World Cup Seeding Proposal [R]

Discussion in 'FIFA and Tournaments' started by chapka, Nov 20, 2013.

  1. chapka

    chapka Member+

    May 18, 2004
    Haverford, PA
    Club:
    Philadelphia Union
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    People have been griping about the World Cup draw, especially this year. So I thought I'd see what would happen if you set up the World Cup groups by a non-random process.

    Here's how it works:

    1. Start with the current FIFA rankings. Yes, I know all the problems with them--but they're what FIFA would be likely to use if they adopted a seeding system.

    2. Assign each team to a group in a snake pattern. So the top ranked eight teams go in pots 1 through 8, the next best also goes in pot 8, the next best in pot 7, and so on.

    3. If a natural placement would result in a confederation having more than one spot, skip it and move to the next pot. Europe is allowed to have 5 pots with 2 teams.

    4. If there is no place to put a team in the fourth position, it is swapped with the previous team until a valid result is reached. (Theoretically this can get complicated--in this case, only the last two teams, Australia and Cameroon, were swapped).

    Here's the ranking that resulted (assuming no upset in the final qualifier); the numbers are the FIFA ranking used. (Brazil was seeded first, of course).

    Do you think these would be more or less balanced than what a FIFA draw would give us? Do you think this would be subject to gaming, with teams trying to tank their FIFA ranking for some perceived advantage? Would you rather have a deterministic system like this one, or would you miss the random draw?

    POT 1

    Brazil (11)
    Bosnia-Herzegovina (16)
    Cote d'Ivoire (17)
    Australia (56)

    POT 2

    Spain (1)
    Greece (15)
    Ecuador (22)
    Cameroon (59)

    POT 3

    Germany (2)
    Chile (12)
    Croatia (18)
    South Korea (56)

    POT 4

    Argentina (3)
    Portugal (14)
    Russia (19)
    Iran (49)

    POT 5

    Colombia (4)
    USA (13)
    France (21)
    Japan (44)

    POT 6

    Belgium (5)
    England (10)
    Ghana (23)
    Honduras (34)

    POT 7

    Uruguay (6)
    Italy (9)
    Mexico (24)
    Nigeria (33)

    POT 8

    Switzerland (7)
    Netherlands (8)
    Costa Rica (31)
    Algeria (32)
     
  2. Iranian Monitor

    Iranian Monitor Member+

    Aug 18, 2004
    Nat'l Team:
    Iran
    I already did what you suggest, except I got the following groups. Which I like even more, since I made one adjustment to make sure teams from the same confederations were put in different groups. (UEFA eligible to have 2 teams in any group but others only 1).

    Incidentally, I don't know about the rest of you with your comments underestimating Iran, but I really like Group E!:)

    Group B
    1. Spain (#1)
    2. Bosnia (#16)
    3. Ivory Coast (#17)
    4. Australia (#57)

    Group C
    1. Germany (#2)
    2. Greece (#15)
    3. Ecuador (#22)
    4. South Korea (#56)

    Group D
    1. Argentina (#3)
    2. Portugal (#14)
    3. Croatia (#18)
    4. Cameroon (#59)
    Group E
    1. Colombia (#4)
    2. USA (#13)
    3. Russia (#19)
    4. Iran (#49)
    Group F
    1. Belgium (#5)
    2. Chile (#12)
    3. Ukraine (#20)
    4. Japan (#44)
    Group G
    1. Uruguay (#6)
    2. England (#10)
    3. Ghana (#23)
    4. Honduras (#34)
    Group H
    1. Switzerland (#7)
    2. Italy (#8)
    3. Mexico (#24)
    4. Nigeria (#33)
    Group A (hosts)

    1. Brazil (#11)
    2. Netherlands (#8)
    3. Costa Rica (#31)
    4. Algeria (#32)
     
  3. EvanJ

    EvanJ Member+

    Manchester United
    United States
    Mar 30, 2004
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Considering that there are no friendly matchdays before the World Cup draw that didn't also have qualifiers, how much opportunity would there be for teams to "tank their FIFA Ranking" even if they wanted to? Teams that considered doing that would have to try to guess whether Portugal or Sweden would win the playoff (and the same goes for other playoffs) in order to guess what World Cup group would be better for them. Also by tanking their FIFA Ranking it could make it harder for the country to qualify for World Cup 2018.
     
  4. JAIME CHILE

    JAIME CHILE Member+

    Apr 26, 2006
    V.Alemana y Stgo
    Club:
    Cobreloa Calama
    Nat'l Team:
    Chile
    Ukraine didn't qualify. You forgot France;)
     
  5. chapka

    chapka Member+

    May 18, 2004
    Haverford, PA
    Club:
    Philadelphia Union
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    The idea is, since the seeds would be determined by formula instead of a draw, teams with dead rubbers at the end of qualifying (like the U.S. this time around) might be able to affect their pot by taking a dive in those games--or, in the U.S. case, whether Mexico or Panama advanced might actually affect their placement, for instance.

    I don't think it's likely myself, but was wondering if someone smarter than I might be able to come up with a scenario.
     
    Iranian Monitor repped this.
  6. Iranian Monitor

    Iranian Monitor Member+

    Aug 18, 2004
    Nat'l Team:
    Iran
    Fortunately, that is not going to mess Iran's group (Group E)! Just put France in place of Ukraine in Group F and that group suddenly looks a lot tougher!
     
  7. Michaelf7777777

    Apr 20, 2012
    Wellington
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Nat'l Team:
    New Zealand
    Using this method for earlier world cups get the following draws (using ELO for World Cups prior to 1994)

    2010

    A

    South Africa
    Chile
    Serbia
    North Korea

    B

    Brazil
    Mexico
    Cote d'Ivoire
    New Zealand

    C

    Spain
    Greece
    Paraguay
    South Korea

    D

    Netherlands
    Cameroon
    Australia
    Slovenia

    E

    Italy
    Switzerland
    Uruguay
    Japan

    F

    Germany
    USA
    Denmark
    Ghana

    G

    Argentina
    Portugal
    Algeria
    Slovakia

    H

    England
    France
    Nigeria
    Honduras
     
  8. Michaelf7777777

    Apr 20, 2012
    Wellington
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Nat'l Team:
    New Zealand
    2006

    A

    Germany
    Costa Rica
    Iran
    Angola

    B

    Brazil
    Croatia
    Poland
    Australia

    C

    Netherlands
    Japan
    Tunisia
    Trinidad & Tobago

    D

    Czech Republic
    Sweden
    South Korea
    Ghana

    E

    Argentina
    Italy
    Saudi Arabia
    Serbia & Montenegro

    F

    France
    England
    Paraguay
    Togo

    G

    Mexico
    Portugal
    Ecuador
    Ukraine

    H

    USA
    Spain
    Switzerland
    Cote d'Ivoire
     

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