Alan Shearer

[Harry Ottis Guff]

Does anyone else think that quitting international football at the age of 28 is disgracefull? This guy should still be available for England. He says that he cannot play for England because its too many games and he will play better for Newcastle if he quits, but this is utter bollox. He still has the lags to play in Europe, in the F.A cup and the League cup. He doesnt miss these games because he's too tired. When Newcastle played Valarenga in the UEFA cup he was moaning because he doesnt like to be rested. He was the captain, and still is the best English striker we have. I know it sounds like old news, but this guy needs to stop being a knob and hit Heskey in the face, and take his rightful place up front with Owen in the summer!

[Mobile]

It baffles me when people call for Shearer's reinstatement in the England side. He retired because he was utter rubbish for England, a slow, predictable carthorse who was booked for diving in his last ever appearance.

Add to that the fact that his ego would not allow him to play unless he was (a) captain and (b) first choice on the teamsheet and it is pretty clear we don't need him back.

[Prenn]

It baffles me when people call for Shearer's reinstatement in the England side. He retired because he was utter rubbish for England, a slow, predictable carthorse who was booked for diving in his last ever appearance.

Add to that the fact that his ego would not allow him to play unless he was (a) captain and (b) first choice on the teamsheet and it is pretty clear we don't need him back.

I totally agree. I watched him play on saturday, what a lumbering mass he is. England are a better team without him, as are Newcastle. In order for Shearer to score the entire team must be accommodated to fit him and it hurts them.

[sinner78]

http://www.4thegame.com/playerprofile?personid=855

shearer..

International caps 63
Goals 37


Crap??? I dont think so.
I think he is past his sell by date at international level but he did the business when he was at his peak.

[Mobile]

http://www.4thegame.com/playerprofile?personid=855

shearer..

International caps 63
Goals 37


Crap??? I dont think so.
I think he is past his sell by date at international level but he did the business when he was at his peak.

I don't think there's any doubt that Shearer was one of the best strikers in the world from around 95-97 (his Golden Boot at Euro 96 is evidence of that). He did have a bad injury though and never really looked the same for England afterwards. Even at France 98 he was pretty ineffective for much of the tournament.

Like you say, past his sell by date at international level.

[Harry Ottis Guff]

I disagree. Fair enough Shearer wasnt playing well for England, but who was before Sven took over? The whole team was poor. A dip in form is no reason to quit, and no reason for people to try and justify it. At 28, a player is at his peak, why would he be past his sell by date at this age? Beckham is 28, and he is at the hieght of his career both at club and international level. I dont accept this reasoning at all. Shearer has been, and is currently, one of the top goalscorers in the Premiership, one of the toughest leagues in the world. If he is good enough to score on a regular basis here, he is easily good enough to play against any team during the qualifiers, and anyone we might come up against in the tournments. Scoring against the likes of Arsenal and Man U is no easier that against Spain or Italy, and a ********ing lot harder than against the likes of Poland and Georgia. Basically, if he is good enough for the Premiership he is good enough for England. Afterall, Sheringham played til he was 36! Most players carry on as long as possible, and though they obviously dip in form, they certainly dont from the age of 28-31!

I also disagree that Shearer requires a whole team to play around him for him to score goals. I think its the other way around. Shearer drags Newcastle kicking and screaming up the Premiership. It only seems the other way around because the likes of Bellamy, Cort when he was there, and the rest of them are unbelievabley poor finishers! Fair enough Shearer is slow, but he always has been. And we wouldnt need him for speed anyway, Owen provides that. We content ourselves with playing Heskey, but we wouldnt with Shearer! It bullsh1t! If he came to Portugal he would make a huge difference to our chances. But the fact is, he wont, and the question remains, what is the real reason for his early retirement?

[afgrijselijkheid]

i can't believe i'm about to say this... but hog is right - all of this wonderful rest he's had should make for him being nice and fresh (whatever he thinks that means) for portugal - with shearer, though, i think it is just as much about his presence on the pitch as it is about his remaining qualities - simply put, i believe certain england players would perform better this summer knowing shearer is out there - i doubt he would demand to be captain at this point, hell he might even find not having the armband some sort of zen psychological rest and dig it the most

and for the love of pete people, lets not forget... it means heskey wouldn't be in the lineup... he's just a 'lumbering mass' that wastes his considerable athletic attributes - i thought he was going to be pretty sweet when he was at leicester city, but the crap has definitely risen to the top with him

of course none of this would mean anything if sven would just start alan smith alongside owen - he knock some bodies around, but eriksson seems allergic to him

[When Hell Unfreezes]

But the fact is, he wont, and the question remains, what is the real reason for his early retirement?

Probably selfishness again as he wants to pursue a media career?

The man is a complete knob-jockey and couldn't live with the pace of modern day defenders (International) - he was good in his time - but that has long gone!

Leave him on his zimmer - what we've got will have to do!

[Matt Clark]

I disagree. Fair enough Shearer wasnt playing well for England, but who was before Sven took over?

Chicken and egg. General consensus at the time was that Shearer was a poor spearhead for a poor team. Thing is, the team was packed with dinosaurs like Ince, Wise (WISE, FFS!), Adams, Keown ... and Shearer. He was part of the problem and no amount of revisionism now will change that fact.

A dip in form is no reason to quit, and no reason for people to try and justify it.

Does it need justifying? I remember thinking Shearer should have quit England in 1999, a full year before he actually did. When he finally left, I cannot recall anyone viewing it as anything other than a case of "about time too". Personally, I viewed the development with a sense of profound relief.

Plus, of course, Alan Shearer wanted to quit. He recognised that the writing was on the wall for his international career long before he and the others mentioned above lost the protection that Kevin Keegan provided for them and their place in the squad. There is no need to justify something like that, he took a decision for his own sake and he has profited massively from doing so - his form at Newcastle has been great, just like he said it would be when he announced his decision to retire. What's to justify?

At 28, a player is at his peak

Shearer is 34. He was 30 when he retired. At 28, he was recovering from the cruciate ligament injury he sustained in a pre-season game at Goodison Park that robbed him of what little pace he had.

Afterall, Sheringham played til he was 36!

Yeah, but in a completely different role. Beardsley played on after Lineker had retired too - that's no argument for prolonging Shearer's international career, even if he wanted it prolonging.

I also disagree that Shearer requires a whole team to play around him for him to score goals. I think its the other way around. Shearer drags Newcastle kicking and screaming up the Premiership.

The only thing Bobby Robson did when he came to the club was to tell Shearer to stop running around in the middle third and to get into the box. He is quoted in an endless stream of interviews and profiles as saying that he wanted his main man to get up front and let the rest of the team get the ball to him. Look at what he has bought since taking over - Robert, LuaLua, Ameobi, Bellamy and Bowyer - all players who play wide in support of a spearhead attacker or alongside such a striker and do his running, fetching and carrying for him

It only seems the other way around because the likes of Bellamy, Cort when he was there, and the rest of them are unbelievabley poor finishers!

Bellamy a poor finisher? Methinks you have a touch of the swine fever.

But the fact is, he wont, and the question remains, what is the real reason for his early retirement?

The real reason is the one he gave and continues to give. And even if it weren't - so what? He doesn't want to play for England any more. No biggy.

[Harry Ottis Guff]

Probably selfishness again as he wants to pursue a media career?

The man is a complete knob-jockey and couldn't live with the pace of modern day defenders (International) - he was good in his time - but that has long gone!

Leave him on his zimmer - what we've got will have to do!

How can he be good enough to terrorize defenders in the Premiership but not good enough for international defenders? How can he be above the likes of Anelka, Saha, Owen etc in the Premiership top goals scorers but not be good enough to play a friendly international against Sweden? Most Premiership defenders are internationals. If you can perform in the Premiership you can do at international level. The step isnt that big. Infact, when you play the likes of Macedonia, its a hell of alot easier than playing say, Liverpool! Look at Vassel, he play better for England than he does for Villa.

[When Hell Unfreezes]

How can he be good enough to terrorize defenders in the Premiership but not good enough for international defenders?

Because the defenders in the premiership (other than the obvious few) are sh!te! And he doesn't terrorise anyone these days, other than the old girls in the pension queue!

How can he be above the likes of Anelka, Saha, Owen etc in the Premiership top goals scorers but not be good enough to play a friendly international against Sweden?

Because Anelka is cack, Owen is suffering a slump in form and who the fcuk is Saha?

Most Premiership defenders are internationals. If you can perform in the Premiership you can do at international level. The step isnt that big.

Most are internationals nearing the end of their international careers - just look at the Arse, Manure, Chelski and Liverpool for proof!

Hogmeister - you need to get out of the sty a bit more often my friend, the stench is clouding your thinking!

[Matt Clark]

How can he be good enough to terrorize defenders in the Premiership but not good enough for international defenders?


Terrorize? Pffh.

Seven of his 19 league goals are penalties, for a start. Of the remaining 12, seven were against Leeds, Wolves, Portsmouth and Manchester City. Sorry, but whilst Shearer remains a very potent threat in EPL terms (as long as the Newcastle team do their job properly and supply him with chances inside the box) he is not "terrorizing" anyone. Certainly, nothing in his record suggests he would still be a threat to international defenders at a major tournament, playing in a team that does not consider it's one and only job to be supplying Alan Shearer with convertible goalscoring opportunities.

[Harry Ottis Guff]

Terrorize? Pffh.

Seven of his 19 league goals are penalties, for a start. Of the remaining 12, seven were against Leeds, Wolves, Portsmouth and Manchester City. Sorry, but whilst Shearer remains a very potent threat in EPL terms (as long as the Newcastle team do their job properly and supply him with chances inside the box) he is not "terrorizing" anyone. Certainly, nothing in his record suggests he would still be a threat to international defenders at a major tournament, playing in a team that does not consider it's one and only job to be supplying Alan Shearer with convertible goalscoring opportunities.

Ok then Matt, who do you consider to be international standard in the Premiership? I bet most of them havent scored as much as Shearer this year! We are preparing to play Rooney up front in the summer, but he has never even played European football, and his goalscoring tally is appalling. And even if most of Shearer'sgoalsdocome against the likesof Man City and Portsmouth etc, as I said before, if he can score against these sides he certainly can against **********ing Switzerland and Croatia. You say he wouldnt be a threat do international defenders in a major tournament, but, who else would that we have? If our top goalscorer in the Premiership woulnt be a major threat, then no one at our disposal would be!

To Hell Unfreezes: You say Premiership defenders are sh1te, well how good are Polish defenders, Swiss defenders? They have players at the back no where near good enough for the Premiership. Furthermore, Shearer seems to feel he would be able to play in the Champions League, and the standard of football in this tournament is as high as international football so what he is saying, and you are saying doesnt make sense. Furthermore, you can only pick players for international level based on how they play against regular Premiership sides. Playing well and scoring against ANY Premiership opposition is what we must base the calibre of our players on, because there is nothing else to go by! If a plyer does well in the Premiership, he can perform at international level, simple as that! Also, how can you say Anelka is cack, we would snap his fingers off if he were English, have you ever bothered to watch him play?

[Matt Clark]

Ok then Matt, who do you consider to be international standard in the Premiership?
All the usual suspects. But you miss the point - this is not about goals scored in the Premier League alone, this is about the blanket issue of suitability to the international game and, more specifically, this current England side. As has been explained, the only reason Shearer scores as regularly as he does for Newcastle (against the bottom feeders in the EPL mainly) is because the entire team is configured to suit him and him alone. England have neither the luxury nor the need to play like that. It would be a retrograde step - especially for a player who is 34.

The England team will most likely fail to win Euro 2004 for one reason or another, but the absence of Shearer will not be a factor.



Shearer seems to feel he would be able to play in the Champions League
For NEWCASTLE!!!


Playing well and scoring against ANY Premiership opposition is what we must base the calibre of our players on, because there is nothing else to go by!
Of course there is, it is about balance of squad, suitability for tactics, suitability for other players in the team, it is about a multitude of nuanced tactical and managerial considerations that you have completely ignored. The pro-Shearer argument is always "he scores goals for Newcastle, ergo no other consideration is worth taking into account". If international football management were that easy, we wouldn't be paying a Swede £4m a year to do it for us.


If a plyer does well in the Premiership, he can perform at international level, simple as that!
Tell that to Kevin Phillips. Tell that to James Beattie. Matter of fact, tell that to any of the dozens and dozens and dozens of players, past and present, who would laugh in your face if you did. Tell that to Andy Cole! Ha! Now there's a chuckle.

Tell that to Steve Bruce, John Barnes, Matt Le Tissier, Glenn Hoddle, Eric Cantona, Niall Quinn, Chris Sutton, Graeme Le Saux, Robbie Fowler, Jamie Redknapp, Stan Collymore, David Ginola, Paolo di Canio, Alan Smith (the first one) ... you get my drift.

[Harry Ottis Guff]

Sven needs to pick the best players in their positions to play in the England team. Suitability? As long as they play well in their positions they can play well in the same positions but in a different team. Youve merely spouted some jargon that does nothing for England but attempt to justify Heskey's inclusion. Sven doesnt need to pick players because they are suitable! Beacue they know others from club level! He needs to pick them because they are good enough! Heskey only plays because he is big and acts as a foil for Owen, but this is simply not good enough. We may pay Sven £4 million a year, but even he will tell you, he merely chooses the BEST players available. There are no deep, philisophical issues clouding his judgement. Tactics is something he can work on with his first team before a game, but it doesnt effect personnell changes because an international manager often knows his first 11 before a ball has even been kicked in a tournament, and will try to stick as closely to this as injuries will allow. I firmly believe that Shearer would have played under Sven from the very beginning because he is better than anyone else we have.

How exactly do Newcastle have a team configered to suit Shearer? They play a normal 442, they have a big striker up front with a faster, smaller guy in Bellamy, infact, they have a very typical line up, no different than any other club. They dont play around Shearer, but Shearer is the only decent finisher they have. True, they have always had two good wingers who can put balls into the box, but again, this is normal. Shearer scores a lot of goals because of his quality, simple as that mate! He can finish his chances, unlike Bellamy and LuaLua!

As for Phillips and Beattie, they were never as prolific as Shearer. Beattie was a one season wonder and Phillips was hardly any more. If they were prollific they would of been snapped up by bigger clubs. Niether of them has Champions league experience,and niether are any more than average players. They are not in Shearer's league, and not comparible. Same with all the rest of the players you mentioned.

Basically, a player scoring so much in the Premiership is good enough for interational football. Sven's job is to pick the BEST plaers and try to stick with that team of 11 players as closely as possible in a tournment. Tactics at this leel come AFTER he has chosen his best side, and he gets them t play accordingly. Shearer may not be fast but he can score goals. We wouldnt need to play the whole team around him for him to play well, because his partnership up front with owen would be similar to that at Newcastle with Bellamy. He is brilliant with his head and with high balls forward which would suit the long accurate passing of Gerrard and Beckham. He would provide the same strength as Heskey but also be a goal threat. He has experience at the highest level and is coming off the back of a great domestic season, and would do the job well!

[Matt Clark]

Suitability? As long as they play well in their positions they can play well in the same positions but in a different team.
If you seriously believe it's that simple, then you've a lot to learn.



Youve merely spouted some jargon that does nothing for England but attempt to justify Heskey's inclusion.
Jargon? What jargon? And I didn't even mention Heskey. I don't want Heskey in the England team.



Sven doesnt need to pick players because they are suitable!
Is that so? :rolleyes: I guess we had better tell Alan Thompson he's not required after all because Steven Gerrard is fine to continue on the left of midfield.

Come on, this is nonsense. Of course you need to pick players who are suitable to your system and to the other players in the squad.

Tactics is something he can work on with his first team before a game, but it doesnt effect personnell changes
No, but it affects personell selection in the first place.


How exactly do Newcastle have a team configered to suit Shearer? They play a normal 442, they have a big striker up front with a faster, smaller guy in Bellamy, infact, they have a very typical line up, no different than any other club.
That's been explained to you by a number of posters, you either get it or you don't. You only have to watch Newcastle - or, more pertinently, listen to their manager, who is quite open about the fact that his entire team is built to Shearer's strengths - to understand this basic situation.


Shearer scores a lot of goals because of his quality, simple as that mate!
I've never argued otherwise. But that has no bearing on the fact that at Newcastle he is catered for in a manner that England have neither the need nor the desire to do.


Same with all the rest of the players you mentioned.
The point, Hoggo, was to refute your claim that performing well at league level means you are automatically certain to perform equally well at international level.

And John Barnes was incomparably better at his prime than Shearer at his.


We wouldnt need to play the whole team around him for him to play well, because his partnership up front with owen would be similar to that at Newcastle with Bellamy.
Shearer and Owen were a terrible partnership. England with Shearer as the focal point were a terrible team. You can tapdance around that all you will, it will not change the truth of the matter.

Ultimately, Hog me old mucker, this is a pointless argument. Shearer is a thing of the past, an anacronism, an international has been who will never wear the Three Lions again. And neither he nor anyone currently connected with the England set-up has the faintest problem with that. The vast majority of England fans don't either because they can remember the mess he was when he last played for us and do not want to regress to a team with that lumpen, lumbering shadow of his former self as our focal point.

You're just going to have to learn to deal with it.

[When Hell Unfreezes]

http://image.guardian.co.uk/sys-images/Football/Pix/gallery/2003/03/14/ashearer30-toe.gif

http://image.guardian.co.uk/sys-images/Football/Pix/gallery/2003/03/14/ashearer21-toe.gif

Even the venerable Mr Robson (Sir) says Shearer is too old - which is why he left him out of the Vallerenga (spelling) game!

[afgrijselijkheid]

when did james beattie get a fair look with england matt?

[Matt Clark]

I'm not sure I can comment on when he got a "fair look". He was selected when scoring lots of goals for Saints, got a couple of caps and has not been picked again during this season because his performances have not warranted it.

[afgrijselijkheid]

I'm not sure I can comment on when he got a "fair look". He was selected when scoring lots of goals for Saints, got a couple of caps and has not been picked again during this season because his performances have not warranted it.


FTR, he's played about 155 minutes total over 5 appearances (2 appearances were of less than 3 minutes)