Whitecaps: Best supporters ever?

[whiteisthecolour]

I hate to be a realist, but I thought I'd put my 2 cents in about Vancouver's potential as a soccer city. There is a lot of smack TFC/Seattle/DC fans talk about who has the best supporters. Why not get in on the action early?

First, who am I? Born in West Van, raised in the burbs, aware of the first Whitecaps incarnation (though I was only about 6yo), fan of the 86ers/Whitecaps from about 1993 on, season tickets the one season I had a car and could actually make it to all the matches, proud member of the Blue & White Brigade (RIP), Caps fan till I die.

But I don't think that the Caps will be the best supported team. On the other hand, I think they will. It depends on how you look at it. If by best supported you mean best supporters groups, I don't think Vancouver will be the best supported. If by best supported you mean citywide awareness and support, then I think the Caps WILL be the best supported.

The only supporters group that exists right now is the Southsiders. Now I know a couple Southies, and I don't want to piss any of them off, so PLEASE understand I am trying to be objective. This is NOT personal. But that is one of the problems with the SS: they are entirely too easy to piss off. They piss each other off; they get pissed off at attempts to form other supporters groups; there has been (in the past) a bit of infighting (and in a small group that makes a large impact). Some things are not their fault: their numbers have never been high, probably ranging from 15 on wet, cold days to about 60 in perfect weather with fat wallets and a lot of beer -- numbers are usually 30-40 people (if I am wrong, please correct me -- I am interested in presenting an accurate picture.) Tifo has been relatively non-existent (although this year looks a little better) and organization is a low-priority. They are loud, but their list of songs and chants is short. The good thing is that they have never been known to be violent. But the thing is, they have been around forever and they barely grow.

I think it is for a few reasons: it is not a friendly place (in my experience, having been with them a few times) and so casual fans would never go there; it is not particularly well-organized, making efforts to recruit probably non-existent, and turning off people like me who want a highly orchestrated tifo-heavy song-driven supporters group to belong to; lastly, Vancouver is, in my opinion, not conducive to supporters groups. People in Vancouver are laid-back, non committal fans. They get loud when there is a big-noisemeter on the scoreboard, or when people are using tshirt cannons. Also, public singing is not a part of West Coast living, and group singing virtually nonexistent -- so getting casual fans to join in is next to impossible. And why, in such a long period of existence have the Whitecaps only one supporters group? I was a member of the shortlived Brigade (we didn't recruit at all) that died the season after I left (probably because the Brigade, near season's end, was pretty much just Brad, me, and 4-8 people that Brad dragged with him from Chilliwack.) Since 1986, only two supporters groups, and one of them only lasting 1.5 seasons, despite the on-the-field success of the Caps? That says a lot about the supporters culture in Vancouver.

(If you are a SSer reading this, please understand that this is -- admittedly -- an outsiders view of the SS, but generally, this is how you are perceived.)

And yet I think the Whitecaps will be one of the best supported clubs. At a mediocre location in an aging stadium they have drawn well and could have sold 10,000 tickets on good days in the summer had they had the seats. They are very well covered for a USL team, rating articles almost every day in the Province, and usually a one-page feature weekly. Highlights make it on to local TV when they are available. Nearly every sports fan in Vancouver is aware of the Whitecaps either because of the success of the USL side, or from the bygone NASL glory years. We have a HUUUUGE soccer-playing community. We have a lot of Brits, Irish, Portuguese, Italians. The Asians in Vancouver (aka Hongkouver) have a large soccer-watching/playing demographic. The Whitecaps drew amazingly well in NASL and should do quite well in this healthy cycle of MLS. I think we will benefit from the "TFC effect" where your attendance numbers go up 10x from USL to MLS.

So yeah, I think TFC and DC United will rule the supporters-group wars, but I also think no city will have a broader, more knowledgeable fan base than Vancouver. Two more years and I guess we'll know if I am right.

What do you think?

[Johnnie Monster]

Ok, as one of the original Southsiders I have to call BULL with respect to a lot of what has been said here about the present state of affairs.

There is a core group of 40 - 50 die hards who regularly participate on the Southsiders forum. This is in addition to a minimum of 150 - 200 people who stand in the Southside, game in, game out.

We have never been opposed to the formation of other supporters groups. With MLS coming, we know this is an inevitability, and we encourage it. Case in point is "Taka's Seat" which is Hirano's Japanese supporters club. Purely awesome.

Some of us did have a MAJOR problem with respect to the Blue and White Brigade.... not that the group existed, but that the club was snubbing its most loyal source of support and revenue for many many years while at the same time chumming about with this previously invisible entity.

While you guys were prancing about in your cheap blue T-shirts, our group was toughing it out with ridiculous and unnecessary security hassles, the conversion of our beer garden into a kid-friendly playzone, the removal of our bleachers and toilet facilities, and a fence line which was creeping further away from the pitch.

While you were leading lame and cheesy microphoned singalongs at halftime, we were fighting to SURVIVE.

Our numbers are smaller today than they should be thanks in no small part to the club, who between 2000 - 2006 did its damnedest to drive it's REAL supporters away in favour of "family friendly soccer-tainment."

The Brigade smacked of a plastic, phony, pre-fabricated, G-rated, family friendly supporters club. Completely non-authentic. And where have they been these past four seasons? Nowhere to be seen.

Thankfully those days are long gone, and the Southsiders are indeed growing.

The "new blood" presently working for the Whitecaps is top notch. they understand what real support is all about.

I'm one of two liaisons between the club and the Southsiders, and was just at a two hour meeting on Friday where the front office outlined their plans to bend over backwards in order to help us grow. We could not possibly be more appreciative.

We've got 40 of us going on a bus for Portland this weekend coming up with 10 seats left to sell. We completely sold out 100 Southsiders scarves with another batch on the way.

And no tifo? Are you kidding me?

Get informed. Go to a match. The next two v. Montreal and TFC are going to be legendary.

[Krammerhead]

As another original southsider, albeit one with a self imposed exile for a couple of years, I have a couple of comments. First off I don't and have never had a fat wallet. If anybody knows where I can get one please let me know!

Secondly, I'm not too sure about the belief that the Southsiders are unfriendly. Over the years there have been a number of people who have not been regulars at games who have either inquired via the southsiders board, or have come up to us in the southside and been welcomed with open arms. I've opened up my home for a visitng "southsider" from Calgary on a numebr of occasions. If a guy from Calgary can contact us on our discussion board and be welcomed into the southside then it stands to reason we aren't that unfriendly.

As for the numbers not growing, well thats because when the group was formed in 1999 (before there were any other groups like it in the league) and we didn't really have any plans. We weren't trying to emulate anyone, so we didn't have any goals to aim for. In the last two years while I was away there has been an effort to grow and increase tifo output.

[Krammerhead]

Just a comment on the Blue and White Brigade. As Johnnie aluded to, nobody had anything against that supporters group. Aside from Brigadier Brad the rest of you guys were not planted by the club and had beliefs in what you were doing. But the fact that the club gave this new group preference with a direct link to the BWB website, and decided to give your group top status which hadn't been earned. Top that off with the Brigadier Brad halftime interview on TEAM 1040 in which he spent most of the time talking about his club back home in England, and well there it is.

[WhiteCapArmy]

well I'm only been a Southsider(tophdawg/on SS board name chris endersby if you know me) for around 4 years now so I think I didn't see the B&W Brigade never even knew of them but, i have to say that since i been a ss i have seen it grow a lot and we have made some major steps 2nd half of the year last year and are growing this year too, the caps have set up pub nights where we could get new fans to come to games or join the ss. also I strongly believe that we will grow even more durring the TFC game because last year the SS was jam packed with people and should be even more crazy this year. just my thoughts cheers.

[TheIronShiek]

Hey Johnnie Monster.

I need to call a little bullshit on you too.

One problem with the Southies is that you think you are the ONLY type of fan that should matter. You think those of us that dont scream and yell, chant, and stand behind the goal are not "real supporters". I LOVe the atmosphere the southsiders give, and I agree you are the MOST PASSIONATE supporters. However, your style of support is NOT the only one that is valid.

I went to the caps from 1980 to 1984, and the 86ers from 1987 until this year with the caps. Anyone who has 30 years of season ticket support from when he was a young boy is a real supporter, dont you think? I have a scarf, kit, hoodie, and have attended over 90% of the games in the last 30 years.

I am a quiet guy. I like to relax, enjoy a beer, smell the grass, and watch and observe a game. I LOVE the atmosphere the southsiders give, but I am not that kind of supporter. I just wont scream and chant, its not my thing. I am not a guy who is going to hurl insults at a TFC guy in hopes of picking an altercation.

So, why do you look down on people like me; think the club should only focus on you, and have the nuts to say someone like me is not a "real supporter"?

I have done enough reading on the SS board and here over the years to know this is how it is sometimes.

IF WE ARE GOING TO GET 20K OR MORE TO GAMES, WE NEED ALL TYPES OF FANS. If your type of fan is the ONLY real fan, the we will have to live with 500 people in BC place. we need guys like you, we need guys like me ,we need families, we need foul mouthed beer drinkers, we need quiet polite guys, we need every single body we can get into that stadium.

Just my two cents:)

[Krammerhead]

Since when did Johnnie or any other Southsiders say that their kind of support is the only kind of support? What are you talking about? I've read the Southsiders board from before it was a southsiders board (86ers message board) and while there always has been arrogance present, everyone there is pretty clear that supporters like the southsiders will always be the minority of the fans, whether at Swangard with 5,000 there or BC Place with 20,000.

[WhiteCapArmy]

most likely bc place will be set up like most other stadiums where there is a supporters section family section and away section i would assume, And I would not say that the SS diss TFC supporters looking for a fight, it is called a rivalry for a reason. Also I don't remeber reasding anything saying that we are the only supporters and that every one should be like us.

[Krammerhead]

I am not a guy who is going to hurl insults at a TFC guy in hopes of picking an altercation.


Holy crap, I didn't even notice this part of the post. Now I call bullshit on you. No southsider hurls insults at anyone else in the stadium looking for a fight. Not one.

That's just extremely ignorant.

[Johnnie Monster]

Sheik, you don't have a clue what you're talking about, and you're completely misrepresenting my views.

In my view, anyone who pays for their tickets and attends on a regular basis is a good supporter and a benefit to the club. It doesn't matter to me if they are vocal fans like the Southsiders, or quiet families with kids who sit in the stands. A paying fan is a good asset - end story.

My posts in this thread relate directly to a time when the club was pressing forward with a lame ploy to promote a select group of Disney-drones as "supporters" when Vancouver's most loyal season ticket base was literally being pushed out the door and swept under the carpet.

At that time, phone calls and e-mails asking for help resolving our issues were routinely ignored or dismissed entirely. It was a horrid way for any business to treat its best repeat customers, let alone a sports franchise where brand loyalty is so key to survival.

I am very happy to say that things have changed considerably over the past few years, and our relationship with the club is really moving forward week after week. We consult with each other, exchange thoughts/concerns and we address them together.

Case in point (and further to your ridiculous remark about hurling insults at fans to provoke fights)...

...I recently brought some security concerns to the club's attention to prevent violence from happening at tomorrow's match vs. Toronto FC.

The Caps front office responded in record time to coordinate plans with security and with the RCMP to ensure TFC fans are prohibited from congregating in the Southside viewing area. They will instead be directed to the north end of the park, which should keep drunken idiots from both sides from getting on each other's nerves.

Further: this weekend a busload of us went to watch the Caps in Portland. Two relatively new guys got extremely intoxicated and threw cups off the balcony where we were standing. The response from the Southsiders towards their own fans was harsher than what they got from security at PGE.

[TheIronShiek]

Sheik, you don't have a clue what you're talking about, and you're completely misrepresenting my views.

In my view, anyone who pays for their tickets and attends on a regular basis is a good supporter and a benefit to the club. It doesn't matter to me if they are vocal fans like the Southsiders, or quiet families with kids who sit in the stands. A paying fan is a good asset - end story.

My posts in this thread relate directly to a time when the club was pressing forward with a lame ploy to promote a select group of Disney-drones as "supporters" when Vancouver's most loyal season ticket base was literally being pushed out the door and swept under the carpet.

At that time, phone calls and e-mails asking for help resolving our issues were routinely ignored or dismissed entirely. It was a horrid way for any business to treat its best repeat customers, let alone a sports franchise where brand loyalty is so key to survival.

I am very happy to say that things have changed considerably over the past few years, and our relationship with the club is really moving forward week after week. We consult with each other, exchange thoughts/concerns and we address them together.

Case in point (and further to your ridiculous remark about hurling insults at fans to provoke fights)...

...I recently brought some security concerns to the club's attention to prevent violence from happening at tomorrow's match vs. Toronto FC.

The Caps front office responded in record time to coordinate plans with security and with the RCMP to ensure TFC fans are prohibited from congregating in the Southside viewing area. They will instead be directed to the north end of the park, which should keep drunken idiots from both sides from getting on each other's nerves.

Further: this weekend a busload of us went to watch the Caps in Portland. Two relatively new guys got extremely intoxicated and threw cups off the balcony where we were standing. The response from the Southsiders towards their own fans was harsher than what they got from security at PGE.
I understand and hear your views. The underlying reason for my post was to bring to your attention that there is a "perception" out there; sometimes perceptions are not factual as you are pointing out to me.

[whiteisthecolour]

There is a core group of 40 - 50 die hards who regularly participate on the Southsiders forum. This is in addition to a minimum of 150 - 200 people who stand in the Southside, game in, game out.

I am not calling into question the number of people who stand in the southside, I am calling into question the number of people who are Southsiders -- people who identify with the group and participate in the chanting and singing. I believe that -- in general -- that number is closer to 40-50. (Mind you I haven't been able to come to a game this and last year since I moved to Kamloops, so I imagine you've grown some.)

We have never been opposed to the formation of other supporters groups. With MLS coming, we know this is an inevitability, and we encourage it. Case in point is "Taka's Seat" which is Hirano's Japanese supporters club. Purely awesome.Is it awesome? Are they Whitecaps fans? It doesn't sound like it. Will they still attend if Hirano moves on? I hope so -- but I doubt it.

Some of us did have a MAJOR problem with respect to the Blue and White Brigade.... not that the group existed, but that the club was snubbing its most loyal source of support and revenue for many many years while at the same time chumming about with this previously invisible entity. I 100% agree with you that the FO pretty much ignored you guys. I think you got the shaft. On the other hand, I understand what the Whitecaps were trying to do: in you Southsiders they saw some of the spirit of European supporters. They want that all over the stadium, but they know that Joe Q. Public will never enter the Southside. So they threw their support behind a guy who wanted to to a "PG" version of what the Southside was doing, and do it in the stands trying to pull casual fans in. Were you ever going to do that? Then why fault the Whitcaps for that strategy. I admit, it didn't work at all, but if I were the Whitecaps FO, it would have seemed like a good idea to me too. Why not try and convert casual fans into chanting, tifo-waving supporters?

While you guys were prancing about in your cheap blue T-shirts, our group was toughing it out with ridiculous and unnecessary security hassles, the conversion of our beer garden into a kid-friendly playzone, the removal of our bleachers and toilet facilities, and a fence line which was creeping further away from the pitch.See above. I agree that you guys got screwed, was not happy about it. But why do you take out your frustration about what the FO was doing on the Brigade?

While you were leading lame and cheesy microphoned singalongs at halftime, we were fighting to SURVIVE.Did you ask us if we had anything to do with making them? (We didn't.) Did you ask us if we liked them. (We didn't.) And we didn't lead them. I believe exactly TWICE they approached us and had us sing "White Is The Colour" into a microphone to try and get other people in the grandstand to participate. We did it, not because we liked it, but because we were trying to involve other people.

Our numbers are smaller today than they should be thanks in no small part to the club, who between 2000 - 2006 did its damnedest to drive it's REAL supporters away in favour of "family friendly soccer-tainment."Third time I agree with you completely. I do not know what they were think in the early part of that decade. Although the convert-grandstand-fans-into-singing-supporters idea, I believe, was a good one. I am surprised it failed so miserably. To me, that was a way of acknowledging that it was YOUR kind of supporters the club wanted. I always thought their support of the Brigade was tacit acknowldgement that Southside-style support (tifo, singing)was the kind of support that wold be best for the club.

The Brigade smacked of a plastic, phony, pre-fabricated, G-rated, family friendly supporters club. Completely non-authentic. And where have they been these past four seasons? Nowhere to be seen. And you says the Takas are AWESOME? Where do you think they will be when Hirano leaves?

This is exactly why I say the Southside was not friendly to other groups. Just because the FO makes some mistakes, and just because they don't support you in the way you like (which I admit, was unfair) does NOT make the Brigade any of the things you say above. You are not being fair at all. What about us was plastic? That the Caps got behind us and not you? It may not have been fair, but what does that have to do with the amount of effort and heart I put into the Briagde? Are you saying I am plastic and fake? Do you know me? Did you ever sit beside me, ask me questions, watch me chant and sing?

You ARE right about the G-rated csupporters club. Brad even said so when we were talking to (attempting to recruit) people in the stands that we were the "PG" group and you guys were the "PG-13" group (a distinction I am sure you are happy with.) We sang YOUR songs, joined in EVERY time we heard you sing, but we left the "bad words" out ("You fat bastard" became "Go Caps Go") and tried to involve the grandstand. That is fake and plastic? Recruiting people in the grandstand to sing Southsider songs (since you are the traditional support) sounds like we were honouring you and doing our absolute best to represent the spirit of the Southside in the general public. Those grandstanders are NEVER going to the Southside -- so we brought (admittedly a "PG" version) the Southside to them. In a word, we TRIED.

As for where we have been the last four years: Brad drove from Chilliwack and Back for every single match, dumped his own money into various attempts at recruiting, organized as many as 20 people from Chilliwack to the games, and all for basically no net growth beyond me. In short, he grew tired of all that expediture for zero result. But you know what? He tried.

As for me, where have I been these last four years, working at an orphanage for special needs kids in Carmen Serdan Mexico. Recently I moved to Kamloops. Yeah, when your the core of your supporters group consists of two people and one comes from Chilliwack, and the other moves to Mexico, it's a little hard to carry the group on.

So while you are gloating, remember that we tried. Hard. And finally we wore out and life brought some twists and turns.

The "new blood" presently working for the Whitecaps is top notch. they understand what real support is all about.Thanks. I guess because I didn't sit in the Southside my support wasn't real. Strange because I lost my voice at nearly every single game I attended, composed arounf 8 new songs and chants, wore blue to every game, waved the flag, sang White is the Colour, brought a foster kid with me to many of the games, organized a church group of 30 people and brought them to a game, and tried to recruit grandstanders to sing Southsider chants. So what do I need to do to be a real supporter?

I'm one of two liaisons between the club and the Southsiders, and was just at a two hour meeting on Friday where the front office outlined their plans to bend over backwards in order to help us grow. We could not possibly be more appreciative.For the most part, I am glad to hear that. For the most part. But one part of me irks at it because of your attitude towards me and Brad and those who joined us. Just because we don't drink copious amounts of beer and sit in your section does not make us less real. That the Whitecaps got behind Brad is their business and no fault of mine.

We've got 40 of us going on a bus for Portland this weekend coming up with 10 seats left to sell. We completely sold out 100 Southsiders scarves with another batch on the way.I really wish I could have gone.

And no tifo? Are you kidding me? Get informed. Go to a match. The next two v. Montreal and TFC are going to be legendary.I am informed. I have attended many matches. It seems that your tifo is starting to get worthy of the word (I was especially impressed at the TFC match) but that doesn't change the fact that generally and historically, there has been little tifo. Flags yes (we had those too) but organized overt displays of tifo no. If you are doing it now -- great! But seriously, why be such an ass about everything? Historically you have not really had tifosi. Not a criticism, just an observation.

I am interested in a discussion about supporters groups; I know you have invested a lot in the Southside but either you recognize that your group is not 100% perfect and that other groups try, or you believe Southside is all that matters to the exclusion of anyone and everyone else's effort in which case their is not much point in you discussing it at all. I'm interested in finding out how to grow the support in both numbers of supporters and numbers of groups and discussing Vancouver's viability as a city for that kind of support.

[whiteisthecolour]

Secondly, I'm not too sure about the belief that the Southsiders are unfriendly.

I meant that in two ways:

1. Southsiders are not friendly to other supporters groups. Johnny might object, but I was lurking on the Southsider boards when they were upset with the Brigade a couple years ago. All they did is bitch about us. I tried to bridge the gap, but only one or two Southsiders were receptive.

2. I stood in the Southside on many occasions prior to 2005 and was never really greeted or welcomed or engaged. I was just ignored. I sang, got tired of surliness (especially after the half when everyone is getting soused) and being ignored, and wandered off. I hope the experience now is better, but back then it was not. So when the Brigade showed up, I joined.

[whiteisthecolour]

Just a comment on the Blue and White Brigade. As Johnnie aluded to, nobody had anything against that supporters group.

I lurked on your boards. Plenty of you had plenty against us. It bummed me out a bit at the time, but whatever. Point is that you guys were unhappy about the Brigade and did nothing to support us. We tried to support you (even pointing some people your way).

Aside from Brigadier Brad the rest of you guys were not planted by the club and had beliefs in what you were doing.

I assure, whatever else Brad may have been, he was a real supporter of the Whitecaps and made a huge effort to try and get people to enjoy the game the way you guys do. He lauded you guys on many occasions, pointed people in your direction, dumped his own money into trying to develop the group. He believed; I believed.

But the fact that the club gave this new group preference with a direct link to the BWB website, and decided to give your group top status which hadn't been earned. Top that off with the Brigadier Brad halftime interview on TEAM 1040 in which he spent most of the time talking about his club back home in England, and well there it is.

But that was the FO's doing, not ours! And while I understand how it was unfair to the SS to ignore them, the Caps (as I understand it) were trying to create a supporters group that would sing your songs and have your spirit but make it available to people who don't drink heavily and don't cuss in their chants. Was that so bad of a strategy? It didn't work, but was it a bad attempt? They knew that the type of boisterous supporter the SS attracts is going to join the SS without much help from them. The Brigade was a chance to try and engage grandstanders. A good idea that failed.

Yeah Brad talked about Spurs on the radio. He's from England, he got off topic, **it happens. If you were in Cambodia being interviewed about your new supporters group for the Phnom Penh Penguins FC and somehow got onto the Whitecaps, wouldn't you go on and on about them? Not the right time or place, but you can understand how he could get sidetracked. It could just as easily have been you or me in different circumstances.

[whiteisthecolour]

My posts in this thread relate directly to a time when the club was pressing forward with a lame ploy to promote a select group of Disney-drones as "supporters" when Vancouver's most loyal season ticket base was literally being pushed out the door and swept under the carpet.

Jonnnie, I am not a Disney drone! I love my club and sang myself hoarse every single game when I sat with the Brigade!

At that time, phone calls and e-mails asking for help resolving our issues were routinely ignored or dismissed entirely. It was a horrid way for any business to treat its best repeat customers, let alone a sports franchise where brand loyalty is so key to survival.

That was horribly unfair and classless on the part of the FO, but not my or Brad's fault.

Further: this weekend a busload of us went to watch the Caps in Portland. Two relatively new guys got extremely intoxicated and threw cups off the balcony where we were standing. The response from the Southsiders towards their own fans was harsher than what they got from security at PGE.

Glad to hear it. I know you guys have never tolerated violence and I applaud every effort you make and your great success in that area!

[whiteisthecolour]

Okay, so I wrote all that stuff above in an emotional torrent of Brigade-inspired passion. But that isn't the whole story -- nor is it the point of the original post.

So let me say that I want the Southside to succeed. I want it to be boisterous (but not violently TFC-boisterous), tifo-laden, and full of clever songs and chants. But I also want to see other WHITECAPS supporters groups emerge, do well, and work in concert with the SS. That is what I wanted for the Brigade, and what I tried to make happen with the Brigade. (Some of you may vaguely recall my "United Whitecaps" webpage which was my strongest attempt to connect the two supporters groups and foster supporters culture. ... Sonofagun, it still exists! http://geocities.com/unitedwhitecaps/ )

Let me offer the olive branch: Johnnie, me and Brad cared. I am sorry you got screwed over by the FO in 2005 -- that wasn't my intent and I am certain it wasn't Brad's either as he genuinely appreciated the SS. I don't blame the FO for trying to support a "G-rated" group, but they should NEVER stiff loyal, well-behaved supporters, especially ones with enthusiasm like yours. I just ask you to recognize what Brad and (soonafter) me were trying to do: the same thing as you: sing our boys onto victory each and every chance we get.

When you dis the Brigade, you are doing the same things the FO did to the SS in 2005: marginalizing diehard supporters who are trying very hard to bring raucous energy and Euro-atmosphere to the stadium to support our club.

But that's just it: it is OUR club. All of us. Let's put all denominational differences aside today and move forward to support our club. The Brigade is dead - R.I.P. But I plan to be there again for games when I can get down to the 604 -- maybe with the SS and maybe with another group -- but I hope we are ALL United Whitecap fans.

I can't (won't?) say much good about TFC, but their supporters groups seem to work well together -- I hope the Whitecaps can outdo TFC in that area (as in every other area) as well.

I hope we truly will have the best supporters in MLS.

WHITE IS THE COLOUR!

Jeremy

[Johnnie Monster]

Jeremy, thank you very much for your obvious passion for the club, and your detailed responses to what has been said here.

Maybe the point that I am communicating poorly is this: I do not take issue with the individual Brigade members or what they did. My beef has always been with how the Whitecaps burned many, many bridges with a significant number of long-time customers, while at the same time they found the time and effort to forge a bright and positive relationship with a group newcomers who seemed to materialize out of thin air.

One last remark: My comment re: how the front office staff now understand what a "real supporter" is about... that wasn't a dig at you guys, and that wasn't meant as a way to hang my nose high in the air.

I was merely trying to illustrate my point that the club seems to have finally accepted the fact that supporter activities (singing, chanting, flags etc) is much, much better for the overall game day experience than the lifeless, polite spectatorship which is woefully rampant in North American sports culture.

Next time you're in town, come to a tailgate party with us (always open to newcomers, in fact there were three or four there last night who will hopefully be back). We can all agree that we've got a great club to support and with Champions League coming up (hopefully!) we're in for some very exciting times.

[JohnnyRanger]

Jeremy,

Join us this Friday, come down for the weekend! The Miami game will be good, and so will the tailgate.

[Krammerhead]

Jeremy, were you one of the brigade that attended some of the SS barbeques?

[whiteisthecolour]

Guys, if I had a car, I would come down at least a couple times a season for games; sadly, I am a po' college student who sold his car and lives on-campus -- travelling to Boundary for matches is not an option right now.

But if I ever can make it, I promise you I will. I will wear my "cheap blue tshirt" and (if I may?) teach you guys a few Brigade songs, and we'll sing ourselves hoarse till Bobby's Boys bring us USL, MLS, and Champions League titles!

WHITE IS THE COLOUR!

Sooo...back to the topic I originally started:

Will we have the best supporters in MLS? Please give reasons why you think this will be so/not so.

(After that CC tilt against TFC where the Southsiders sounded twice as good as I have ever heard them, I am starting to believe we really COULD have the best (vocal) support in the league.)