/\ What was weirdest of all about that Blackburn relegation-to-promotion story is that Graeme Sounness was the one to actually turn the club around and bring it back to a respectable level, iirc. I still find myself sometimes wondering who it was that got them back in the Premiership before Souey took over, only to again be brought back to the twilight zone.
Good old Souey. He actually did well for us ... if only he hadn't knocked out most of the team in training ground bust ups we'd probably still have him
Ya know...Souness might be a good guy for Newcastle to hire for the rest of this season. If he wasn't persona non grata in Newcastle it just might work!
Apparently so. Although none of the Newcastle players I listed are bad players. The parallel between that and the West Ham situation is very apt. Well this will be the fascinating thing: do Newcastle have enough guts to get 12 points from 9 games - and will it be enough if they do? They'll deffo lose to Everton, Chelsea and Spurs. So they need to pick their 12 points up from the other six games. Given that this includes Fulham, Birmingham and Reading in their next four games, you'd think they need to pick the bulk of those 12 points up in the next month. Get six or less from that little lot and they're gone, basically. Because after that, it's Chelsea, West Ham away, the derby against the Mackems (which as we all know can go either way) and Everton away. Not what you would call a crushing burden, under the circumstances ...
I looked at the fixtures recently, and until then I didn't think they stood a chance of going down. Now it's looking dodgy, if they fail to capitalise on the next 4 games Keegan will be pictured with pencils up nose, undercrackers on head. Big Sam's nadger will have fallen off through laughing and it'll be Carlisle here we come for a derby.
Birmingham and Reading are plucky teams, especially being led by Mcleish and Coppell respectively. Both are still in relegation trouble so they will be even tougher to beat. Maybe they draw. So give them 2 points. Fulham are almost done. Give them 3 points. Tottenham, Chelsea, Portsmouth, and Everton are good. Everton, Chelsea, and Portsmouth will all be looking for three points for sure to push for UEFA/CL places. If Newcastle can get one point from these three games that would be amazing. Sunderland and West Ham are not good and average respectively. But if Newcastle have gotten only six points from the other games they need to win these. The real question is. Will someone(Bolton, Birmingham, Sunderland, Wigan, or Reading)be worse?
so what happens to the Messiah today if he the Brummies win? Does he continue to get a free pass or will he run off to the woods again?
You just don't seem to understand the Newcastle Way, if he loses, so long as he does it in the Newcastle Way it is perfectly acceptable. Although it's not on until tomorrow night, iirc.
lol billy, oh I understand the Newcastle Way. I just cant imagine the Messiah taking them to the brink of relegation under the premise that "he needs time to build this team" which he predecessor asked for and clearly didnt get. Such a circus.
But he is The Messiah. The Messiah knows the Newcastle Way, so surely in time he will find the Newcastle Way again. You see, for one thing you have forgotten a vital ingredient of the Newcastle Way which involves high-profile players, zero patience, and instant success on the field equal to that of teams who have taken years to build up that chemistry with equal-if-not-superior players. If a manager does not achieve this inside of two months, the only other way of him lasting beyond half of the season is if has been there before. For then he know the Newcastle Way and it is just a matter of finding it. Simple Geordie logic really.
you do realise that you just said Geordie and logic in the same sentence correct? Big Sam must be grinning from ear to ear atm.
Ah yes, but there is logic and then there is Geordie logic. Kind of like hamburger, and McDonald's hamburger.
Whoever it is, it won't be Keegan. Considering the amount of players Leeds sold before they went down, I actually reckon that this would be the most talented/high profile group of players to get relegated. It really is quite shocking - even Trevor Brooking would struggle to help them now.
Given Fulham's result today, it will be interesting to see not just what happens against Brum tomorrow, but also what Newcastle manage next weekend. As I said earlier in this thread, they need six points from their next two games to have any realistic chance of reaching 40 points (and thereby, theoretically, reaching safety). Fulham have now made something that was merely important, absolutely essential. It's clear Ashley doesn't know a whole lot about football. He went for a populist and entirely misconstrued remedy to a problem that didn't exist. He made the mistake of listening to Newcastle's fans not just once ("we don't like Allardyce"), but twice ("we all yearn for the good old days of Keegan"). It's hard to imagine him being that dumb in his business life, so you would imagine that relegation would see him come back to his senses and ditch Keegan during the summer. In fact, there's speculation in today's papers that Terry Venables is already being sounded out about taking on a promotion campaign.
I know its an impressive list of names, but when you drill down you see that Cole, Defoe, Smith, and Milner were still very young and lacked and sort of consistency, Paolo Di Canio was on the decline (althouth still the best player in the squad), and Kanoute was crap in the EPL, he just couldn't score goals for West Ham. On the other hand, its mind boggling that a squad with both the pedigree and depth of Newcastle could go down; I mean ********, look at these names: Given, Cacapa, Carr, Enrique, Taylor, Butt, Emre, Barton, Duff, Milner, Faye, Geremi, N'Zogbia, Martins, Owen, Viduka, and Smith. There's probably, at most, 5 of those players who haven't proven themselves Premiership quality at some point. Look back at those West Ham and Leeds sqauds and you'll see that certainly wasn't the case: West Ham 02/03: Ian Pearce, Thomas Repka, Nigel Winterburn, Steve Lomas, Eduardo Cisse, and Christian Daily made up an awful defense and CM for West Ham. Carrick, Cole, and Defoe were certainly there, but were still young players and lacked the necessary consistency. Leeds 03/04: Seth Johnson, Ian Harte, Gary Kelly, Michael Duberry, Zoumana Camara, Lamine Sahko, and Jody Morris were some of the regulars who didn't belong anywhere near the Premiership that season. Jermaine Pennant also appeared frequently and was fairly garbage, as he was for most of his career until getting a second chance with Birmingham. Looking back I can certainly see the warning signs with West Ham and Leeds, but when I look at Newcastle's squad, I see a list of players that should likely be competiting for Europe and that has necessary depth. Which is likely what makes this so enjoyable.
It would superspectacularawesome if Fulham got their first road win since, I think, Sept. 2006 against Newcastle. That would be The Moment.
The majority of those players had "done it" in the Premier League for years, for West Ham and Leeds, as well as their previous clubs. Some (including Ian Harte) had played in a Champions' League semi-final.
Yeah - we will, and Fat Freddie Shepherd. Its only because you lot started to pay attention after Allardyce got the boot, but we were dropping serious points before then. Derby have 4 of their 10 points from us (under Allardyce). The Wigan defeat was terrible... if you thought Newcastle were bad at Liverpool see if you can remember that. Keegan came in at a time when we had a tough fixture list and a bunch of quality individuals but no team. We were lucky to beat Birmingham and Wigan earlier in the season... this did not suddenly start when Keegan came back. The win at Fulham was also dodgy. We would be no better now if we'd left Allardyce in charge, in fact we'd probably be worse off and you lot would be saying how stupid we were to appoint him in the first place. You'd be right on that note. (which is where FFS comes in). Newcastle fans are actually thinking if we can survive (which we probably will but it will be close) and get to the summer.... we can let Keegan build a team over a number of seasons. I know - crazy reactionary fans eh? And yes we didn't give Allardyce time - but thats like giving Dr. Frankenstein the time to turn you into Bolton.
Believe us, we're always aware of what goes on at Newcastle, every time someone farts, thanks to the media Seriously though, wouldn't you love to have a bit of what Bolton had under Sam? Granted you'd get neck ache from the high balls but the results weren't bad and with no budget. It'd be interesting to see what he'd have done given time, maybe. Do you think Keegan's up to it now? He always looks confused these days.
Not as many as you've been dropping since then. Even allowing for the relative toughness of some fixtures, it's been freefall all the way. Only Bolton's resolute (post-Allardyce) crapness is stopping relegation from being a certainty. And Fulham may yet have something to say on that matter too, especially if allowed to when they visit Newcastle on the weekend. No, we'd be saying that he needs time to make the sort of changes Newcastle have been crying out for for over a decade now, but their fans won't permit. That's what any sane observer would say. This is the epitome of what's wrong: what kind of team do you expect Keegan to build? This is a man who, upon returning, claimed not to have watched ANY football in the three years he had been out of the game. Even with the best scouting network in the world (and Newcastle do not have the best scouting network in the world), you're going to struggle to come up with a set of players that's materially better than the players that are already there. So then it's back to that old canard, the Keegan motivational powers. Take what's there and make them into world beaters by sheer force of will. Yaaaaawn. Not only will you end up relegated, you'll end up with a side full of Championship players whose only determinable merit is that they would run through a brick wall if Keegan asked them to. Thick try-hards, in other words. The sort that got Leeds relegated a second time, to put it yet another way.
I have to agree with the comments regarding this post above. No offence, but given time I think Big Sam would have solidified and consolodated a team and pushed for a UEFA spot. The pressure on Keegan, which the media really have yet to push to full throttle, is nowhere near as bad as the stick Big Sam was getting. IMO the team is playing worse, but thats just my humble opine from watching Newcastle play. Perhpas with time and investment things will get better, problem is that Keegan does not have a great deal of time atm does he?