What has happened to the English teams in the CL?

Inter's chaces are about the same as Arsenal. The Gunners are too dependent on van Persie and given his injury record....

And I think Napoli's and Milan's chances are roughly the same as Chelsea. But 3 tickets in the lottery stands more chance than 2.

 

Neither Chelsea nor Arsenal would be too worried facing any of the serie A teams. Arsenal already took care of a serie team( beating them home and away) that is probably better than the 3 serie A team in CL. And that was when Arsenal were awful!

 

Are you talking about Udinese? Udinese have practically zero euro experience and against Aresenal they were extremely unlucky If anything.

Face it, Arsenal doesn't have the resources anymore. They can't afford to rest players in the new year ands there is no indication that they will be investing in players. Moreover, there form away from home has been below average at best. I could see an Arsenal fan expecting a result in Milan with fabregas and whatever french affiliated player being in their ranks but I'll take a forward rotation of four world class players over whatever arsenal is peddling any day.

English pundits are really gasping for air this time and that euro train is not stopping for you.

 

You're using Arsenal's victories over Udinese as a basis for this argument? You've got to be kidding. Udinese have a light of fight in them, and that is admirable, but they are a team with little European experience and they basically sell their best players every summer (Sanchez, Inler, Zapata, etc.) to stay afloat.

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Frankly, I agree with the bookmakers in that it's Barcelona and Real the frontruners with Bayern afterward. I would then put Milan and Chelsea in the next tier, and then Inter, Napoli and Arsenal in the following one.

 

canzano, your usualy up to date, what the hell are you talking about 'arsenal dont have the resources??' they bought players for the first time in years this summer, 9 of them, and they will buy more in the winter, and more in the summer, and so on. they didnt spend money because arsene didnt want to, and now he has been forced to by circumstances. he is now a 'buying' manager again. not saying they will get messi, but they are now as likely as any of the 'non big 5' of the big leagues to sign a player, who, , if offered the right money, will hold the arsenal offer in as high a regard as any of bayern, milan, inter, juve, with real barca as first choice, and city, chelsea and utd at second (ie, the big 5 buyers from the big leagues, ie doesnt include anzi, psg or others outside of eng/sp/gy/it). and of course, this doesnt just cover transfers (of upto around 30million max generally for the non big5 ), this also includes high wages which , though not as obious and catchy as the transfer fee, is also massively important) for example, andy carol, shit as he may be, was 35m in transfer. but his wages, relative to other players with a cost like this, are a pitance and even affordable by liverpool. they could not have afforded aguero at, what 40m, just 5m more, because of his wages. to a team like arsenal, they can afford the transfer and the wages , and have the status. their wage bill must be in the top 5 or 6 in the world, maybe higher.

 

Love the desperation of the Serie A fans

This is the last season in which Italy has 4 teams in the CL, right?

 

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0irL1M15DH8"]De La Soul - The Magic Number - YouTube[/ame]

 

And the irony is we are the only ones with 3 teams left in the CL!!!

 

You're taking this argument into another direction.

I'm not going to poke fun at Arsenal for not pony-ing up 40 million quid for Aguero just like I wouldn't fault Juventus or Bayern Munich for that matter. My argument simply comes down to this: Arsenal has more games to play then Milan between now and the spring not to mention the FA Cup (I fully expect them to beat Leeds) in which case they have to stretch their roster farther apart.

Up until very recently you would expect Arsenal to advance into the later stages of the Champions League, usually on the backs of players with a lot European notoriety; now I think there is a case to be made that pound - for - pound they find themselves in the "middle class CL bracket".

You'll say: "you don't know what the hell you're talking about, Arsenal have a superstar in Van Persie, Sagna, Gervinho, and Walcott". Well guess what? Napoli has Lavezzi, Cavani and Hamsik. Benfica has Cardozo, Aimar and Witsel. Levrkusen has Augusto and Shurrle. Lyon have Gourcuff (a player Wenger probably covets) Kallstrom and Gomis. Milan has Ibrahimovic, Robinho and Pato.

If you thought Arsenal didn't have any guarantee's before, they certainly don't now.

 

I wouldn't call it desperation, I'd call it a keen appreciation for gradual change.

Lets see if you're smiling in 5 years, nothing lasts forever friend.

 

playing barca and not just folding is never 'just doing your job', and from what i saw of milan in the second leg, they played without fear and at times took the game to barca, which is ridiculously tough to do, even if barcas away form in the league is not good.

onto the first leg, milan played bunker ball, but they ddrew and scored twice. do you know how many goals barca have conceded at home in 9 matches in the league? 0.

yes, milan qualified with the same number of points as united but they deserve credit on the basis of the barca matches.

 

Inter's group was no easier than Dortmund's though. A team worse than Lille qualified out of Dortmund's group.

 

I was saying Lille are better than Marseille. For being a 4th seed, Dortmund received a sweet draw.

 

Three's the right number for you then.

I wouldn't read too much into this season, City are only going to improve, and United were knocked out at this stage a few years back, they went on to reach several finals.

 

Financial Fair Play, if applied legitimately, is going to hit hard for some of the big clubs of Europe who are full of debt. Now I don't know the situation amongst the Prem clubs, but I think it's fair to say we're not going to see a club that compares to REAL and Barca anytime soon coming out of the other leagues.

True that Italy lost it's 4th spot, but we're expected to gain it back after the following season. Platini and UEFA have also been talking about dumping the EL and making the CL bigger after 2013. We'll see.

Back to the question: Every league has it's ups and downs, SerieA was dominant in the 90s, Prem in the 00s, now it looks like Spain will be dominant for a few years. Bayern is also very good this year and I would consider them a favorite to win it all outside the Spanish teams.

Inter are shit right now, Milan is a mystery, and we're a team of heart. I wouldn't put money on any SerieA team right now but next year I'm certain the 3 or 2 that make the Cl from SerieA will be more competitive.

I also wouldn't be surprised to see MU, who is generally the leader in the CL from the Prem, go through a revolution and sell one of their stars. I read they're losing a lot of money missing out in the next round and need to find a way to make up for it.

Man City has the big oil money, but they really don't have that "Rooney, Ronaldo, or Messi" on their team yet. Balotelli and Aguero are still young, maybe next year they'll be a dominant force in the CL but who knows. I wasn't impressed with them this year.

 

Man United's advantage over everybody else really comes down to one man, and that is Ferguson. He has one of the best eye's for young talent in the history of the game, and he commands loyalty from his players.

He's had a legendary career and I respect him fully, but eventually things have to come to an end. There is no Christiano Ronaldo out there that will propel Man United into another winning cycle; Man U fans will say "excuse me but we played the final last season" but everybody knows they weren't the second best team in Europe that year. Clubs get lucky, I would know I'm a Milan fan we've had our fair share of luck, but eventually the holes start to show in the team and then reality sets it.

Man United's biggest hole is Rooney; he's a fantastic player and a top 3 forward in World football but you don't put all your stones in one player and pay him that ridiculous contract and then expect him to just carry you along to trophy's. "Oh yeah don't worry about the midfield and supporting forwards, lets just roll the dice on Rooney and surround him with unproven talents..."

And don't get me started with Abromovic. I don't care how rich he is, spending a few hundred million on buying a club and then spending close or over a billion dollars on furnishings over 7 years and then expect him to just repeat the same thing every 7 years is not good business. Compound that with the new fair-play system and I don't see a club from London winning anything major in Europe anytime soon.

 

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Lets see, your fellow serie A fan with no basis to argue says that Serie A teams are heads and shoulder above Arsenal and Chelsea; while I pointed out that Udinesea team in 3rd place in Seire A and really very comparable to Napoli (Napoli has even less recent champion league experience than Udinese) couldn't beat Arsenal when Arsenal were there for taking back in August (the were in very por form), and you dismiss it as a joke!!

Even if Udinese has sold its best player they are in 3rd place in serie A, ahead of Napoli and Inter. Spurs did not have any experience in last year, but they thumped both Milan teams!

I know serie A supporters will scream that this year Milan team is different; just as last years Milan team was different from the year before.
Sorry but I won't buy this serie A Renascence just yet! And I doubt tha either Gunners or Chelsea will be much displeased facing serie A teams.