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Discussion in 'Spain' started by jcvf90, May 5, 2010.
Xavi Hernandez is one of the best FOR SURE
Spain had always great national team, great goalkeepers (Andoni Zubi., Santiago Canizares, Francisco Molina, Reina, Victor Valdes, Casillas.
But for me Gaizka Mendieta was complete player. We should watch by decades, it's hard to compare someone from 90's with someone from 50s.
I remember that Real Madrid had great generation: Piri, Sol, Camacho, del Bosque.
But Barcelona has best team ever.
Xavi is an amazing player. As stated before by many others, he makes it look easy and simple, and it's like he has eyes on the back of his head. Him and Iker are both the greatest of this most successful generation.
But let's take a moment to look into the career of Luisito Suarez, the only Spanish born player to win the Ballon d'Or, and the most honoured Spanish player prior to this era. Suarez won it all except the World Cup; he was successful in the Spanish League, the Italian Serie A, and with the National team.
This is part 1 of 3 (I recommend to watch all 3) of a short but great documentary, which shows highlights of his inmense class:
[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SPSdX-odTxc"]Luis Suárez Miramontes pt.1 - YouTube[/ame]
Luis Suarez Miramontes
Clubs: (as a player)Deportivo de la Coruna (1952-54), Barcelona (1954-61), Inter Milan (1961-1970), Sampdoria (1970-1973); (as a coach) Inter (1974-75), Cagliari (1975-1976), SPAL (1976-77), Como (1977-78), Cagliari (1977-78), Deportivo de la Coruna (1978-79)
National team: U21 Spanish national team (1980-88), Spanish national team (A) (1988-91), Inter (1991-92), Albacete (1994-95), Inter (1995-96). 32 matches (14 goals)
Honours: with FC Barcelona - 2 Spanish leagues (1959 and 1960), 2 Spanish cups (1957 and 1959) and 2 Fairs Cups (1958 and 1960); with Inter Milan - 2 Intercontinental Cups (1964 and 1965), 2 European Cups (1964 and 1965), 3 Scudetti (1963, 1965 and 1966). Ballon d'or (1960, 2nd in 1961 and 1964, 3rd in 1965); with Spain - UEFA European Championship 1964; as coach - UEFA U-21 European Championship 1986.
Strikers: 1. Villa 2. Raúl 3. Butragueño
Midfielders: 1. Xavi 2. Iniesta 3. Luisito Suárez
Defenders: 1. Puyol 2. Hierro 3. José Camacho
Goalkeepers: 1. Casillas 2. Valdés 3. Zubizarreta
Where do you rank Jacinto Quincoces and Ricardo Zamora at their positions?
Controversially, I don't really rate footballers who pre-date the 60s.
What the ******** are you talking about? Jesus christ, learn proper English before you utter the words "best player in the world". The position you play have no correlation to how skilled you are, neither does the amounts of titles you accumulated.
Enough flaming, I would rank Casillas and Raul up there. Albeit, Spain doesn't have any "amazing" football players in the same class as Maradona, Pelé, Ronaldo 9, Zidane, luis figo, cruiff I.E.
You're first post on Big Soccer. Welcome.
And judging by your subsequent posts I don't see your sock lasting the month, if not the week.
What a shame that the greatest Spanish player ever was only mentioned once in a few dozen posts
1. Luis Suarez Miramontes
You are first post? Ever heard of spelling?
Instead of accusing others of being incorrigible (you most likely don't know what that means), take yourself a look in the mirror.
Practice what you preach, n00b.
also, Xavi > Zidane.
I changed my mind. It's Diego Capel
of course Raul!!!!!!
In my lifetime I'd have to go with Xavi.
Raul has his great time. Butt we're talking about EVER
Spain history's is full of loosers, as Raul, Arconada, Cardeñosa ...
Even more, considering the truth SPAIN (from Covadonga) we only can consider players as Villa, Luis Enrique, Quini, Juanele, Eloy ...
If you talk about Spain (included reconquired land) I understand your list. But thats why we only wright S in capital.
So far, the gratest of all only can be "el guaje"
When it comes to this type of discussion it is impossible to compare generations but titles have to mean something. Lets have a look at Paco Gento
6 European cups with Madrid
12 la liga titles,
2 Copa Del Rey
2 Copa Latina (again with Madrid before the European cup started)
1 European championship with Spain.
i dont think anyone not even Xavi and Iniesta will match that
Messi..... spain might as well claim him already since if he keeps playing the way he does for argentina they are not going to want him anymore so he can ask for a spain passport
I never thought i'd have to defend a guy who spent majority of his professional life in real madrid, but really, for all the glory he's brought upon Spain i feel compelled to respond to this. The LA Lakers won two more championships after Shaq's departure. Does this reduce the value of his contribution to the team? Certainly not. I can think of a couple other greats across many sports who have made tremendous contributions to the legacy of their teams and yet those teams have learned, fortunately, to live on even after those players have left. Please, I don't know you and you don't know me, and i know this is a pretty old post, but I really hope you'd learn/you've learned to show respect especially in a thread frequented by fans of Spain (or any country or team or player, for that matter). Trolling won't make you a cent richer.
All the glory Raúl brought upon Spain was at club level.
Regarding Shaq, his value of contribution isn't affected since he himself won three championships with the Lakers.
Raúl won zero titles with Spain... Spain never reached a final with Raúl... Spain never even reached a semifinal with Raúl in the squad.
6 of his 44 international goals were scored in 18 World Cup and EURO final matches, and NONE of those six goals came during the knockout rounds.
Before he earned his first call up in national colors Spain were hard luck quarterfinalists in '94 and '96. And we know what has happened after he was no longer selected. So what exactly was his value of contribution to the national team?
Great player with Real Madrid, there's no argument about that. And he could probably be listed among the top five greatest Spanish players of all-time. But #1? Not in my book.
I'm posting this before the Italy EURO final kicked off but I think Casillas has become a strong candidate for the honor. In no particular order, Luis Suarez, Xavi and Casillas would be my leading contenders. Perhaps Ricardo Zamora as well.
Toss-up between Casillas and Xavi now. Can't argue with the trophy haul. Then Luis Suarez. And we end up with a big group of contenders for #4.
indeed. Casillas and Xavi are the first two guys on a lot of people's minds when asked this question.
I never said Raúl is the best Spanish player ever. I just reacted to way some people tend to sound as if he didn't do anything for Spain because he didn't lead Spain to a title. That's like saying the members of the USA Nightmare Team all sucked. A title sure does help in making a case for inclusion among the list of greats, but it should not be the end-all-be-all.
And regarding Shaq. I think you're missing the point. Just because he won three championships with the Lakers and Raúl did not win championships with Spain doesn't preclude anyone from questioning Shaq's greatness in the same manner that many people are now questioning Raúl's. My point is that just because a team wins championships without a player doesn't reduce the value of that player. To make it even more clear, a player doesn't have to be able to carry his team to a championship (or even simply be a member of a championship team) to deserve appreciation. The guy i quoted said, "Spain finally won another major trophy without him ", and this is exactly what i hate. Spoken like a true ingrate. That, or a flamer.
I'll ask you again: What exactly was his value of contribution to the national team?
Forget winning titles. Just look at the numbers and situations:
- 6 goals in 18 matches at World Cup and EURO finals.
- NONE of those six goals were scored in the knockout rounds.
- Skied a last minute penalty over the bar that would have sent the EURO 2000 quarterfinal against France into extra time.
I don't think anyone has suggested that. We'd be hard pressed to find someone who thinks Paolo Rossi is Italy's all-time greatest player.
No, winning a title should not be the end-all-be-all, but key contributions to the national team's cause even though they may come up short from touching the trophy should be considered if we're talking about a country's all-time greatest player, imo.
I would hope not.
Best captain, best player.