Another NYC baseball network?

[Red Card]

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=545&ncid=755&e=8&u=/ap/20040601/ap_on_sp_ba_ne/bbn_mets_cablevision

The NY Mets (baseball) told MSG/Cablevision to chuck it. Looks like they will follow the NY Yankees and have their own cable network. I cannot imagine how they will do it since they are not associated with any NHL or NBA teams. The Yankees are/were corporately connected to the Devils and Nets.

When the Yankees left MSG/Cablevision, MSG upped their coverage of the Metrostars. Now that the Mets will be leaving, the question is whether MSG will survive. They still have the Rangers NHL and the Knicks NBA, which are both also owned by Cablevision.

And of course, the 2 NY baseball teams having their own cable networks spells bad news for baseball parity, although the Mets usually find a way to be mediocre no matter how much money they spend.

[ElJefe]

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=545&ncid=755&e=8&u=/ap/20040601/ap_on_sp_ba_ne/bbn_mets_cablevision

The NY Mets (baseball) told MSG/Cablevision to chuck it. Looks like they will follow the NY Yankees and have their own cable network. I cannot imagine how they will do it since they are not associated with any NHL or NBA teams. The Yankees are/were corporately connected to the Devils and Nets.

When the Yankees left MSG/Cablevision, MSG upped their coverage of the Metrostars. Now that the Mets will be leaving, the question is whether MSG will survive. They still have the Rangers NHL and the Knicks NBA, which are both also owned by Cablevision.

And of course, the 2 NY baseball teams having their own cable networks spells bad news for baseball parity, although the Mets usually find a way to be mediocre no matter how much money they spend.
If the Mets try this, they will only prove beyond a shadow of a doubt how stupid they are.

How the hell do they think that they're going to make their own network successful when (a) Cablevision owns most of the cable systems around New York and (b) most single-team sports networks have met with mostly bad results? I don't see the mayor's office going to bat for Amazin' TV (or whatever they want to call it) they way they did for YES. After all, YES offered the single biggest team in all of baseball and would ultimately be carrying both the Nets and the Devils (even if both the Nets and Devils play in Jersey for the time being) as well. They've got something that people want.

If the Mets try this, it'll be a repeat of the Victory Sports One debacle. For those who aren't familiar, VS1 was network that the Minnesota Twins owned. They'd carry Twins games starting this season, some local small college sports, and not much else. Both the Timberwolves and the Wild were going to be staying with the local Fox Sports Net affiliate. Well, despite this compelling lineup, cable systems around Minneapolis-St. Paul decided not to carry VS1, mostly because VS1 wanted too much money to be carried. And neither DirecTV nor DISH Network were slightly interested in carrying VS1, for pretty much the same reason. And barely a month into the VS1's maiden season of Twins coverage, the Twins saw the writing on the wall, pulled the plug on VS1, and signed a new deal with Fox Sports Net.

Now, what will Amazin' TV have? Mets games. And what else? Not the Knicks or Rangers, that's for sure. They're the whole raison d'etre for MSG Network. And the Nets and Devils are pretty much the same story for the YES Network (although the Devils won't be on YES until their deal with MSG/FSNNY expires in a couple of years). That pretty much leaves the Islanders. I guess that Amazin' TV can always swing a lucrative deal to be the home of the Islanders in the winter. :rolleyes: Yeah, the Mets in the spring and summer and the Islanders in the autumn and the winter. That's a lineup that'll have all the local cable systems rushing to sign up.

As for MSG Network, as long as Cablevision owns them and the Knicks and Rangers, they'll always be around. The big question is whether or not Fox Sports Net New York (also owned by Cablevision) would survive if the Mets were foolish enough to start their own cable network.

[ElJefe]

Addendum: About the only way I can see that this new Mets network actually getting on any of the local cable systems (which are mostly owned by Cablevision) is if the Mets partner with Cablevision on co-owning the new channel, the way that the Cubs, White Sox, Blackhawks, and Bulls partnered with Comcast on the new Comcast SportsNet Chicago.

But in Chicago, I could see the motivation for Comcast, since they'd be partial owners of the channel that essentially would be taking away all the teams from Cablevision-owned Fox Sports Net Chicago. I just don't see what's in it for Cablevision, since they already fully own the channels that carry the Mets (MSG Network and Fox Sports Net New York). Why should they be willing to go from full ownership to just partial ownership?

[DAGSports]

The Twins did get something good out of the VS1 deal. FOX Sports Net DOUBLED the rights fee from the previous contract. But they had already negotiated new carriage agreements last year, so we'll see whether this is a money-losing deal for them.

The Mets expect to get more money from Cablevision, and they WILL, because the survival of MSG/FSNY really depends on them.

Without the Mets, MSG Network will almost certainly be sold to Comcast/FOX (partnership), the Knicks and Rangers will be sold to the highest bidder, and Cablevision will sell all of its systems to Time Warner. It is no secret that Time Warner covets Cablevision's 3 million subscribers.

The Devils and Islanders have long term deals with Cablevision. No way either leaves unless they cut big checks AND Comcast is willing to sublicense games of the Nets and Devils or Islanders for CN8. Otherwise, YES would be forced to show a lot of games on tape delay.

[ElJefe]

The Devils and Islanders have long term deals with Cablevision. No way either leaves unless they cut big checks AND Comcast is willing to sublicense games of the Nets and Devils or Islanders for CN8. Otherwise, YES would be forced to show a lot of games on tape delay.
As far as the Devils are concerned, "long term" only means "three more seasons." Their deal with Fox Sports Net New York expires after the 2006-2007 season. Once that happens, they're on YES.

[ElJefe]

The Mets expect to get more money from Cablevision, and they WILL...
Incidentally, I think that this is what will ultimately happen. Fred Wilpon will make all the right noises about starting Amazin' TV for some period of time until Cablevision calls with the right dollar figure, and then, Amazin' TV will be forgotten.

It's basically the same approach that Tom Hicks took in 1999 with the Rangers and Stars local broadcast rights. He was making all sorts of racket about starting his own sports channel centered around the Rangers and Stars. Then all of a sudden, he and Fox are agreeing to a 10-year, $250 million deal to keep half the Rangers and Stars telecasts on Fox Sports Net and a 15-year, $300-million to keep the other half on Fox O&O affiliate KDFW and on Fox-owned independent KDFI.

And when all is said and done, the Rangers have some of the highest revenues in Major League Baseball and the Stars have some of the highest revenues in the NHL, due in no small part to the $45 million a year that they're getting from Fox, just for the local telecasts.

The Mets are currently getting $47 million a year from Cablevision. If they play this right, they can expect Cablevision to cough up a lot more money -- a LOT more money.

[obie]

The only way this makes sense is if they get with the Islanders and focus on LI coverage, but that means they have to negotiate with Cablevision to get on the air. As far as partnerships are concerned, Cablevision wants out of MSG / Rangers / Knicks now, and Wilpon fought like hell to get control of the team two years ago and is not about to relinquish it. So no, I don't expect a deal here.

Either way, once the Devils leave FSNY is a goner. They could sell that channel space for a mint and lose no programming since the Knicks / Rangers runoff games can go to Metro TV.

[nyrmetros]

This is silly. NYC does not need any more sports stations. It's overkill. The YES network can;t even fill all the available time they have.

Here is a list of sports cable stations i get with TWCNYC digital

FSNY
MSG
ESPN
ESPN 2
ESPN News
ESPN Classic
YES
OLN
Golf Channel
Tennis Channel
Speed Channel
FSW
FSW Espanol
FUSE
FS Digital Atlantic, Central, Pacific
NBA TV


I am missing:
College Sports TV
NFL Network
NHL Network (please migrate from Canada)



Does NYC really need another sports cable channel ??

[DAGSports]

This is silly. NYC does not need any more sports stations. It's overkill. The YES network can;t even fill all the available time they have.

Here is a list of sports cable stations i get with TWCNYC digital

FSNY
MSG
ESPN
ESPN 2
ESPN News
ESPN Classic
YES
OLN
Golf Channel
Tennis Channel
Speed Channel
FSW
FSW Espanol
FUSE
FS Digital Atlantic, Central, Pacific
NBA TV


I am missing:
College Sports TV
NFL Network
NHL Network (please migrate from Canada)



Does NYC really need another sports cable channel ??
Not at all.

But just like high school basketball players look at Kobe Bryant and ignore Korleone Young, teams look at YES and Comcast Chicago (a guaranteed winner), not VS1 or Royals TV.

So the Mets will talk the talk until Cablevision writes them a nice big check for about $55-60 million a year.

As for the NHL Network, ESPN has an option to buy stock in it and import it to the US. Unlikely this will happen, now that ESPN has renewed with all the MSOs for the next 10 years.

[nyrmetros]

Seriously, I want my NHL Network! I am missing so much worldwide hockey without this network :(

FOOK NBA and NFL tv.

[da_cfo]

Incidentally, I think that this is what will ultimately happen. Fred Wilpon will make all the right noises about starting Amazin' TV for some period of time until Cablevision calls with the right dollar figure, and then, Amazin' TV will be forgotten.


You are forgetting one thing:

Steinbrenner wants to start YES2 with the Mets as the anchor tenant.

Steinbrenner is the one stirring the pot.

With YES2 up, YES can have the Yankees and Nets, while YES2 can have the Mets and Devils. Neat. Tidy. No conflicts.

(That would leave MSG/FSNY with the Knicks, Rangers, Islanders, and the MetroStars. Cablevision's 3rd sports channel, MetroTV, would be toast.)

There is no secret that Cablevision is under siege, from Time Warner (which wants Cablevision's systems in order to have a virtual monopoly of the NY/NJ/CT cable TV market), Comcast (which wants the 60% stake in FOX Sports Net/National Sports Partnership currently held by Cablevision, plus control of regional sports TV in the San Francisco Bay Area market currently held by Cablevision), and now Steinbrenner (which wants the Mets TV rights to start YES2).

[kenntomasch]

You are forgetting one thing:

Steinbrenner wants to start YES2 with the Mets as the anchor tenant.


I'm guessing he told you that when you and your wife, Morgan Fairchild (who you've seen naked) were having lunch with him, right?

Weren't the Houston Rockets talking about their own network, too, or was that just posturing? I don't think I saw the end result of that one.

Here in Chicago, the new Comcast channel is busy stealing people from Fox Sports Net Chicago. FSN is either going to go away, or be all Best Damn Sports Show and After The Glory all the time, or try to get by with various college teams, the Fire (maybe) and stuff like that. It's less than four months away from launching now, so it should get interesting pretty soon.

[da_cfo]

I'm guessing Steinbrenner told you ...

Weren't the Houston Rockets talking about their own network, too, or was that just posturing? I don't think I saw the end result of that one.

Here in Chicago, the new Comcast channel is busy stealing people from Fox Sports Net Chicago. FSN is either going to go away, or be all Best Damn Sports Show and After The Glory all the time, or try to get by with various college teams, the Fire (maybe) and stuff like that. It's less than four months away from launching now, so it should get interesting pretty soon.

The NY Daily News wrote about YES2 several MONTHS ago. YES2 is OLD NEWS.

There is no way FSN Chicago can stay in business past December 31.

Cablevision's regional sports business is under siege and the only course of action that makes any sense is to sell what is left of FSN Chicago, and possibly FSN Bay Area as well, to Comcast.

Comcast has of course offered a lowball price for Cablevision's regional sports business and Cablevision's 60% share of FOX Sports Net/National Sports Partnership.

The Rockets and Astros hired away a Turner Broadcasting executive to start the new Houston RSN. That RSN will have to sell a piece of itself to Time Warner if it is to have a chance. Houston is a bandwagon sports market and the two Houston teams can't draw flies if they lose. They certainly aren't the Yankees and they don't have the leverage against Time Warner the way the Yankees have leverage against Time Warner and Cablevision.

[da_cfo]

WFAN's "Mike and the Mad Dog" (which is simulcast by YES) is speculating about YES2.

However, NY NewsDay seems to predict that the Mets will go back to Cablevision (MSG/FSNY).

http://www.newsday.com/sports/baseball/mets/ny-spmsg023829179jun02,0,5655785.story?coll=ny-sports-headlines

I personally don't believe Cablevision can stand the heat being put on by Comcast, FOX, Time Warner, and YES that much longer.

It seems that everybody and his brother in the pay TV business are lining up to carve up Cablevision: Time Warner wants the cable systems, Comcast wants Cablevision's RSN business and the majority stake in FOX Sports Net/National Sports Partnership, YES wants more regional sports TV rights so that it can start YES2, and FOX wants the Knicks and Rangers for a quick turnaround sale to make a fast buck.

Watching media behemoths carve up Chuck Dolan's little cable outfit will be fun to watch.

[nyrmetros]

Interesting. The only NYC teams that I care about are the Yankees, Rangers, Knicks, and Metrostars.

I am indifferent to the Mets. I dislike the Nets. I hate the Islanders and Devils.

[DAGSports]

WFAN's "Mike and the Mad Dog" (which is simulcast by YES) is speculating about YES2.

However, NY NewsDay seems to predict that the Mets will go back to Cablevision (MSG/FSNY).

http://www.newsday.com/sports/baseball/mets/ny-spmsg023829179jun02,0,5655785.story?coll=ny-sports-headlines

I personally don't believe Cablevision can stand the heat being put on by Comcast, FOX, Time Warner, and YES that much longer.

It seems that everybody and his brother in the pay TV business are lining up to carve up Cablevision: Time Warner wants the cable systems, Comcast wants Cablevision's RSN business and the majority stake in FOX Sports Net/National Sports Partnership, YES wants more regional sports TV rights so that it can start YES2, and FOX wants the Knicks and Rangers for a quick turnaround sale to make a fast buck.

Watching media behemoths carve up Chuck Dolan's little cable outfit will be fun to watch.
I don't believe the Mets want ANY part of a Steinbrenner owned network. They would be second class citizens, without question (this from a Yankee fan).

However, WFAN may drop the radio broadcasts after next season in favor of the Yankees because they are tied to YES thru "Mike and the Mad Dog".

Oliver, does NewsCorp REALLY believe they can find a decent price for the Knicks and Rangers? Comcast could buy MSG/FSNY, but who other than John Kluge can afford the teams? I don't see any major corporation who would be interested.

[kenntomasch]

The NY Daily News wrote about YES2 several MONTHS ago. YES2 is OLD NEWS.

Well, Newsday speculated about YES2 when it wrote "The Mets receive about $46 million annually from local media rights, and unless YES plans to create a YES2..."

The New York Times wrote on April 12:


One of the more intriguing possibilities is what will happen if Fred
Wilpon buys out his Mets contract with MSG and FSNY. Would he go to YES
or start his own network?

The problem with going to YES is that the network cannot accommodate
another 100 baseball games and would need cable operators to provide
space for YES2, at least on a game-by-game basis.

"The leverage of baseball is such that cable operators can't not take
it," said Lee Berke, an industry consultant.

Even if YES gave the Mets more than the $40 million-plus they get
annually from FSNY, and a chunk of stock, would Wilpon want his team on
the Steinbrenner network? In the 1980's, the Yankees and the Mets
coexisted uneasily at SportsChannel New York until Steinbrenner paid a
buyout to go to MSG. (Emphasis mine)

I found two sources of speculation about a YES2, but not enough that I would say definitively that Steinbrenner not only plans it, he is determined to get the Mets to anchor it. Much less that it's "old news."

Oh, wait, that's right - I'm not you.