And shepherds we shall be power hath descended forth from thy money Transfer thread

[ArsenalTexan3]

Continue here and with the Boondock Saints reference.

http://www.wallpaperbase.com/wallpapers/movie/theboondocksaints/the_boondock_saints_3.jpg

[mebeSajid]

Heh.

[The Jitty Slitter]

Given TR7 is injured all over again - we need to snap into action and buy van der Vaart

Too expensive probably- I don't think there's any way VanDerVaart moves for less than 15m, and I don't think Wenger would pay pay that, not to mention the 90k per week he's probably getting.

Wenger seems to have made it clear what he's going to do- he's going to push Bordeaux as far as he can to get the lowest price on Chamakh (I think there's little doubt we'll get him), and he'll wait to the very last minute to see if he can get a quality d-mid at a cut price. If he doesn't get the d-mid, he'll deny the effort to get one and prattle on about how much he believes in Song and Denilson.

I almost feel like this has been obvious for weeks now, but I have been unwilling to believe it.

Wenger has said this team will win lots when they are 23-24

When does that come about then? 2 more years?

[gunner7]

Here are the top 10 players for FM 2009:

http://betting.betfair.com/sports/oddly-enough/the-10-players-you-must-sign-on-football-manager-2-251108.html

Start buying haha

Apparently that Federico Fazio guy is 6'5!!!!!!!!!

[G dot Ozo]

IMO, the last shareholders' meeting did more bad than good. I have yet to see anything good to come out of it. Coquelin may disagree with your assertion that we aren't developing ball winners. Nortdveit may disagree too, although I think the jury still is out on him.

There isn't even a jury at all. These guys won't be making an impact for ages and I really hope nobody at the club thinks of them as being just around the corner when making first team personnel decisions.

I don't know, I do not believe he is a box to box player, but maybe it's just me

he likes to sit back and destroy like Makelele did

the player who fits what you are talking about, IMO, was that PSG midfielder who was outstanding against Atletico Madrid at the Emirate Cup

If we're switching to this 4-3-3 or any other formation that has more than two in the middle of the park a player who sits back fits way better than a true box to box.

well the point I am making is that he was signed very late and we got him for a very good price... and he was the type of signing that Wenger felt we needed and was better than what we currently had there...

everyone points to last summer and failing to get a central midfielder and think all of Wenger's transfer dealings (or non-dealings) are like that... and then ignore that we signed an (arguably) world class player doing the same thing in January...

basically, stop having selective memories...


true... Wenger should have forked over that 25 million that you believe is sitting in his seat cushion to have made the deal, right? :)

It's not selective memory. As I said before, it was a reactionary purchase. Val expanded on it a bit, but that problem was there, but we did nothing about it until things got to a breaking point. It's not the same situation really. Nobody wants to see that situation repeated.

Refresh my memory, what was the problem then?

The fact we had a back four that faltered at key moment after key moment when the stakes were high, shipped soft goals to weak sides and had a general lack of cohesion. That, and some depth.

Right now we still look like we can't defend, fixing the midfield will get us back to the point where we were right before we lost Flamini and Diarra. Fixing the defense as well will get us over the top.

Everybody screams for a defensive mid but think of this...

Where would he come from, Wenger says this year is make or break and he also says that he has to give any player who doesn't play in the premiership a year to break into it. That would exclude every non exceptional player out of england.

Then if you start looking into england all the quality players who could fit the role are on title contending clubs who don't want to sell us, especially being a rival.

Thirdly, Wenger will not buy just to please everyone, there is no point in buying somebody out of england who is a little bit better than song because who knows if this player will be better than song by the end of the year because song will be improving while this player is adjusting.

Finally, Song improved much last season and there is no reason why he will not continue improving throughout the season and pre-season. Perhaps improve enough to be what everyone is looking for in this transfer season.

If the player is good enough, there isn't going to be this dramatic 'adjusting' period. I don't buy that argument unless the player is experiencing first team football for the first time, or if the player is at the end of their career. We saw it with Rosicky, Sagna, Eduardo, Nasri, Arshavin. Virtually no adjustment period with that lot. Someone of their level for a defensive midfield and central defensive role would make a world of difference to this squad.

Song is close, but not there yet. For all his physical prowess, he still has a massive flaw in his positioning and discipline. That aspect of the game is enough to completely nullify almost everything he does well, because if he isn't where he should be, he can't do his job, and that happens, it means our team is split wide open.

On top of that, we only have Song capable of playing a DM role. If he gets injured, we're screwed. If he has to cover at CB, we're screwed. When he goes to the ANC, we're screwed. As it stands now we're walking on eggshells at times because of his propensity to get caught out. Like I said before, we'd be a lot more stable if we had second DM.

[DaPrince84]

no Vieira according to Sky Sports

http://www.skysports.com/story/0,19528,11661_5484392,00.html

[DaPrince84]

If we're switching to this 4-3-3 or any other formation that has more than two in the middle of the park a player who sits back fits way better than a true box to box.
you took my post out of context...

It's not selective memory. As I said before, it was a reactionary purchase. Val expanded on it a bit, but that problem was there, but we did nothing about it until things got to a breaking point. It's not the same situation really. Nobody wants to see that situation repeated.
it was a reactionary buy? every transfer a club makes is reactionary... that doesnt make much sense to me...

and the situations are similar in that we bled the clock on the transfer window to make the deal... and get it on our terms... it didnt work last summer, it worked in January...

and Val thinks Arsenal has 100 million to spend today, but feels Wenger is being cheap for kicks and giggles... and if you want me to, I can find the post...

[G dot Ozo]

you took my post out of context...


it was a reactionary buy? every transfer a club makes is reactionary... that doesnt make much sense to me...

and the situations are similar in that we bled the clock on the transfer window to make the deal... and get it on our terms... it didnt work last summer, it worked in January...

and Val thinks Arsenal has 100 million to spend today, but feels Wenger is being cheap for kicks and giggles... and if you want me to, I can find the post...

Last summer we weren't in for an attacker though. It was only when we realised Rosicky and Eduardo were still a long way from coming back, combined with Theo and Fabregas having long term injuries that we pulled the trigger on Arshavin. I don't know if we would have bought if they were all available.

The difference is that we need the defensive help, but Wenger seems content to depend on what we have. This is a good assumption considering we were in the exact same position last season and that's what he did. He couldn't be content in January in the Arshavin case, because we literally had nobody.

[DaPrince84]

Last summer we weren't in for an attacker though. It was only when we realised Rosicky and Eduardo were still a long way from coming back, combined with Theo and Fabregas having long term injuries that we pulled the trigger on Arshavin. I don't know if we would have bought if they were all available.
just like signing a centerback this summer was reacting to Kolo's probable move to Man City, right?

its all reactive...

and honestly, I think we would have been in for Arshavin anyway in January... since we never really replaced Hleb
The difference is that we need the defensive help, but Wenger seems content to depend on what we have. This is a good assumption considering we were in the exact same position last season and that's what he did. He couldn't be content in January in the Arshavin case, because we literally had nobody.
I do agree we probably need one more CB... but really, and I have said this for a long time, our TEAM needs to defend better... not just the mythical world class CB who is available right now... it was the biggest difference between 07/08 and 08/09...

[wanye_stirrear]

First of all that our CC sides have a lot of the (young) fringe players from the first team, eg Gibbs, Denilson, Merida, Diaby, etc. That's still a level up from the youth/reserves, which is IIRC Coquelin is. Let's also note that we play 3-5 CC games every year and 38 League games. If we had to play our CC side 38 times, they might not be as successful as they've been.

Okay, let’s see. You said, “The strong majority of our youth/reserve players aren't good enough to hold a regular game anywhere in the BPL, let alone for Arsenal.” I showed you that our CC side, which is comprised of many reserve team players, has run over these PL teams, which shows that our players can compete. (Surely you will recognize that if our team is 50% reserve players, and those players can’t compete with the lower PL players, our team consistently would lose to the PL teams, right?) However, then you talk about how our CC side would do over 38 games, which shows that you totally missed the point.


Really? I think it's pretty much on point. When you have to go down to the youth/reserve level, you have to have numbers to generate quality, because most of those guys aren't going to make it. The fact that we have one guy in that role there isn't enough.

There is more than one person there. I can think of three at the top of my head (Coquelin, Randall, Frimpong) just on the reserve team, and I am sure there are more in the youth teams. I really don’t keep up with it. Not all of them will turn out to be good enough. I simply was pointing out two players that have gotten a lot of praise in the past.

[wanye_stirrear]

There isn't even a jury at all. These guys won't be making an impact for ages and I really hope nobody at the club thinks of them as being just around the corner when making first team personnel decisions.

It probably would help if you read what we were discussing before commenting. No one made that suggestion.

[SLO-Gunner]

and Val thinks Arsenal has 100 million to spend today, but feels Wenger is being cheap for kicks and giggles... and if you want me to, I can find the post...


That is so ridiculous. I myself responded with a post to him with Wenger quotes that refutes this notion that he's sitting on a pile of cash. Wenger has also said that it would be best if all people inside the club "just worked hard and stopped talking" which many conclude is pointed at the directors specifically to stop with the 'Arsene has as much money as he would like' company line we've been hearing for the last couple of years.

[saba]

In most sports after a bit the message gets tuned out and its time for a change. How good were Barca under Frank insert Pep with some new pep and they are firing on all cylinders. I am go to come right out and say its time for a change at the top. Every summer we are beholden to the Frenchman, we hold our collective breaths, and every term its the same the kids will come good. IMHO this should be Wengers last year in charge, he succeeds we are all happy if not then its time to thank him for his contributions to the club and move on

IMHO that is the most important transfer rumor I want to hear this year

[thefoamroses]

I think, if the 4-3-3 happens with 2 holding midfielders (of Song, Denilson, Ramsey, errhh Cesc when Rosicky and/or Nasri are healthy) we don't need another midfielder. We just need commitment from the players there. Positioning, tackling, and discipline. That can be coached in, it need not be bought.

But, at center back, we are lacking. Gallas is good, but he needs someone beside him that is tall, strong and steady. That is how he worked best at Chelsea. Song could do that, but he is better at midfield. We should buy a center back. Hageland, since he has premiership experience, and could shoulder the whole season. The 15 million GBP premium is well worth it, if it means little to no adjustment time.

[phishy]

We don't have enough money to lose wenger.

[JediMindTricks]

Given TR7 is injured all over again - we need to snap into action and buy van der Vaart



Wenger has said this team will win lots when they are 23-24

When does that come about then? 2 more years?

well, for vdv, that would be 2-3 years ago. :D

but i dunno if he'd fit in well if the team is going to play 4-3-3 a lot. he's kind of wasted on the wings and i dunno how effective he'll be in a deeper role. i figured sneijder would be more useful but also a lot more expensive.

[thefoamroses]

We don't have enough money to lose wenger.
The only person who, on this budget, could replace Wenger tomorrow and still keep us in the top four is Mourinho. He would just make us incredibly defensive, buy the right players to do it, and bore us all to death with everything but his press conferences.

I can not think of anyone else who, on day one, could guarantee a top four finnish.

[Rewinder]

The only person who, on this budget, could replace Wenger tomorrow and still keep us in the top four is Mourinho. He would just make us incredibly defensive, buy the right players to do it, and bore us all to death with everything but his press conferences.

I can not think of anyone else who, on day one, could guarantee a top four finnish.

Mourinho cannot work on a 0 budget.

[FabregasTED]

Boondock Saints is an overrated movie.

The Football Manager culture thats taken over these summer periods is a bit sickening to be honest. Am I the only one that actually likes seeing our kids come through the system and perform on the grand stage? To me, all wins are good, but a developed win is worth more than a bought win. It'll mean more if we win the title or the European Cup this year with this team than it could ever mean for Chelsea.
I'm all for filling holes and adding quality to the squad when it's there, but I'm personally happy we don't play the highly leveraged roulette game these so-called "big clubs" do every summer. It all rings a bit hollow.

[thefoamroses]

Mourinho cannot work on a 0 budget.
He would sell Cesc, buy two defensive midfielders, and win 1-nil.

Also, he won the Champions League at Porto on a limited budget. Not the Premier League, nor the quality of year long competition, but still a serious achievement.

Mourinho would only keep us in the top four the short term though, as he doesn't make young talent to sell and buy the way Wenger does.

I am in no way advocating Mourinho. What I'm saying is losing Wenger would mean losing fourth for certain. Keeping him does not mean we'll have it either, but I prefer our chances with him.