Advice for new hattrick players

[Kevin in Louisiana]

Money discussion from about a page back in this thread:

I've never really had any major trouble with staying in the black, even early in the game (unless my memory is letting me down). I'm about to go into the red for a first time in a while at the end of this week, but as soon as I play my league match in my newly expanded stadium I'll be back into the black.

Experience: I've read on the conferences that it takes approximately 28 points to pop a level in exprience. You get 0.1 points for a friendly, 0.2 for a friendly with a team from another country (and maybe 0.2 for a cup-rules friendly?), 1 for a league match, 2 for a cup, 3 for a national team match.

[puddleduck]

I've never really had any major trouble with staying in the black, even early in the game (unless my memory is letting me down). I'm about to go into the red for a first time in a while at the end of this week, but as soon as I play my league match in my newly expanded stadium I'll be back into the black.

I'm not too worried about going into debt, I still have about 150k in the bank, a passable coach and a crop of poor to medicore trainies. If my stamina training scheme works out I'll upgrade a couple of trainies.

What I'm not sure how to manage is the week to week revenue. My game vs the best team in the league only drew 5k spectators (granted it was raining) so with sponsors I only made 60k in a week with a home game. Even discounting the extra salaries I'm paying all my stamina trainies and any youth squad investment my expenses are around 35k a week.

So I'll bleed about 5k a week plus YS investment (which I've decided to keep at 20k as long as possible).

And I'm not at all sure things will get any better next season. From the table and future fixtures there is really no way I could possibly go down even if I wanted to ... so I'm looking a a very tough season in div 5 ...

Extrapolate a bit and my little bit of bleeding could add up to 300k-400k before even my short term PM trainies are ready to sell. I have a couple salable older IMs who should fetch ~150k and keep me out of too much debt.

Should I expect my attendences to stay in 5k range next season when I'm getting pummeled? Are they likely to get much worse?

Should I spend my nest egg on an older solid to try and compete better? I'm guessing not since how much difference can one player make when you are outclassed?

[BrianJames]

Regarding tactics and using players in their best rated set-up according to Hattrick Buddy:

Is it best to adjust your positions to a players strongest attribute?

For example, I'm using a 5-4-1 formation. I've played with the wingers as "offensive" and the inners as "normal", which seems to suit a counterattacking style with only one forward. Hattrick buddy has both my inner mids as stronger players if "offensive", and one of my wingers as stronger if "toward the middle". Should I follow hattricks advice and adjust them to their strongest positional setup or keep to what would seem to make more sense for the tactic?

[Deuteriumoxide]

Regarding tactics and using players in their best rated set-up according to Hattrick Buddy:

Is it best to adjust your positions to a players strongest attribute?

For example, I'm using a 5-4-1 formation. I've played with the wingers as "offensive" and the inners as "normal", which seems to suit a counterattacking style with only one forward. Hattrick buddy has both my inner mids as stronger players if "offensive", and one of my wingers as stronger if "toward the middle". Should I follow hattricks advice and adjust them to their strongest positional setup or keep to what would seem to make more sense for the tactic?

Well, for counter attacking you have to find a balance between good defense and good offense. What determines if an inner mid is better offensive or defensive is their passing and or their defending. An inner mid with inadequate passing but wretched defending will perform better set to offensive. The same holds true for defending.

[Craig P]

Experience: I've read on the conferences that it takes approximately 28 points to pop a level in exprience. You get 0.1 points for a friendly, 0.2 for a friendly with a team from another country (and maybe 0.2 for a cup-rules friendly?), 1 for a league match, 2 for a cup, 3 for a national team match.With the complication that any player without a card, injury, or goal will have a one in x chance of getting x times the number of experience points listed above. It's only deterministic for the players whose record is going to get updated anyway. (The actual number for x is unknown, the HTs have used 3 as an example but were careful to say that it was only an example and x might be something different.)

[ur_land]

Should I expect my attendences to stay in 5k range next season when I'm getting pummeled? Are they likely to get much worse?


If you keep getting pummeled, they probably won't get much worse, butthey also won't get much better.


Should I spend my nest egg on an older solid to try and compete better?

That's what I did. I bought a few older solid IMs with bad stamina(for ~25-50k), trained them up to good stamina, and now my midfield can compete (or even dominate) in my series. Of course, I'm a keeper trainer, so I could afford to do this. YMMV.

[AAGunner3]

I'm not too worried about going into debt, I still have about 150k in the bank, a passable coach and a crop of poor to medicore trainies. If my stamina training scheme works out I'll upgrade a couple of trainies.

What I'm not sure how to manage is the week to week revenue. My game vs the best team in the league only drew 5k spectators (granted it was raining) so with sponsors I only made 60k in a week with a home game. Even discounting the extra salaries I'm paying all my stamina trainies and any youth squad investment my expenses are around 35k a week.

So I'll bleed about 5k a week plus YS investment (which I've decided to keep at 20k as long as possible).

And I'm not at all sure things will get any better next season. From the table and future fixtures there is really no way I could possibly go down even if I wanted to ... so I'm looking a a very tough season in div 5 ...

Extrapolate a bit and my little bit of bleeding could add up to 300k-400k before even my short term PM trainies are ready to sell. I have a couple salable older IMs who should fetch ~150k and keep me out of too much debt.

Should I expect my attendences to stay in 5k range next season when I'm getting pummeled? Are they likely to get much worse?

Should I spend my nest egg on an older solid to try and compete better? I'm guessing not since how much difference can one player make when you are outclassed?

You'll either get pummeled and go down to Div 6 where it would be easy to compete and turn around financially, or you'll survive. Either way, it takes a good season before your team attracts enough supporters in your fan club. DONT over expand your stadium first of all (but don't add only 50 seats either).

I only put 10k to my youth squad the first season. The youth squad is a crap shoot. But you can't pull the next national teamer if you don't pull one weekly. Maybe a couple of good youth pulls can help you stay above water.

I also ran with no doctors, physiologists, psychs etc... I did keep a full coaching staff and about 5-7 spokespersons so that I attracted ad revenue from sponsors. I only added doctors if I had an important player injured, and even then I debated firing the guy and buying a replacement, vs the cost of the doctor.

Also, be forwarned about the dreaded back to back away games that you may or may not have on your schedule. I hated those as a newbie. But, the back to back home games are nice. That scheduling quirk just makes it really hard on you for a couple of weeks in the season.

[puddleduck]

You'll either get pummeled and go down to Div 6 where it would be easy to compete and turn around financially, or you'll survive. Either way, it takes a good season before your team attracts enough supporters in your fan club. DONT over expand your stadium first of all (but don't add only 50 seats either).

I only put 10k to my youth squad the first season. The youth squad is a crap shoot. But you can't pull the next national teamer if you don't pull one weekly. Maybe a couple of good youth pulls can help you stay above water.

I also ran with no doctors, physiologists, psychs etc... I did keep a full coaching staff and about 5-7 spokespersons so that I attracted ad revenue from sponsors. I only added doctors if I had an important player injured, and even then I debated firing the guy and buying a replacement, vs the cost of the doctor.

p.s. I just discoverd the transfer evaluation function in Hattrick Buddy that allows you to see an estimate value for arbitrary skill levels. Is it considered accurate? Does anyone know how large a time period it samples for it's information?

Also, be forwarned about the dreaded back to back away games that you may or may not have on your schedule. I hated those as a newbie. But, the back to back home games are nice. That scheduling quirk just makes it really hard on you for a couple of weeks in the season.


Thanks for the advice. I think I'm going to hold off on expanding my stadium until I see how things go next season. And keep my staff to a minimum. My series has 3 very good teams and 2 medium teams and 1 newbie and a walkover (but still better than me). One of the medium teams may be going down and the other newb may stay up ... if that happens and the teams coming up from VI aren't too tough I'll hopefully be able to snag 6th place.

p.s I just discovered that transfer price evaluation feature in Hattrick buddy that lets you get value estimates for arbitrary skill levels. Is it considered accurate? Does anyone knwo how large a time period it samples to get its data?

[Deuteriumoxide]

I just discovered that transfer price evaluation feature in Hattrick buddy that lets you get value estimates for arbitrary skill levels. Is it considered accurate? Does anyone knwo how large a time period it samples to get its data?

I don't know how big the sample is, but I find that usually the estimates are pretty accurate. I go around 10 or 15% shy of the evaluation price as a starting bid.

[AAGunner3]

Thanks for the advice. I think I'm going to hold off on expanding my stadium until I see how things go next season. And keep my staff to a minimum. My series has 3 very good teams and 2 medium teams and 1 newbie and a walkover (but still better than me). One of the medium teams may be going down and the other newb may stay up ... if that happens and the teams coming up from VI aren't too tough I'll hopefully be able to snag 6th place.

p.s I just discovered that transfer price evaluation feature in Hattrick buddy that lets you get value estimates for arbitrary skill levels. Is it considered accurate? Does anyone knwo how large a time period it samples to get its data?

I think it is perfectly accurate. It shows you the most recent purchases for players matching your sell (according to whatever HT algorithm is used to search for 'similar' players). It shows you exactly what other people are willing to pay for a player of that particular skillset. A problem I have is that it is too specific. I'd rather it show me the price ranges of the players of ages a year or two older/younger than mine. Sometimes, I've tried to sell a player and since it was comparing mine against other 18 year old solid passers with wretched stamina and weak playmaking, I only got a few hits. I'd like to be able to see a little more.

But, it is what it is.

You don't know the story behind the one guy in the list that sold for 500k. Maybe the team that bought him logged in late, latched on to this guy and had to have him so that he could set his lineup before going out of town for a week. Everyone else sold for around 350k.

[Helghallen]

TPE is a separate database provided by the programmers of HAM and Buddy (if you look at prices in HAM they should be the same as what buddy says). Anytime a user of Buddy or HAM buys or sells a player, his info is uploaded to this server. This information is used to give you the TPE you see.

I also find it very accurate and do the same as Dex, starting the bids about 10-15% below the "suggested."

[Danks81]

How important is defending for inner mids?

[Helghallen]

It depends on the orientation you want to use them for. Basically it is the same importance as passing but for the stated increasing importance of secondaries passing has become a premium stat for IMs. However, I think defense can be just as valuable and more of an economical choice.

[Deuteriumoxide]

It depends on the orientation you want to use them for. Basically it is the same importance as passing but for the stated increasing importance of secondaries passing has become a premium stat for IMs. However, I think defense can be just as valuable and more of an economical choice.

I have two inner mids, who i am particularly proud of, both have passable playmaking, inadequate passing, and inadequate defending. These guys benefit neither from being set to offensive or defensive so I play them in the repositioned slot.

[puddleduck]

OK, two questions:

During my friendly last night I played new (to me) formation and suffered several 'confusion' events. Does this have any consequences beyond effecting my play in that match?

Despite tieing the match (woo-hoo my first non-loss) and having 4 spokespeople on staff: 8 supporters left my club. Which sort of shocked me and took the glow off of my first non-pummeling. Do friendlies always have such a large effect on supporters?

By extrapolating through next season and assuming I win few leauge games, I could easily be down to 2 or 3 hundred supporters by the time I relegate in 20 weeks. Is there anything I can do to stop the pain?

Ok, so that was three questions.

[Helghallen]

1. The only effect is confusion during the match. And once you have used it several times, assuming it is one of the formations on your training page, you will have enough experience with it so you won't have those again. You should be able to keep two formations beyond 4-4-2 high enough so you won't have confusion events during matches.

2. Friendlies have no effect on supporters. The 8 supporters you lost are a result of your league match on Sunday. When you only have one competitive match in a week (no cup game) the Thursday update will use the number from Monday's update (or maybe one less).

3. Win. Actually, set up your training program and keep at it. Try to win a few games here and there. Remember, Hattrick is a long-term game. You may go down a few supporters in the short term but you'll make them back once your training program starts to produce some results.

Since you are in V, I would make sure you hire 10 spokespersons at the start of next season. The extra income they generate will be a great benefit to you.

[puddleduck]

Ok, excellent. I thought the -8 supporters for a friendly was a little harsh. But if only 8 of the poor sods walked out on us after last weekend ... why that's positively generous.

I'll definately stock up on the spokes people next season. Do they also have an effect on supporter mood?

[kuhnscoot]

Since you are in V, I would make sure you hire 10 spokespersons at the start of next season. The extra income they generate will be a great benefit to you.

Again I will caution on over doing the spokesmen thing and getting 10. I remember a discussion in here earlier this season where someone (MLS?) said that they had 10 spokespeople, and they were making around $1000 more a week then what I was with 6 spokespeople. The lower divisions, I don't see it necessary to have 10 spokespeople.

[Helghallen]

Again I will caution on over doing the spokesmen thing and getting 10. I remember a discussion in here earlier this season where someone (MLS?) said that they had 10 spokespeople, and they were making around $1000 more a week then what I was with 6 spokespeople. The lower divisions, I don't see it necessary to have 10 spokespeople.
There is that. I might even try to go with eight to start the season. My reasoning would be that I don't want to have to think too much about what effect they are having. Just give me ten and I'll let it ride.

[Kevin in Louisiana]

Another question about confusion: if the match report doesn't mention confusion, does that mean there was no effect whatsoever?