Union Youth Development Thread [R]

Discussion in 'Philadelphia Union' started by derek750, Jul 23, 2010.

  1. Zman Gunner

    Zman Gunner BigSoccer Supporter

    Feb 7, 2003
    Middletown, DE
    Club:
    Philadelphia Union
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    He is certainly the one who has gotten the most chances with both the 1st team and reserve team. Hernandez may need more time in the Union Academy before the Union could lay claim to him - plus his Mexican nationality could cause international roster spot angst.

    Union beat KC 2-0 (including a Pfeffer goal) but Dallas beats Seattle 3-1, so depite not giving up any goals and finishing with 2 wins and a tie - the Union finish in 2nd place (Dallas finishes with 8 points with virtue of getting an additional point by beating the Union in a PK shootout - Union finish with 7 points). Next up - 2nd place team from Group A (could be DCU, Crew, Quakes or Dynamo).
     
  2. Zman Gunner

    Zman Gunner BigSoccer Supporter

    Feb 7, 2003
    Middletown, DE
    Club:
    Philadelphia Union
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    http://www.philadelphiaunion.com/academy/u18

    Union put an Academy section on its website including Fall schedule of friendlies - U18 team plays at home against:

    9/24 - NYRB @ Bob Urban Field - Brookhaven, PA
    10/8 - DCU @ YSC - Wayne, PA
    10/14 - Toronto @ YSC - Wayne, PA
     
  3. slitz

    slitz Member+

    Feb 19, 2005
    Red City, 140
    Club:
    Philadelphia Union
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
  4. Zman Gunner

    Zman Gunner BigSoccer Supporter

    Feb 7, 2003
    Middletown, DE
    Club:
    Philadelphia Union
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Union academy player (Cameron Keys) has his work cut our for him in goal - he is going against Jurgen Klinsmann's son.

    U.S. U-15 Boys’ National Team Roster by Position:
    GOALKEEPERS (4): Cameron Keys (Philadelphia Union; Whitehill, Pa.), Jonathan Klinsmann (Strikers FC; Newport Beach, Calif.), JT Marcinkowski (San Jose Earthquakes; Alamo, Calif), Parker Siegfried (Newark Area SA; Granville, Ohio)

    DEFENDERS (10): Billy Abdallah (Fullerton Rangers; Monterey Park, Calif.), Guillermo Bermudez (Albion SC; San Diego, Calif.), David Chavez (Juventus Forza; Redwood City, Calif.), Yosimar Hernandez (South Bay Gunners; Huntington Park, Calif.), Malcolm Jones (Chivas USA; Chino Hills, Calif.), Jean Orvil Jr. (West Pines United; Miramar, Fla.), Pablo Pelaez (Albion SC; San Diego, Calif.), Tommy Redding (FC America Premier; Oviedo, Fla.), Peter Schropp (Omaha FC; Omaha, Neb.), Max Stiegwardt (Minnesota Thunder Academy; Maple Grove, Minn.)

    MIDFIELDERS (10): Amir Bashti (San Jose Earthquakes; Cupertino, Calif.), Ivan Canales (West Coast FC; Santa Ana, Calif.), Chet Castellaw (Real So Cal; Hidden Hills, Calif.), Cameron Lindley (Indiana United Fire Academy; Carmel, Ind.), Martin Salas (FC Dallas; Dallas, Texas), Orestis Sousonis (New York Red Bulls; Dover, N.J.), Benny Swanson (Crew Soccer Academy; Grove City, Ohio), David Villegas (Elk Grove Everton; Sacramento, Calif.), Sean Wilson (PDA; Bethlehem, Pa.), Gedion Zelalem (Olney Rangers; Bethesda, Md.)

    FORWARDS (12): Mukwelle Akale (Minnesota Thunder Academy; Minneapolis, Minn.), Marc Calderon (South Bay Gunners; Huntington Park, Calif.), Coy Craft (Fusion FC; Glade Springs, Va.), Malcolm Dixon (New York Red Bulls; Glenridge, N.J.), Stephen Elias (New York Red Bulls; Rye, N.Y.), Collin Fernandez (Chicago Fire; Downers Gove, Ill.), Jacob Hernandez (Solar Chelsea SC; Mesquite, Texas), Nicholas Hinds (Plantation FC; Plantation, Fla.), Rey Ortiz (Carlsbad Lightning; San Diego, Calif.), Remington Pimm (IMG Academy; Tarpon Springs, Fla.), Amirgy Pineda (Fullerton Rangers; Santa Ana, Calif.), Alejandro Vergara (LA Galaxy; Long Beach, Calif.)
     
  5. Billy Zabka

    Billy Zabka Member+

    May 4, 2006
    RoFo, PA
    Club:
    Philadelphia Union
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    There's also a midfielder from PDA in this list - is he not in the Union academy?
     
  6. ScottK.

    ScottK. Member

    Sep 13, 2010
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Couldn't find any signs that he is and haven't gotten a yes or no yet, but PDA is an affiliate so he could always become part of the system in the future.
     
  7. rp22

    rp22 New Member

    Nov 25, 2009
    Philadelphia, PA
    Club:
    Philadelphia Union
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Anyone know the story on how, the Union landed the affiliation with PDA? Seems like that is going to be a very, very valuable affiliation. Interested in how players like Christian Hernandez and Cristian Francois who play for St. Benedict's in Newark end up in our academy.

    St. Benedict's has once again been #1 in the ESPN HS national rankings for most of the year, it's nice to see Union-affiliated players powering this team. This article says that Francois has 35 goals this year.

    http://sbpsoccer.com/prep_news/prep_news_item.php?n_id=79

    Edit: Think I solved the puzzle, put a few things together.

    The link must be Rick Jacobs, who left SBP last year to work for the Union. Whoever is responsible for that hire, looks like could provide the squad with a few players from right under NYRB's nose.
     
  8. billf

    billf Member+

    May 22, 2001
    Club:
    Philadelphia Union
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Jacobs is likely the link. He ran a PDA affiliate from Newark that included many of his St. Benedict's players. He had a close relationship with PDA and used it's facilities for a pre-season tournament a couple of times. I also think some of this comes from the rivalry between PDA and Red Bull once they started to compete for the same players. PDA is a very very good club. I was always impressed with their organization and I think this affiliation could prove as fruitful as the one with Delco. If the U could form an alliance with Match Fit as well it could lock NJ up quite nicely.
     
  9. Rickster

    Rickster Member

    Dec 1, 1998
    How F'ed up are RBNY to let all that happen?
     
  10. ScottK.

    ScottK. Member

    Sep 13, 2010
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    The Union are the only team in MLS that has an academy made up of club team players. The Red Bulls operate on a club academy system like nearly every other team in the world. Competing with PDA for players is how they can get the best players, otherwise PDA gets them and the Red Bulls can't apply Home Grown rules to those players.
     
  11. billf

    billf Member+

    May 22, 2001
    Club:
    Philadelphia Union
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    This goes back almost 10 years when the Metro Stars started entering their youth teams in the Super-Y league and then also decided to enter the state cup and the region 1 league too. Metro Stars started to poach a few players here and there and then beat a PDA team in the U19 final in 2005 to cement the animosity.

    This is why the Union have a nice model. The Metros came in and pretty much pissed everyone off and now has a smaller pool of home grown talent to pick from. The Union have worked with clubs and now have a larger pool from which to choose. I think the U give up some control, but the relationships they develop should find them in a situation where the big clubs are identifying players the U should take a look at.
     
  12. derek750

    derek750 Member+

    Apr 16, 2007
    Brooklyn
    Club:
    Philadelphia Union
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I understand the short-term benefits but realistically don't see how the Union model can last. Maybe I'm wrong but giving up control over player development is no small thing. The team should be working on a plan to develop the best system and hire the best coaches in the U.S. Do that - free professional development with a clear path to professional soccer - and the players will sign on.
     
  13. billf

    billf Member+

    May 22, 2001
    Club:
    Philadelphia Union
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I imagine that the model will slowly change, but it's better to have this happen with the cooperation of the other clubs or a lot of players will slip through the net. Not every youth player or his parents are looking for a pro path. Even some Union players are still choosing college. There are a lot of players out there. Do you want to be limited to 20 or 30 per age group or 100+? It's not like clubs such as PDA and Delco have inferior coaching either. These clubs have a rich vein of experience and a large network in place that will only help. I look at this like I would look at a national team program in miniature.
     
  14. derek750

    derek750 Member+

    Apr 16, 2007
    Brooklyn
    Club:
    Philadelphia Union
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    You've expressed your point well and I understand what you're saying. There is no need to unnecessarily antagonize existing clubs.

    However, it seems to me that the Union's fundamental concern should be with creating their own developmental model in order to reach the players who are looking for a pro path - to train them in the "Union way" if you will - with resources that clubs like PDA or Delco shouldn't be able to match.

    As you imply, it will be interesting to how this changes over time. MLS youth development is clearly still in its infancy.
     
  15. soccermilitant

    soccermilitant Member+

    Jan 14, 2009
    St.paul
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    the Union shouldnt care about the other clubs. It seems to me like there trying to do it on the cheap.
     
  16. Dills

    Dills Moderator
    Staff Member

    Philadelphia Union
    United States
    Jun 6, 2006
    Southampton|PA
    Club:
    Philadelphia Union
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    And try to compete AGAINST these other clubs when trying to draw youth players?
     
  17. billf

    billf Member+

    May 22, 2001
    Club:
    Philadelphia Union
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Where do you think the Union will get it's players? I don't think there's anything cheap about this. The Union is building a network and a relationship with feeder clubs that gives them access to the top players from dozens of clubs. Not only will they have access to a larger pool of players, but they will also be able to call upon the coaches at these clubs to get more detailed information about these players than they'd get just by scouting them in a few matches.
     
  18. jaykoz3

    jaykoz3 Member+

    Dec 25, 2010
    Conshohocken, PA
    Club:
    Philadelphia Union
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Bingo, and to expand on your thoughts:

    The Union's youth academy setup is actually a great concept. Instead of having ONE set academy team, they are now able to have virtually dozens of academy teams. This will serve many purposes. The major one being player development and the available pool of players being considerably larger then that of the other MLS teams. This allows the Union to take advantage of the existing club teams in the Philadelphia area, of which there are many nationally renowned clubs. Instead of competing with these teams for players, they are now able to have access to them without upsetting the existing soccer culture in the area. not to mention we're getting players directly out of one of our rivals backyard!

    Another benefit is building the Union brand throughout PA, NJ and Delaware through their club affiliated academy system.

    This is system, if done right, will actually cost more then a traditional academy. Think about it. The Union are giving coaching clinics, soccer clinics, and scouting players all over the area. They're also not charging these club teams or the players selected to play on the Union's Academy teams for these opportunities. In the long run this concept could very well allow the Union to become a model for not only the rest of the league but US Soccer as well. Hackworth and Nowak were part of the youth development of US Soccer prior to coming to the Union, and this is something that they wanted to do with the US's youth development.
     
  19. McSoccerdad

    McSoccerdad Member

    Jun 7, 2011
    Club:
    Celtic FC
    Although the current system was pronounced as the wave of the future, in a few years if not sooner, the U will have their own wholly owned academy program. Currently, they have at least two full time coaches. R they only to coach from July - October??? They have the U-17 tourney in August and full time training in the fall, which more than half of the kids miss due to HS soccer & friendlies against other MLS programs. The players from Delco, PDA, PA Classics are all being called back to their respective clubs - three days a week practice, 1 or 2 games per weekend. The U does not play any academy games - only friendlies.

    Starting in 2012, the academy goes to a 10 month schedule with basically July and December off. The kids will not be released for the fall. Supposedly HS soccer will be out-lawed.

    It will not work to have the kids split time between their non mls clubs and the U. Does anyone really think that the non mls clubs will freely give up their respective grade A talent? PDA, Delco, Pa Classics, YMS, Penn Fushion all have full time coaches and trainers. kids = income, the better the program more kids, thus more income. ( I am not saying it is wrong - just how it is).
     
  20. Rickster

    Rickster Member

    Dec 1, 1998
    Where has this been stated? First I've heard of it.

    The tension between ambitious, established "for profit" (in quotes because some are technically non-profits) youth clubs and a MLS academy will always be there. So far, the Union's approach has been pretty savvy but as you say, it's also fairly low-impact. Is the Union planning on fielding a US Soccer Development Academy team? In that case, they would start directly competing with these other clubs (though there is talk of having a separate MLS division I think).

    The question I would have is there enough talent in the area to justify the Union trying to field their own team at the expense of its relationships with other area clubs. I can see it in Dallas and LA, where there are an abundance of pro prospects and competition from other pro teams (e.g. from Mexico) plus the weather supports year-round play. Here I see more college soccer wannabes and affluent parents.
     
  21. D-Wall

    D-Wall Member

    Nov 18, 2002
    Philly
    Club:
    Philadelphia Union
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Interesting question and I will take a stab at it. The Union will field a team for the DA Academy. They are tasked with doing so. There is plenty of talent in the Delaware Valley to justify that type of competition. FC Delco, PA Classics and PDA all have strong clubs and the affiliation with the Union is an incredible resource. But they are not going to roll over if kids have to switch full time to the Union.

    That being said, I think the Union Academy wins out in the end, because what kid will run the risk of not playing for the Union? I know it will ruffle some feathers when teams are making a run at State Cups, Regionals and Nationals in USYSA lose some of their top prospects to the Union Academy teams. I am hopeful the structure that is set up will allow kids to go back to their teams to compete in those competitions. Plus the more games the better for developing talent. But as for the DA, the Union should take precedent.

    As for the affluent parents and college soccer wannabe statement, I think that the area has plenty of talent to draw from be it rich or poor kids. We have one of the top college prospects in Andrew Wenger down at Duke who played at PA Classics and a number of former or current US Youth national teamers that have come through Eastern PA and South Jersey.

    In fact, we probably miss a lot of talent in the Mexican/African communities that are down here in the city. Starfinder is attempting to uncover some of that, and I think the Union will attempt to find some of these kids as well a la Andy Najar and provide scholarships for those players. It makes sense, but we are really in the first full year of the program and they have definitely made some strides.

    I anticipate that we will sign our second homegrown player in Christian Hernandez in the next few weeks after the season is done. There will be plenty more coming through the system that will make that leap, like Darius Miles who is another U-17 US player. That will be a strong recruiting tool for the Union to attract players.

    I still think they should sign an affiliation with Baltimore Casa Mia Bays. That would be the top 4 Clubs in the immediate area that can be funneled through our system.
     
  22. billf

    billf Member+

    May 22, 2001
    Club:
    Philadelphia Union
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Academy teams only compete in the Academy league now. The academy league teams at Delco and PDA can not play in the USYSA national championship at U-16 or U-18 anymore as I understand it. If those clubs decide to stop fielding DA teams or MLS teams get bumped to a different classification in that league, which I think would be a bit awkward given the size of the country and the small number of MLS teams, then I don't see much conflict between the affiliates and the Union. If the U are suddenly competing in the same DA region as PDA and Delco, then that's where the conflicts and competition for players arise.
     
  23. slitz

    slitz Member+

    Feb 19, 2005
    Red City, 140
    Club:
    Philadelphia Union
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
  24. Rickster

    Rickster Member

    Dec 1, 1998
    It would be great for that to happen. Starfinder is doing good work but I think their mission is to help a broader number of kids with life via soccer, not to unearth future star soccer players (so it would be a wonderful byproduct if if happened occasionally).

    I also think ODP and the FC Delcos and PA Classics miss out on some kids with the potential to be excellent soccer players but who haven't wanted to devote themselves exclusively to soccer or may be resource-constrained). Having the Union involved may provide an extra motivator for those kids.
     
  25. soccermilitant

    soccermilitant Member+

    Jan 14, 2009
    St.paul
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    The who9le point is for the union to develop players to there style and get then into the pro club. What the union is doing is basically having other teams develop talent then take the credit when they sign to the pro club. Club nuetral is great for u-16 and lower .
     

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