop acting like you know something!!!

Czech rep. in 12 th??

You are a nincampoop!! Is not even what they do at the Euros, do you know what they've been doing for the past 2 years? jesus

[Kaushik]

I can't believe you think that Czech can beat Brazil that's terrible. I might give it to France because they beat em in 98 but that was a long time ago things have changed. I don't like how you have Spain 4th I think Germany, a huge powerhouse in Europe, can rape Spain, Portugal, Sweden, Romania, and Ireland. You get the picture. Your rankings suck, just because a team has proven themselves at a small little tourny doesn't mean they should be ranked 1st, when was the last time the Czech even made the world cup. Yet alone advace threw. I also think the US should be ranked higher. Here are my rankings.

1. Brazil
2. France
3. Argentina
4. England
5. Italy
6. Turkey
7. Netherlands
8. Mexico
9. US
10. Sweden
11. Portugal
12. Czech
13. Denmark
14. Ireland
15. Greece
16. Belgium???
17. Croatia
18. South Korea
19. Russia
20. PolandI would rank the top 10 teams as:

1. Brazil
2. Czech Republic
3. France
4. Portugal
5. Italy
6. Argentina
7. England
8. Netherlands
9. Denmark
10. Spain

[LEPE]

I would rank the top 10 teams as:

1. Brazil
2. Czech Republic
3. France
4. Portugal
5. Italy
6. Argentina
7. England
8. Netherlands
9. Denmark
10. Spain

............................................................................

This is a more realistic top 10 with one exeption: Italy is still to high,they should be...71!

[guado]

haha where's japan... what exactly has japan done to be ahead of the u.s. and mexico? if u go by the rankings, mexico beat brazil twice and won the gold cup(which sadly gave them many points, especiall since they beat brazil in the final) and the u.s. made it farther than japan did in the world cup. the same world cup that japan co-organized and had their fans there.. also, the u.s. lost 1-0 to eventual runner up germany. also , the rankings span over about ten years, in which japan has improved nicely, but has not done more than either mexico or the u.s.
but it is a shame that the rankings seem so arbitrary. mexico is definitely not the 4th best nation and will likely not be 4th best for a while.czech republic has been up there for the past years even though they failed to qualify to the last two world cups and the 2000 eurocup. right now they are no doubt one of the top nations, but they had been ranked second in september of 99 after failing to qualify for teh world cup in 98. the system just seems too random , too faulty.